Brigitte will be F Tier at this rate

Karasumori-11554 · July 12, 2018, 12:45pm

Oh yes, spam! And quite popular spam at that. The cause enjoys seizing opportunities like this to rise above the nonsense and create awareness regarding in-game balance problems! We ask users to educate themselves on topics before creating chaos, as a Symmetra main yourself, I’m sure you hate chaotic nonsense like your thread! So without further ado, we invite the users of battle-net to enjoy enlightenment and serenity, Brigitte edition!

Brigitte's shieldhealth should be lowered. It is what makes her dominate everyone 1v1

Brigitte's shieldhealth should be lowered. It is what makes her dominate everyone 1v1

Nah that’s dumb. She isn’t that out of line, and even reducing her shield down to 400 would require a solid buff to another aspect of her kit.

No, she is by herself, a full on anti-flanking monster. There needs to be a compromise. She needs to be an anti-flank assist. I have invested so much time into getting good at Tracer and other flankers but suddenly a hero is introduced that doesn’t take a player with anything more than three fingers and one arm to counter high skill heroes who people have invested a lot of time into.

Before Brig, Tracer could be countered with commutation and heroes like Zen, Cree, Reaper, Doom, and even Soldier who all took equal skill to shut down a Tracer. Now we have Brig who people can just pick up and counter enemies immediately. How boring.

Here is how you fix the stupid IKEA knight, with a brig fat nerf.

Shield health reduced to 200 HP

Shield bash stun now replaced with a boop that knocks enemies back and does 70 damage, formerly 50 damage. (Now if the Brig has enough skill, she can land her rocket flail on the booped enemy leaving them crippled, flying backward, and retreating instead of 1-shot-comboing them. IT’S FINALLY FUN! and SKILLFUL!)

Inspire healing (the one with the mace flails) now only heals Brigitte if she has not taken damage for 1 second. Inspire healing reduced from 16 healing/second to 10 healing/second.

Oh my god, she is perfect now and still viable. Rather than completely shutting down Tracer and flankers on her own, she can properly assist anti-flank allies in fending them off by using her shield, armor packs, and mace. Brigitte can no longer 1 shot combo enemies now and is far less annoying to deal with.

The game needs dynamics brought back to it, there are so few fun options on what to play now. It’s always a Brig and grav dragon. Give us more and don’t ruin the game for heroes that take skill by adding some OP ones that take none. That’s all I want, I just want to enjoy Overwatch again, and I don’t want to end up quitting to go play some boring Royalle shooter or some typical COD/Siege-like shooter. But people ARE quitting, regional top 500’s and pros ARE quitting because this game is just annoying to play. It’s going to take less than some dev making a better game with the ideas of Overwatch to completely shut this game down. I’m getting close to finishing my CS degree and I’m considering to start planning one myself (I would rather apply that energy to work towards completely rebalancing/reworking Overwatch’s sandbox in my spare time, but I don’t think the devs would even bat an eye at it), I am just getting so annoyed at this game. The same thing happened with WOW, people got too angry about the balancing on that game, that Blizzard completely pulled out of their own forums and other community forums, OW is getting to the point of annoyance and the community is getting to the point of anger that the same is imminent to happen here soon.

Another Brigitte discussion post

Lets see…

Brigitte is made as another counter against infamous dive meta. But she is nerfed a little and dive actually had some breath until Hanzo was reworked maybe. But still she is the most significant counter of dive.

And some others too. I wont deny that and see what needs fix. And this doesnt include who counters her. More of what brig does that people hate maybe.

The bash combo: After few days of brainstorming I think this is the hardest thing to fix. First thing is, she is no Moira. She doesnt “choose” to fight or run a flanker. She is just made to bash their soul out if they come near. She needs the DPS.

Now what I think is, blizzard actually nerfed the shield bash just enough for mobile heros to have more room. The size reduce, the 6 second CD. All made her from a uncontrollable monster to somewhat avoidable monster.

