[✅] Abbreviated Tank Changes

General Discussion
1

Here are the specific changes with justification below:

Basic goals are to make it so:

  1. SingleBarrier is preferred over DoubleBarrier.
  2. Tanks are more desirable to play, to fix Queue Times
    • Especially to DPS players who make up the majority of the player population.
  3. DoubleOffTank is less of a “Throw Comp”.

The general approach to all that is:

  • Nerf AnchorTank self-defenses at close range
  • Buff AnchorTank projectile speed (I.e. Useless at close range)
  • Buff AnchorTank barriers to Rein tier (I.e. Useless at close range)
  • Buff OffTank teammate protection (useful at close range)
  • Buff OffTank self sustain (useful at close range)

The main distinction between Tanks wouldn’t be firepower:

AnchorTank OtherTanks
Strength: Medium/Long Range Close Range
Weakness: Close Range Medium/Long Range
Firepower: Similar Similar
6 Likes
2

Well, my only concern about this is if Rein should also be weak in close range, because his M1 is a close range attack. Wouldn’t this force him use his barrier way more than participate in battles?

1 Like
3

Yeah, but that’s why he gets a stronger barrier and a FireStrike that’s harder to avoid.

And usually outside of pointblank fights with a Reaper jamming a shotgun down your throat, a Barrier is almost as good as HP.

2 Likes
4

But overall do you think this would be positive for his gameplay? Like holding barrier more often would be more appealing?

5

I think Rein has a gigantic pickrate for the overall playerbase (roughly 1/3rd of all Tank picks), and he’d better at close range brawls than Orisa or Sigma, and the whole meta would be tilted to favor close range brawls.

So Rein would probably enjoy a strong pickrate at almost any skill tier.

Possibly being outshined by Dive for Masters and above.

6

am I missing something because this just reads like buffs to all tanks and especially Orisa/Sigma

1 Like
7

Well, for Sigma and Orisa they’d be having some huge weaknesses at close range. (I.e. 30% more damage on armor from rapidfire/shotguns, weaker fortify, no lasting cc on halt/accretion, no tempHP on grasp).

It’s acknowledging that DoubleBarrier is always going to be the strongest composition at medium/long range, but it could have a big weakness at close range that makes it prohibitive to play.

As for Tanks overall,
I think the Tank class as a whole is unpopular. And they should buff Tanks to the point they are at least as popular as Healers.

Since fixing queue times is more important than almost any other issue in this game.

And also it’s impossible to have 3-4 Tanks on a team with 2-2-2. So there’s no reason to balance to protect against that.

Any amount of players who leave because they’d be unhappy about this sort of change is tiny compared to those that will leave because of bad queue times.
Especially those who will return because of OW2, but then leave because of bad queue times.

2 Likes
8

And what do you think would be the meta after these changes?
How would be the tier list?

9

Pro/GM/Masters would be Dive, with some variation of specific maps.

Plat/Gold would probably be Rein/Zarya. But almost any AnchorTank with a decent offtank won’t get complaints.

Silver/Bronze would probably be D.va/Roadhog.

10

I don’t really like the Zarya changes, i feel like she’s the most balanced off-tank.

11

Well I am kinda taking the whole Tank balance and shaking it around like a snow globe. So really don’t know exactly where things would land balance-wise.

Mostly the idea I was going for was making it so that Tanks that aren’t AnchorTanks are better at Peel, and CloseRange brawls.

That said, Rein/Zarya is getting indirectly nerfed by making Rein more vulnerable to shotguns/rapidfire, and also removing the possibility of Reaper/Mei with 2Tanks.

12

I don’t know, Zarya’s not really “CloseRange.”

She has a 15m beam, which is pretty long.

And she can do 170DPS with it… so, if you were buffing that, i’d nerf her range to like 11m or even 10m like D.Va.

13

I mean I am getting to get people to play offtanks more. So would seem kinda weird to nerf offtanks.

That said, D.va/Hammond/Tracer/Sombra would be doing 30% more damage to Armor. And generally huge benefits to Dive in general.

Don’t think D.va would really struggle to be relevant in this meta at all.

She’d probably be back to top tier.

14

I think this should come to live, but it would need to pick up popularity.

The over-all damage changes, and armor changes are great.

15

Yup, made armor weaker, but in trade DiveTanks get more armor.

And as a benefit, all damage above 25 per bullet do less damage than they currently do against armor.

Widow headshot would only do 240 damage, instead of 295.

1 Like
16

i do think roadhog should just be getting the experimental changes to the live game but your change is better than what we have now

17

Anti Heal is the bane of Roadhog’s existence.

And also a huge barrier towards the viability of DoubleOffTank compositions.

Was also thinking of ways to reduce UltCharge feeding for all Tanks, but that probably requires more thought.

1 Like
18

that is a very good point, i would be happy with either changes, a decent anti nade can make your life difficult as hog and usually can easily end your life

19

That’s why my concern was about making Rein hold barrier more often while turning around to not be shot at, instead of participating on the fight, unless you give him more armor to balance it out a bit, idk.

20

I figure Rein is part of the problem though. Since Rein/Sigma or Rein/Orisa, is just as bad as Orisa/Sigma.

But honestly, as long as Dive doesn’t become the meta for Plat/Gold, Rein is still probably gonna be the best AnchorTank still.

And I really doubt that’s gonna happen.

Rein might be weaker, but he’s still gonna be the best AnchorTank in a close range brawl.

Also the could stand to lose a few percentage points on pickrate at average skill tiers regardless.

Or as Scott Mercer put it,
“Even within RoleQueue, Tank Queue shouldn’t be the Reinhardt Queue”

And right now, one Third of all Tank play time, is Reinhardt.

And Tanks are horribly unpopular…