In-depth "Tank on E" rework for Bastion

I’ll start out with a note to clear up any confusion. I would much rather the Sentry mode changes from Bastion’s first rework be reverted (Revert spread, revert no headshots, remove Ironclad) than to have him reworked. However, if a rework is inevitable (many other f-tier heroes have been getting reworks lately), I would like to push for this rework, or at least a version of it. I am not calling for a rework, I am just providing one for Blizzard to (hopefully) see before deciding on any changes to Bastion. Assuming they do plan on changing him that is.

I’ve got a list of reworks in another thread, but I wanted to give Tank on E it’s own thread because that’s the one that I’ve (We’ve I guess, this is a combination of many ideas and feedback) done the most work on. Please note that since it’s impossible to test these changes, it’s basically impossible to know how strong an ability will be in this rework, this is why I’ve provided a few balancing nerfs afterwards in case it is too powerful. We don’t want Bastion to be the best hero in the game, we only want him to be viable and make him more skill-based than he currently is.

Edit: Oh right, and give tank a golden gun please. And also his repair arm, that would be nice too.


  • General changes
    • Being stunned during a transformation now instantly completes the transformation
  • Configuration Recon
    • Reload time reduced to 1.5 seconds (Formerly 2 seconds)
  • Configuration Sentry
    • Headshots added
    • Bloom added to weapon
      • Initial accuracy of 1.25°, bloom starts after 0.3 seconds of continuous fire
      • Reaches a maximum of 2° after 0.3 seconds of additional continuous fire
    • Ammo reduced to 250
    • Reload time increased to 2.5 seconds (Formerly 2 seconds)
  • Configuration Tank (E Ability)
    • Damage reduced to 120 (Formerly 205)
      • Splash damage now ranges from 40 - 85 damage (Formerly 70 - 145)
    • Splash radius reduced to 2 meters (Formerly 4 meters)
    • Tank tread sounds reduced
    • 3 shots per clip
    • Ammo reloads over time similar to Doomfist’s gun
      • Shot timer and reload timer are independent, meaning he can reload shots even while shooting. This gives an effective 5 shots to begin with, and then one shot every 2 seconds afterwards.
    • Ammo reloads at 1 shell per 2 seconds
    • No self damage
    • Transformation time reduced to 1 second (Formerly 1.5 seconds)
  • Ironclad (Passive)
    • Persistent Ironclad is removed from all modes (Sentry and Tank)
    • Ironclad is now bound to Self-repair
    • Ironclad can now be activated even in Recon mode
  • Self-repair
    • No longer consumes resources when it does not heal Bastion
    • Starts healing instantly instead of having an 0.5 second delay
    • Applies 25% Ironclad for duration of repair
  • Overclock (Ultimate Ability)
    • Adds 150 armor to all forms
      • Alternatively, gives passive 35% Ironclad in Sentry/Tank, and 20% Ironclad in Recon. These are not bound to repair, they are passive.
    • Instantly reloads all ammo for all forms
    • Reduces transformation time by half
    • Lasts 8 seconds
  • Overclock (Recon mode)
    • Increases movement by 18% (From 5.5 m/s to 6.5 m/s)
    • Increases rate of fire by 50% (From 8 r/s to 12 r/s)
    • Reduce reload speed by 50% (From 1.5 s to 1 s)
  • Overclock (Sentry mode)
    • Grants CC immunity
    • Increases rate of fire by 16% to (From 30 r/s to 35 r/s)
  • Overclock (Tank mode)
    • Recharge rate decreased to 1 second (Normally 2 seconds)
    • Increase direct hit damage to 205
    • Reverts splash damage and radius to their current values