Now I see some people dont understand that, but the reason is, this skill is now less painful to mobile heros. But powerful against non mobile low hp heros. Mobile heros can keep at least distance but non mobile ones like Ana will be in big trouble once the fight gets intense and somehow she approaches you. (Could be sym, Lucio, small area, flanking)

However, fixing isnt easy, some people say reduce damage, increase CD, but she is already near margin of being a useless counter. The lowest of this margin is 7 seconds because Roadhog hook CD is 8. Who is pretty useless against Tracer even with potential 900 hp.
Damage? Of course 150. Nothing else makes Tracer scared except being oneshot. Only reason she feels uneasy fighting Mei and Hanzo.

I even suggested bash should not stun but immobilize, but that does keep her power againt dive but also still makes her strong against squishys. But I still think this is the best option available cause some of them will counter with skills. And Reinhardt doesnt get stunned this way.

Another option is removing Bash itself. And give her a hit -whipshot 150 combo. This means Tracers will recall or blink once they get hit, or will be whip cream. But I am not sure this will work since blink is 3 second CD.

Armor pack: one of the best skill she has. Wide area heal? Mostly useless. Armor pack also counters Dive pretty hard. If they try to kill a support then brigitte just throws it and they have to run. I see this skill the only reason that makes her support. Since now dps Sym can use ult barriers. I do think this skill is maybe overly easy. Devs could have made it a skill that needs aim. It doesnt need that much since it is used at close range most.

Tanking: her tanking or shield is the least needed part for fighting dive, but also is pretty useful. Because shields dont take additional damage by “Discord orb” and dive kinda discords anybody and melt them with multi heros dps.
I think if shield bash didnt require a shield, her shield would have been 300. But devs must have tested that and see her lose bash too often. But 600 is also pretty overkill since the dps she needs to guard against dive is mostly Tracer or Dva missles. Winston doesnt even hit shields.

Her skills are pretty good for countering dive and hard to fix is what I feel. And I thinks actually devs will just let it go. They are busy fixing Hammond anyway. But maybe will need something in near future.

I think the game has been going downhill for too long, and I feel like blizzard doesn’t give back to the community enough as they should.

This is my opinion, be warned.

LFG and endorsements

LFG and endorsements were supposed to fix/help the game, and they did not at all. Giving exp to people for endorsing is going to make them only do it for exp and not care at all about how well anyone did, and LFG is pointless if the game still punishes you for grouping up rather than solo queuing. It just makes games harder.

It took them literal years to implement these two simple changes and apparently they’re “big” ones as well. I’m not an expert on game design, okay, but I don’t think it would be that hard to make the LFG system as you already have custom game browser set up very similarly, all there is to do is make minor tweaks to it, and endorsements are just a couple button presses and something to spice up your profile.

Big updates like those should have an impact, and should actually take a lot of effort to make.

New heroes/balancing/the ‘OP’ problem

I haven’t cared AT ALL about any of the new heroes that have come out since Ana. If you’re going to add new heroes, wait until you actually balance your game with the present heroes in it. Otherwise, it will create chaos.

It took them MONTHS UPON MONTHS to change mercy from her CRAZILY OVERPOWERED STATE to a still very powerful character, so powerful in fact that she’s STILL a must pick, and now everyone is sick of her. You seemed to change bastion very quickly in season 4. Granted, he was the most overpowered hero there has ever been in this game, mercy was up there with him. Just because she’s one of if not your most marketable heroes, easy to play and she’s a support doesn’t make it okay to have her be insanely overpowered for months. Pressing one button to negate something like an insane shot from a widowmaker is not fun to play with or against. Speaking of marketable heroes…

Tracer didn’t receive any nerf at all when she was overpowered for months upon months as well, probably because she was a very marketable covergirl hero, too.

Zenyatta is also still insanely broken, and he is my favorite hero and I have near 1,000 hours on him. I don’t care if he’s my favorite hero, you eventually get sick of having to play zenyatta mercy every single game, especially even into a doomfist. You could argue to play moira, but it’s STILL not as viable as a free kill zen because we still have a defensive ult and discord like the other team some of the time.

