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thats the vibe you get everywhere. people make it blatantly obvious too. like I want junkrat old bomb radius but am willing to lose the two mine charges for it and have just one.
BOTH need a global nerf.
Power creep and supporting are off the charts in this game now. reducing power creep alone will make everything unkillable due to how much healing we have in the game.
The only reason people die is that everything gets erased so fast that healers just don’t have enough time to heal. Remove the damage part, and the healing will keep things alive forever.
powercreep started with supports overshadowing sustained dps
Power creep isn’t something you can nerf or buff.
Power creep happens when they keep trying to buff the solution rather than nerfing the problem (IE. in an AU where Pharah is OP they buff McCree, Soldier and Ashe rather than nerf Pharah.) They did it with dive, they did it with Goats and they did it again with double shield. Its Blizzards busted balancing philosophy that combined with never flat reverting or trying to ignore the fact its a revert like Mercy talk 60hps or armor 5dmg reduction makes them look very immature, unprofessional and inexperienced even though we know they’re not.
Dropping by with a fun fact!
Looking at GM players for the current patch (1.43), Genji and Soldier: 76 are #6 and #7 in terms of win rate for damage heroes (out of 16 total).
They’re not doing quite as poorly as the general community sentiment would imply. Game balance perceptions/opinions are often repeated and perpetuated enough that they start to become accepted as fact by many players.
We also should remember that things like win rates and hero power/effectiveness can fluctuate significantly depending on the players’ skill level. If someone complains that Reaper is too strong and another says that Reaper is too weak, they could both be correct for their current skill level.
When making balance changes we typically look at the high end potential of player skill for a hero but also try to keep in mind if a given change would be a significant detriment to the overall gameplay experience in lower skill brackets and attempt to find better solution if so.
I think in general being wary of extreme “power creep” is a valid and healthy concern if it’s causing gameplay to become too wildly distorted from the core experience. I don’t feel that we’re currently anywhere close to that with the live game.
Thank you guys so much for communicating with us
This is how I usually see it (as a 3800 player myself). Balance should be balanced around pros and high-end gameplay, BUT low ranks like you mentioned should be kept in mind. Reaper 50% life steal is a prime example of this, in which it caused an apocalypse to happen in low ranks, yet it was intended to help high ranks.
Tho I DO think it would help if heroes got reworked to where they are viable in high ranks yet they do not dominate low ranks at the same time. Right this includes heroes like Junkrat, Moira, and Bastion. Those heroes struggle a lot at the high tiers, but the problem with buffing them straightly is the imbalance it causes in low tiers. So I honestly think in situations like these, a power shift would help them (raising skill floor but raising reward) as someone who plays them quite a bit.
I do have a question tho: do you guys consider Soldier/Genji to be balanced right now, or do you think they are slightly weak?
That’s nice but can y’all nerf doomfist?
snuggles up to josh
I love when you give us info like this, even though it doesn’t paint a whole picture or give us to much info (cause of exploitable reasons), because you guys have the whole picture of stats, but can tease us with things that expand our train of thought.
Please do more of this, but I also understand how hyperbolic some people can be and why it’s not a reg thing.
I have a question about the pickrates what would you consider a balanced and healthy pickrate for each class, or at least for soldier and genji additionally what place are soldier and genji in terms of pickrate in gm?
Thanks for the responses, I feel like if players had access to the overall win rates and other stats in Competitive Play they could get a better understanding on what changes might be needed.
THANK YOU for balancing the proper way. This is relieving to know.
(Thoughts on Symmetra?)
What about winrates vs pickrates? Do you guys see a hero is balanced if their winrate is high even though their pickrate is abysmal (i.e Sym, Torb, Soldier)?
I feel like that’s likely due to the abysmal pickrate for those heroes, making the only ones still playing them the nutty one tricks who can win with them despite how bad they are.
Is this true for Widowmaker and Hanzo as well? If so, can we expect them to be toned down eventually? Playing versus a sniper every match has been dreadful, I really enjoy high mobility heroes, and the caliber of snipers I play versus just deny me that fun in most matches I play, so I’m forced onto a barrier tank or Brigitte/Baptiste
Are these raw winrates or pickrate adjusted? Genji and especially Soldier have abysmal pickrates in GM. That means they are only picked in niche situations where they shine or by people who are REALLY good with them. People not so good with them flock to meta heroes so they don’t pull down the winrates. As such winrates of heroes with low pickrates don’t reflect their actual power level. Popular heroes on the contrary have misleading lower winrates as people picking fotm heroes pull the winrates down and also popular picks play against mirror picks where one has to lose, making the winrate gravitate towards 50%.
And this is your biggest mistake of them all. You’re comparing things statistically and analytically instead of being the people who PLAY the game and understand it, or at least consulting with players who do.
Yes. Genji might be the best winrate of all time for all we care about. But what your analytics are failing to make you realize is that only genji specialists and soldier specialists are the ones who still play those heroes while the majority of the playerbase gave up on them. You’re basically comparing winrates of players like necros for genji with the average of other dps players of that rank.
Here’s my suggestion and i hope someone takes their time to consider it.
Seek help. From professional and high end players. They can help. THEY WILL HELP. Even for free.
And what is their pickrate. Is there even enough people playing them to care?
All the devs play the game, like a lot, and the dev team is made up of players from every rank.
They also consult pro players and the general playerbase on Reddit and the forums.
So if this isn’t enough for you, which is a valid opinion if that’s what you want to stick with, then who should the devs consult in addition to everything else?
they claim they play the game. which i’m not sure if they do or don’t.
They CLAIM they consult pro players. While every pro player who commented about this sort of thing either says blizzard doesn’t listen to them, or says that blizzard had a conference like thing with professional to consult with them about balancing, and it’s been a long time since they responded or even bothered to check that. which results in anything i’m hearing pointing towards what i’m saying.
Plus, i’m seeing the balancing changes, and i’m seeing what blizzard’s doing and it’s not possible to imagine professional players had a say in most of these cases. They’re doing it on their own.
You can believe whatever you want to believe. But they’re not listening to anyone.