Edits

  • Corrected Overclock (Recon) rate of fire
  • Changed Sentry’s spread to be slightly larger, and bloom slightly quicker
    • I didn’t know what 0.75° would actually look like, but it appears that Hammond’s spread starts at 1.25° and maxes at 2°, so I used those values instead because they look reasonable in-game. Changed the bloom values so that he reaches maximum spread in 0.8 0.6 seconds instead of 1 0.8 seconds.
  • Removed falloff for Tank mode to match Mei’s projectile
  • Changed some wording to make it more clear and some aspects with suggestions from BliztDreams
  • Removed 1.5x headshot multiplier. Probably better to start at 2x, and nerf it if need be. Easier to start a little strong and nerf than to start weak and buff…
  • Reduced Sentry mode ammo to 250

Notes / Comments

General Changes

This is more of a consistency change. As he is now, Bastion will instantly transform to Tank mode when stunned, hooked, frozen, etc. This change applies that concept to all transformations. Bastion will still remained stunned for the normal duration (in alignment with the recent McCree changes that keeps Bastion stunned when transforming to Tank mode), but stuns will no longer stop his transformation progress… Abilities that take him out of Sentry mode (Roadhog’s hook, Reinhardt’s charge, Ana’s sleepdart) will still take him out of Sentry mode, but if he was transforming to Tank mode at the time of being hit by these abilities, he will be placed into Tank mode instead of Recon mode.

Configuration Recon

This change is to help persuade people to use Recon more often. Sentry mode should still be Bastion’s main focus, but at the moment, Recon and Sentry have the same reload time, which is kind of strange in my mind. This change is not really needed at all, as Recon is just fine as it is, I just thought I’d include it.

Configuration Sentry

A weaker version of headshots were added to reward players for good aim and tracking.

Bloom was added back to give players the chance to actually have good aim and tracking. With his current spread, headshots would be almost useless because they would be very dependent on RNG to actually hit. I don’t have actual numbers from what his spread was before his rework, but I think this is fairly close, though a slight nerf from what it was then. I haven’t been able to play that version in almost a year and a half, but I believe that his accuracy was pinpoint to start off, and then it increased to 2° over the course of a second or so (I know that the maximum was 2°, I don’t know what the initial value was or the time it took to reach maximum).

The ammo reduction and reload time are to try and limit Sentry mode’s use a bit, as well as compensate for his new potential damage values. This should also help limit his usefulness in lower ranks, as it gives the player less ammo, and requires better aim to do damage. It has an overall better damage output, but limits the time spent shooting by a fair amount, and should raise the skill floor a bit.

For those curious, his new damage output would be 450 DPS for non-critical shots, 675 DPS for all critical shots, and he can shoot for 6⅔ seconds continuously.

Configuration Tank

Tank mode is now an E ability instead of an ultimate. It’s damage has been reduced to 120 damage to match other explosives in the game, and it has been given a limit on how many shots it has per ‘clip’. Since it reloads like Doomfist’s gun, Bastion can only shoot 4 times before having to wait (3 shots in the clip, 1 will recharge halfway through the clip). This mode was meant more for rocket jumping than for damage, but it does also provide pretty good burst damage. The idea with the maximum range was to prevent it from becoming too much of a sniper like Mei’s projectiles were before they got falloff. Tank mode isn’t meant to be a sniper, it’s meant for closer range burst and mobility with mobility being it’s intended primary use. This is also why self-damage was removed.

Ironclad

Ironclad would probably be too strong as a passive with this rework, so it’s been removed from Sentry and Tank modes, and is now only applied while healing. This gives Bastion 4 seconds of 20% damage reduction every 7 seconds, and during this time, he cannot shoot. This more closely resembles Roadhog’s take a breather, but it’s on a resource instead of being on a cooldown. Since it’s only a 20% resistance instead of the 50% that Roadhog has, I feel this is balanced. Especially since it’s just a passive ability at the moment.

Self-repair

These changes are to allow Bastion to be a little more flexible when using self-repair. The resource consumption change shouldn’t do too much except prevent him from wasting his meter when hit by an Ana grenade or he’s at full health. The delay change allows him react more quickly to incoming damage.