GRAV DRAGON IS THE MOST BORING META I’VE EVER PLAYED EVEN NEXT TO THE TRIPLE TANK META, AND YOU ARE GOING TO TAKE AS LONG TO FIX IT AS YOU DO ANYTHING ELSE. WAITING FOR THE INEVITABLE GRAV DRAGON EVERY GAME IS SO BORING ON BOTH SIDES NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO THERES NO COUNTER PLAY IF YOUR TEAM FOLLOWS UP. HANZO NEEDS TO BE NERFED MORE, PLEASE. WE ALREADY ESTABLISHED THAT FAN THE HAMMER WITH HEADSHOTS WAS IMBALANCED AND THAT SCATTER ISN’T FUN TO PLAY AGAINST SO WE COMBINED THE TWO. HAHAHAHAHAHA

Phew! Sorry guys, I went off there… I heard from someone that they’ll fix that NEXT SEASON. -_- This one just started.

If you’re going to make a game an eSport, you have to prioritize balancing over marketing, AT LEAST A LITTLE. Just because a marketable hero isn’t overpowered doesn’t mean they’re not going to be played and people won’t buy your game.

So instead of fixing these heroes, they add heroes like brigitte or moira. Brigitte counter tracer, moira counters genji. This is fine. But, could you at least give us a hero that takes some skill to counter two of the hardest heroes in the game to play? It reminds me of when mercys got boosted from hiding with rez over and over again. Not as bad, but so many brigittes I’ve see have been boosted in rank just from playing her. From playing her myself with no experience whatsoever in a top 500 game, I rolled with her. That is not fun nor engaging to play with or against.

Reportable people in S11

I played against a hacking duo yesterday two games in a row, and after being called out by Sadura, who in case you don’t know is a very nice french girl, they proceeded to call her very sexist names that I can’t write here. I felt bad for her and also because why tf is this still happening?

I’ll tell you why this is still happening. Because the game is at a very unenjoyable and stale state, at least in high ranks right now.

Hanzo is still op (Hasn’t been for long at least, but it will be), mercy is still op, zen is still op, tracer is still op (to anyone who doesn’t agree, just because she isn’t played as often because she’s not as powerful as hanzo doesn’t mean she’s not op), brigitte is still unfun and unengaging to play with and against and is very easy to play and kinda op, ANA IS STILL UNDERPOWERED DESPITE HER HAVING ONE OF THE MOST FUN AND SKILLED PLAYSTYLES IN THE GAME, symmetra is reworked and kind of fun but takes way too much coordination to be effective, and I got sym throwers the day she came out, and 4 DPS COMPS ACTUALLY HAPPEN IN GRANDMASTER GAMES.

I’m done with blizzard and their bs. It’s not fun playing the same heroes over and over again, having 4 dps games, terribly stale metas, crazily op heroes every season, and grav dragon.

Just a week ago I really wanted to play and enjoy this game like I have for 2 years straight. But now, I feel no desire.

Support Main: Brigitte needs another nerf

Before you freak out on me, I know Brigitte has counterplay. I know Brigitte has counters. I bought her golden mace when she first came out because I was excited about having a new support that was a Tracer counter. I like the idea of her playstyle, and I enjoy playing her myself.

But… She’s still sitting at a 57% winrate with a respectable 3.56% pickrate. She still has the third highest winrate in GM, only being beaten out by Mei and Soldier with their abysmal pickrates (meaning they’re probably being played by one-tricks or being switched to when somebody has already left the match). All evidence still points to her being too strong for such an easy to use hero. If a hero is going to be this easy to play as, she shouldn’t require nearly as much coordination to keep her in check. It just isn’t fair for her to be so rewarding and game-changing with so little effort when there are so many heroes whose kits require a lot of time and effort building up mechanical skill and good game sense to even begin to be viable.

Sincerely, a concerned Ana/Sombra main.

Brigitte Isn't A Problem But She Does Need Some Type Of Change

So I don’t wanna come out as one of those guys who are constantly ripping on a character nor do I complain a lot but Brigitte is a problem. I’m a Tank main who just came back to playing Overwatch after a couple of months and as much as I enjoy it, playing now against Brigitte’s almost every game just made me quit Competitive. I see no interest in it whatsoever. Her stun just makes it impossible to play a Tank. Whenever we had a confrontation against the opposing team I’d just get stunned and get slaughtered.

I made this post in hopes that some type of change will occur towards this cancer.
I wanna specify again that I don’t mind certain heroes changing metas or revolving around them, but when you make it impossible to play a Tank it’s just horrible. Now I don’t know what to change and all that as I’m not some gaming professional, especially since I was more of a casual player but, I think we all can see she’s broken.

Might as well join this: "Dream Patchnotes" bandwagon

Most of these are quite good, with the exception of Ana and Brigitte’s changes.

The first half of the Ana changes are great, but the said they don’t want to add mobility to her, and 30% speed boost as removed for a reason. Instead, boosted targets could have increased healing by 50%(imagine boosting a coalecance…)

As for the Brigitte changes, these would destroy her. She has one skill shot, and it shouldn’t be removed. Instead, how about these changes:

Shield health reduced to 500

Shield bash cool down increased to 8 seconds

Flail damage decreased to 30 per swing

Self healing from inspire reduced to 12 health per second(same as Lucio)

Inspire now lasts 10 seconds

Repair pack projectile speed increased

Repair pack cool down decreased by 1 second

Rally now rapidly provides armor for 5 seconds, giving up to 300 at once on a target(this would be 60 per second), after 2 seconds, it decreases at the same rate.

Please don't ignore players, do something with brigitte

Why you ignore us?
Brigitte it my the biggest frustration in this game.
I hate she, even not because she killed me (other heroes can kill me too), i hate how she do kills. Absolutely NO RESPECT gameplay as brigitte, your opponents shooting, choosing positions, moving, but brigitte just press few buttons…Not balanced? May be. But its totally unfair. Her gameplay is 95% her abilities.

Doomfist has same gameplay. Not fun play against him, you agree? But he has not shield and if something gone wrong he will die, but brigitte - not. She hiding behind shield, someone can heal you at that moment or just use her ult. Noone likes to feel yourself like meat, unpleasantly play and die against it.

I’m sad what Blizzard adding heroes this kind. it shows how they relate to players. To their product (game) they relate very carefully, reverently but not for players.
I haven’t to add anything more…
Sorry for my english i’m ukrainian.

Brigitte is About to Kill This Game

Moira was obnoxious when she first came out, but people learned to play around her. Dva can eat her orbs, and out damage her vampirism. She’s open to most damage, and can be stunned out her ult.

Brigitte, on the other hand, counters 94% of the roster just with her kit. Shield, stun and bump people every 4-6s. The only 4 heroes that consistently counter her, are junkrat, pharah, widow and hanzo. All of them used to be high damage, but super niche. Now they’re in every game. These high damage, instakill heroes that you’d see every once in a while are now all viable in the meta.

Conclusion: Blizzard does not test any of the heroes they release outside of making sure they work. They release a hero that counters the meta, without realizing she subsequently counters everything. They’d rather spend time developing things like Death Match, than making sure the base game doesn’t get screwed. Never seen so many people quit and unanimously agree that a hero is broken. The way she affects the game, is so that the only thing that works anymore consistently is high damage and lucky counter picking. Tanks and healers need not apply. Unless you’re brigitte.

Brigitte is singlehandedly killing my will to play this game

No it’s not Hanzo, not double sniper or grav combo or whatever, it’s Brigitte.

Every single time someone picks that hero, I instantly want to quit the game for good, simply because the reward she gets out of the effort you have to put into play her is absurd.

Her pickrates are solid, her winrate is through the roof.

No, I do not want to pick something to counter her, because it’s absolutely pointless, you need 3 people countering (and focusing) her at low diamond, and sometimes it’s not enough, you’ll just lose the teamfight to the other 5.

I am fed up of this hero, and no nerf is on the horizon, she absolutely, singlehandedly, swings entire games by herself

I am not an OWL player, i’m not even a master player, and this is the issue: in diamond and below, this hero is absolutely and utterly unbearable, and i have no idea on what to do about it.

Yet another "Brigitte OP" post

But this won’t just be a whining post. I have objective proof that Brigette is overpowered.

Flail

Has higher DPS, swing speed, area of effect, and range than Reinhardt. Take that in. She, a support, can kill Reinhardt, a tank, faster and more conveniently than he can kill her.

Heals her by 16 HP every second while she’s attacking you, meaning by the time pretty much ANYONE strikes her back, she’s already nearly recovered from it.