Overclock

Bastion’s new ultimate is somewhat similar to Valkyrie in some ways. It buffs various parts of his kit in different ways. The idea behind it was to allow the player to use Bastion’s ult however they felt would be the best in the current scenario. It also fits very nicely into Bastion’s “adaptability” playstyle. Since it cuts transformation times in half, the player can use many different modes during his ult without wasting half of the ult transforming. He shouldn’t be penalized for wanting to transform during his ult, and this way, it can keep the ultimate rather short but allow him more freedom.

Overclock (Recon)

Overclock in Recon mode allows Bastion to move faster, shoot faster, and reload faster. This mode was hard to make an overclock mode for, and I’m not extremely happy with the results, perhaps this one could use a bit of tweaking.

Overclock (Sentry)

Overclock in Sentry mode makes Bastion much more fortified and give him a bit more damage potential. The ammo increase it to slightly compensate for the rate of fire increase. With this configuration, he can shoot for 7.14 seconds before running out of ammo. He can’t shoot for the entire 8 seconds, but it’s fairly close.

Overclock (Tank)

Overclock in Tank mode basically restores it to what his ultimate is now. It gives back the damage, removes the range restriction, and increases the recharge rate to give an effective infinite ammo like he has now.


Some balance nerfs

Configuration Recon

This change is somewhat unnecessary to begin with, removing it would be just fine.

Configuration Sentry

If Blizzard feels that Bastion is too strong against squishy targets while in Sentry mode, then perhaps slightly reducing his base damage could be a good solution.

  • Configuration Sentry
    • Damage reduced to 12 (Formerly 15)
    • Deals 25% bonus damage to barriers
    • Headshots added
    • Bloom added to weapon
      • Initial accuracy of 1.25°, bloom starts after 0.3 seconds of continuous fire
      • Reaches a maximum of 2° after 0.3 seconds of additional continuous fire
    • Ammo reduced to 250
    • Reload time increased to 2.5 seconds (Formerly 2 seconds)

This keeps his barrier busting capabilities in tact, while giving him a lower DPS against enemy players. This should feel better than simply increasing his spread because his damage wouldn’t feel as inconsistent.

I wouldn’t really like to see this next change, but if Sentry is just too overbearing, perhaps removing the ability to reload could be an option.

  • Configuration Sentry
    • Headshots added
    • Bloom added to weapon
      • Initial accuracy of 1.25°, bloom starts after 0.3 seconds of continuous fire
      • Reaches a maximum of 2° after 0.3 seconds of additional continuous fire
    • Ammo reduced to 250
    • Weapon reload removed. To get more ammo, the player must swap modes for a few seconds.

Again, I don’t like this method of controlling Sentry as much as simply increasing the reload time, but it’s an option that doesn’t strictly limit Sentry with something like a timer or a cooldown. The player still has control of how long they stay in Sentry mode.

Configuration Tank

If the 120 damage on such a fast projectile becomes an issue, perhaps reducing the damage by a slight bit would be in order. 90 damage would allow him to 2-shot Tracer, and 3-shot heroes up to 250 HP. I think if this were to be the case, then he would not need a damage falloff however, as he doesn’t do very much damage to begin with. I would prefer not to mess with the projectile speed, because then the player would have to remember 2 different muscle memories for leading during his ult, and in the normal Tank mode. Assuming that the ultimate is still kept as the same Tank mode we have now.

Self-repair

If the “can use repair infinitely” (Since it does not use resources when it is not healing) and “provides Ironclad” thing become a bit too hard to deal with when, say, an Ana grenade is used on a Bastion, the Ironclad could be reduced/removed when Bastion isn’t healing.

Note: This isn’t the only thing they could do, obviously… This is just what I’ve come up with that might be an issue, and potential fixes for it.