Has basically no cooldown, no preemptive windup, or vulnerability after her swings, nor does she slow in movement speed while attacking (whereas Reinhardt slows to about half speed while attacking). This means she can just follow you across the whole map and beat the snot out of you, unless you have an escape ability. Which brings me to the next weapon…

Whip shot

Goes as far and fast as Roadhog’s hook, but only takes half the time to cool down, does more than twice as much damage on impact, and sends enemies flying away.

While it doesn’t give her the opportunity to do more damage afterwards like Roadhog, most people use it to give one final strikedown on anyone who could usually escape the merciless pounding.

Sheild

Doesn’t have as much health as Reinhardt’s, but you have to take into account that the only person it’s defending is her, whereas Rein could be taking the damage output of the entire enemy team at once on a large target. When you basically tack on 600 hp onto her default 200 hp, she quickly rises to a nigh-invincible 800 hp from her entire front. She can survive pretty much anything as long as she points at it.

Doesn’t slow her down much when she has it up, whereas Rein slows to a stroll with his up.

Sheild Bash

Moves instantaneously, with no telegraphing at all, unlike Rein, who has nearly a second of unprotected buildup beforehand, or Doomfist, who very obviously and dramatically charges up.

Keeps her protected, not needing her to drop her shield, unlike like Rein, Doomfist, or Genji, who are exposed while moving.

Gives her control back immediately afterwards, unlike Rein or Doomfist, who have a delay before they can do anything.

Stuns enemies and cancels abilities and ults, even stopping Reinhardt dead in his tracks while charging.

Cools down much faster than Genji’s or Rein’s moves, despite doing just as much damage as Genji.

Unlike McCree, who shoots his Flashbang a short distance while vulnerable, she can stun from a decent distance while at zero risk to herself, and positions herself right back in bashing range.

Repair Pack

Almost fully heals pretty much any non-tank, plus armors them up if they’re already full.

Does not require aiming of any kind, and will track anyone down to apply itself.

Does about as much as Ana’s grenade, but charges even faster and doesn’t have to be remotely precise.

Helps more than Torb’s Armor Packs, can be given remotely, and don’t require additional resources.

(Personal opinion) It’s extremely demoralizing to be right on the verge of killing someone, only to have them pop right back up to being full hp, plus being even stronger than before.

Rally

Basically makes any shotgun-type characters totally useless against the entire enemy team while she’s using it, and even after since the armor lasts forever.

Speed boosts her so she can resume the face-mashing more efficiently.

All in all, Brigitte is just objectively better at everything the other Heroes do than they are. Every time she shows up, the only options you have are to run, kill her as fast as you can, or die. She’s become an arms race character; if the enemy has one, you’d better have one too.

If anything I said is wrong, or you have anything to add to the list, please do. I’m not some dumb hater, I’m happy to discuss things calmly.

Unfun to play against: The valid yet controversial reason for changes to heroes

Everybody probably remembers Jeff Kaplans statement on Mass Rez: “It felt disheartening”. AKA “unfun to play against”.

When I first heard this statement, I thought it was ridiculous. What is fun to play against in this game? Nothing.

But after the addition of Doomfist and Brigitte, I truly understood what “unfun to play against” meant. There are just some things that are more unfun to play against.

Throwing balance aside, I despise Brigitte with a passion. Her main damage source is based around a CC and OHKO combo. The same goes for Doomfist.

Would you rather be killed by Brigittes one shot combo, or a McCree double dinking you? I’d pick the latter.

In my opinion, CC and OHKO abilities are the epitome of unfun in a video game, which is why Doomfist and Brigitte are my most hated heroes.

Video games are competitive but are also meant to be a source of enjoyment. The main reason why I’m starting to enjoy competitive less and less is because of the constant additions of one shots and CC mechanics.

If Overwatch continues down this trend of adding heroes with OHKO or CC mechanics, no matter how balanced the abilities are, the game will die because, and I think I can speak for all of the player base here, nobody likes rounding a corner and getting one shotted or stunned. In the words of Nateson: “If I wanted to get killed every time I rounded a corner, I’d play Dark Souls”.

So yes, reworking a core part of a heroes kit because it felt unfun to play against IS a valid reason.

BUT

Here is where the controversy comes in: If you remove/rework something that half the playerbase thinks it’s the worst thing to happen to the game and the other half of the playerbase loves, that’s where you run into trouble.

I’m pretty sure if the dev team were to remove or rework Brigitte/Doomfist, one half of the community would cry with joy, while the other half would be outraged. You can’t have that happening. The large majority of the playerbase needs to agree on what they find “unfun to play against” for the dev team to rework it. The same can go for Tracer or Genji, and just about any hero in the game really.

TLDR: Removing/reworking heroes because they are unfun to play against is a valid reason, but what’s controversial is what is and isn’t considered unfun by the community.

Can we please come back and talk about Brigitte?

Listen, i get it that people hate it when players whine about new characters being overpowered, but Brigitte has been out for a while, and I still think she is way too strong to be in the support category. I understand that a tank-healer hybrid would be hard to deal with considering it’s a new concept for the game, but even with the counters we found against her like using Pharah and Junkrat, she still has too much damage to deal with.

First off, I don’t think a support should be able to hold their own against tanks BY THEMSELVES. Brigitte easily counters so many tanks, such as D.va, Winston, and the most common one being Roadhog. She can just keep hitting away with her flail against hog, getting healed with every swing, so the damage Hog can do to her is nothing, and if the Hog tries to heal, one shield bash would completely negate that, and now Hog is an easy kill. Winston’s Tesla Cannon doesn’t do anything to her because of her passive, only thing left to do is leap away, and D.va doesn’t do enough damage to get past Brigitte’s passive either. D.va usually relies on defense matrix to defend herself, that’s why some heroes with beams and melees have an upper hand, like Zarya, Symmetra, Reinhardt, and now Brigitte.

Her flail doesn’t do that much damage, but it swings so fast that it feels like it does. Also her passive will not only heal allies around her, but can heal herself which is an issue. I tested that one swing on an enemy will heal about 80hp overtime, and if you keep rapidly swinging against an enemy that’s attacking you, it’s like your being pocketed because your health will not go down easily. You need several people to take her down, not because she’s an evasive healer like Mercy with her glide, or Moira with her fade, but because she can EASILY defend herself. She’s like a one-woman army because:
A. She can do an insane amount of damage herself
B. Her passive heals so much its like a Mercy is pocketing her
C. Her stun ability cancels important abilities, ults, and leads up to a broken combo with Bash+Flail+Whipshot=about (one shots Tracer)

In my opinion on what to nerf, i feel like she should swing slower/flail does less damage, make her stun ability harder to hit or replace it with something else, and fix her passive, make it where it only heals allies, and not herself, and give her regeneration like Mercy so she has a way to heal herself, like most supports can.

I also understand that some supports themselves can do crazy damage like Zen with his charge shot and discord, and Moira with her long-ranged beam and orbs, but the thing is is that you need to aim and predict your enemies movements with Zen, with Brigitte you have a melee as your primary, so aiming isn’t a problem with her. With Moira, she will mainly rely on her orbs, whether using a damage orb to try and kill, or healing orb to try and survive, or just flee from the fight. Brigitte has all the damage and healing she needs at the same time, while Moira has to either rely on more damage or more healing in a fight.

Everything else is fine with me such as the Repair Pack, Whip Shot, Rally, and her shield by itself (of course not the shield bash, but the size and health is okay for me) I know this is a long discussion, but I just needed to let this out, and see if there are people that agree with me, or someone who disagrees could change my mind, and maybe if I’m lucky someone from Blizzard will read and respond. If you read this whole thing, and either agree of disagree, please, I’d love to hear your guys’ input on Brigitte. Maybe there are some points I left out! Thanks!

EDIT: I have seen a lot of replies mentioning that in order for Brigitte to input so much damage, you need to be in her melee range, and a majority of you are saying to just stay away from her range. What about when you have to push to capture a point or defend/attack a payload, you will end up being in her melee range if your pushing. Only characters like Widow, Hanzo, and Pharah don’t really have to be in her melee range to help attack/defend a point because their main jobs are to inflict damage from far away, but that’s only 3 of the 28 heroes in the game, and even so, she has a shield to help defend herself against these characters until one of her teammates can deal with the Widow or Pharah or Hanzo. I’m sure there are some characters you’ll say that don’t need to dive the point, but I’m just pointing out the most common characters that don’t usually dive a point. So that’s my argument about being in Brigitte’s melee range! Thanks again for your responses, there were some very good arguments out there!