Links

Bastion megathread (soon to be replaced, almost full) :

Replacement megathread :

List of proposed reworks :

My thoughts on Bastion’s issues :

Another Tank on E thread :

11 Likes
Bastion 3.0 (Tank Mode is Now a Secondary Ability)
Do people actually want Bastion viable?
Can we buff Bastion plz?
So, when Bastion is inventively reworked
Bastion Rework Discussions
Why Don't People Want Bastion Viable? :thinking:
PSA: Hammond can transform faster than Bastion
Does bastion need rework (?)
:broken_heart: Bastion ISN’T being forgotten, he’s being ignored
Bastion thread: The recent hitscan changes are good but
Bastion thread: The recent hitscan changes are good but
Which hero actually needs a rework in your opinion and why?
You're a Blizz dev for a day
In-depth "Barrier on E" rework for Bastion
Should Bastion be able to exit tank form?
:broken_heart: Bastion ISN’T being forgotten, he’s being ignored
Bastion E ability Concepts
Raising Bastion's skill floor and skill ceiling
500 days since Bastion's nerf
What Happened To Bastion
:broken_heart: Bastion ISN’T being forgotten, he’s being ignored
:broken_heart: Bastion ISN’T being forgotten, he’s being ignored
Bastion should be reworked, not buffed
Post your dream patch notes here!
Do people actually want Bastion viable?
Do people actually want Bastion viable?
Do people actually want Bastion viable?
:broken_heart: Bastion ISN’T being forgotten, he’s being ignored
:broken_heart: Bastion ISN’T being forgotten, he’s being ignored
Why Does Bastion Only Have 2 Configurations?
:stop_sign: Bastion is being forgotten (370+ likes, 5000 responses)
Do people actually want Bastion viable?
:stop_sign: Bastion is being forgotten (370+ likes, 5000 responses)
:stop_sign: Bastion is being forgotten (370+ likes, 5000 responses)
Do people actually want Bastion viable?
Do people actually want Bastion viable?
Bastion is usually the least picked hero in the higher tiers of competitive
Do people actually want Bastion viable?
:stop_sign: Bastion is being forgotten (370+ likes, 5000 responses)
:broken_heart: Bastion ISN’T being forgotten, he’s being ignored
Since Blizzard Just Ignores Bastion
:warning:[Long Post] Heroes Problems and Ways to Fix Them
:stop_sign: Bastion is being forgotten (370+ likes, 5000 responses)
How to fix Bastion
:broken_heart: Bastion ISN’T being forgotten, he’s being ignored
[Suggestion] Possible Bastion Rework
Bastion is the epitome of balance
Bastion simple fix
Your main's ultimate is now on E
🤖 Bastion: Simplified Astro changes

How long do we want this… 1,5 years it is? Or at least some other kind of change to the worst character of OW…

I’d kinda agree with the ammo part… if it really needs a nerf. I don’t think it does though.
The reload part though, i find horrible. 2 sec is long enough :confused:

Needs to be reverted when he’s ulting.

I’d argue for 5. Better flow.
Also way to low ammo pool if it only does 120 dmg anyway.
That’d make it only useable for rocket jumping

Mention that it reloads also when in other modes.

If IC is bound to Repair, you need to buff it :confused:

Already is, going by what you’re suggesting above. (when healing, that is)

That’s gonna mess up the animations. (0.5 sec transform)

I know you’re going by “old tank ult” standards, but that might be a bit short. Better start strong and slowly nerf.

Give a percentage so people understand it more easely.

1 Like

That “GrantMan replying” is scary as hell.

1 Like

I think 15 damage * 30 rounds per second with good accuracy might be a bit too good with 300 rounds… and yeah, maybe the 2.5 seconds might be a bit much, especially with only 200 rounds… maybe if it were 250-300 that would be reasonable…

Yeah, those are reverted during ult… I guess I should mention the splash radius, I think the splash damage should be somewhat obvious, because the base damage is increasing… I only really put it there so people would know the new values.

He can shoot 5 shots to begin with because of his new “reload” times, and then one every 2 seconds after that.

I thought the reloading in different modes would be kinda obvious too, all other guns in the game do that already, Bastion included :confused:

Maybe… I don’t want him surviving things he shouldn’t though… perhaps 25% might be slightly better.

The Ironclad during ult would be a passive, not just on repair… and I’d kinda rather have armor anyway, makes more sense…

Yeah, maybe just setting them all to 0.5 would be better…

I think 8 seconds would be long enough, maybe 10 would be okay to start with… Yeah, it’s easier to see when something is a tad bit too strong rather than when it could do with a slight buff…

I guess I could do percentages… I mean, it’s increased by 1 m/s…

So many words needed typing…

Now let’s see things this way:
Tank on E is aimed to enourage Bastion to switch modes. (limited shells on tank, longer sentry reload) so make sentry’s reload longer, but it HAS to have firepower. Lots of it. It’s a god damm minigun. 300 rounds, 2.5 sec reload. (you can be killed 10 times in 2.5 sec… so you better switch mode anyway)

Assuming you’re talking about tank. 5 shots in the mag (you said 3 in the OP), 1 shell per sec fire rate than 2 sec reload time per shell… wait
You mean he reload shells when firing ? Nevermind then. But you gotta mention it as one could think he starts reloading after not firing for a delay (you mentioned DF)

Details, my friend. But important ones. One should not be able to misunderstand.
You cannot argue when you do not agree on the meaning of words.

That and the “reworked” bastion would encourage switching, which takes time away from your ult. (I’ll take for exemple torb’s molten core.)

Accessibility.

1 Like

I’m not entirely sure what you’re saying with this one…? Are you wanting 300 rounds, 2.5 seconds?

Yeah, his shot timer and reload timer are independent… I didn’t know Doomfist didn’t work this way until recently, I thought his timers were independent too… I’ll change that.

Yeah, that’s fair too… I need to reword a quite few things.

Yes.
I want to encourage Bastion players to often change configurations, giving each its clear “goal”: Sentry trades mobility for high sustain dmg, Recon is the accurate long-range middleground between the 2 others and Tank is the mobile burst dmg.

You did not cite anything else. May I take it for an agreement on said uncited points ?

1 Like

Yeah, forgot to put your name in the change log… Didn’t want to put it next to every change for somewhat obvious reasons :stuck_out_tongue:

No problem. I wasnt’ really talking about it.
(Can’t even remember what exactly i was talking about… following to many threads at once.)

So I just sent a link to my friend who’s a Rein main to see what he thought about the changes we’re proposing. For some reason he cannot post on the forums (parental control or something, even though he’s 21). StratOFerus, if you’re reading…

Said he really likes the changes though and he misses seeing more Bastions.

I’m happy.

Edit: my english is brokener than usual, it seems.

1 Like

I feel like the “bastion is being forgotten” thread served it’s purpose now.
Should we post a link there to this thread (which will arguably be the new megathread) ?
Could be best to leave the old one for brainstorming ideas and have this one to discuss tank on E further.

I think we’re going to make a new megathread, and just link this thread to that one… I think a megathread that addresses his issues would probably be better than just a rework idea…

Having said ideas doesn’t hurt either. We do know his issues and already are proposing a solution.

I like these ideas personally. Being able to switch configurations based on the needs of the team would be super fun.

1 Like

We have Santa with us!

1 Like

No, it’s the fish from American Dad

So, now that I removed this parental control, I’ll say what I wanted to say : As a tank main (specifically a Rein main), I started to think that Brigitte was the new counter to Reinhardt instead of what was designed to be a tank buster (a.k.a Bastion). It would be nice to watch the table turning once more.

3 Likes

Absolutely… Bastion counters Brigitte somewhat well at the moment, but give him better accuracy so that his shots actually hit her barrier, and he’ll be a really good counter. Something that people have been asking for since her release. And even with an accuracy boost, he doesn’t counter Rein anymore than he does now… well, Rein’s barrier anyway. He becomes a fair bit better at not being pinned.

Remember when you could burst down a Rein before he could finish his charge animation ?
Those were the good days

1 Like