Full Mechanics of new Legendary Affixes incl. Bugs and a QoL changes

PTR Feedback
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Here is a full mechanical test of the all the new affixes and the changes (mainly bugs) that need to be addressed from my PoV:

Squirt’s Necklace:

  • Gains a stack each 1 seconds.
  • Each stack should give 10% damage, -5% DR
  • Starts stacking after two seconds of last occuring damage taken instance.
  • Only damage instances with a proc-coefficient != 0 reset the stacks.
  • Fully dynamic. Not snapshottable.
  • It’s always -5% DR.
    • Change: This a bug. The penalty is not stacking upwards with each stack to 50%.
  • DPS works. Fully separate multiplier.
  • Note: Necromancer %life cost abilities do no reset stacks.
  • Does not have an icon
    • Change: Please add Icon.

The Executioner:

  • Does not work on Follower (that’s okay).
  • Works exactly the same way as Frailty; executing a target below threshold for IEEE 754 32-Bit Float MAX.
  • Doesn’t work with MFD.

Echoing Fury:

  • Does not work with assists.
    • Change: Either work on assists or on a per-hit basis.
  • Does work on Follower.
  • Get a stack for each kill up to 5. Each stack gives +0.15 Attacks Per Second (legacy) and 5% Movement speed.
    • Change: Adapt text description to incorporate mechanics.
  • Does not have an Icon.
    • Change: Please add Icon.
  • Actually legacy “0.75 Attacks per Second” modifier and not the common “Increased Attacks per Second%” modifier.
    • Change: I consider this a bug. Ask for non-legacy %IAS increase.
  • Too strong for dual wielding? Applies to both weapons at the same time.
  • Pet kills don’t work for Echoing Fury.
    • Change: I consider this a bug. Pet’s should trigger EF.

Flavor of Time:

  • Buffs the entire group if and only if the “Clicker” has it equipped and if the Pylons are “Power, Channeling, Speed”.
    • Change: I consider this a bug. Everyone wearing FoT should get the buff regardless of what players clicks a Pylon.
  • Note: Personally (just sVr thoughts): Scary, because it might limit future design space of new GRs orrescaled content. Flavor of Time might be the only way in the future to actually kill elites with Conduit.

Stone Gauntlets:

  • Affix description is a flavor text.
    • Change: Adapt text description to incorporate mechanics.
  • If you gain the stacks, while being CC IMMUNE and afterwards dropping CC IMMUNITY, you don’t get the movement speed debuff.
    • Change: I consider this a bug. Debuff should be dynamic to CC IMMUNITY. When the IMMUNITY drops all penalties should apply.
  • The attack speed debuff pierces CC IMMUNITY.
    • Change: I consider this a bug. APS debuff is soft-CC (reads so in gameguide) and hence should’nt pierce CC IMMUNITY. Worthwhile noting that this bug has an XOR-relation to the previous bug. You either fix this one or the previous one, not both. It has to be consistent one way.
  • Actually gives 50% Armor per stack up to 250%. %Armor is additive to Paragon, Potion, Prophet, etc.
  • Note: If properly fixed, Sone Gauntlets are actually a VERY NICE mitigation choice and will beat St. Archew’s by a large margin once the CC IMMUNITY inconsistences are fixed.

Messerschmidt’s Reaver:

  • Does not work with pets.
  • Does not work with assists.
    • Change: Ask for it to work with assists. This seems too much of a restriction.
  • Picks one ability to reduce cooldown for one second.
  • Does not have an ICD.

Captain Crimson’s:

  • Damage amp is “overall CDR” in DIBS category.
  • CDR/RCR snapshots on Potion Usage, Area Switch, Character Revive.
  • Especially the RCR snapshot with Triume’s RCR-Circle is busted.
    • Change: I consider this a bug with exploitive capabilities. This is needs fixing ASAP for obvious reasons.
  • Pride’s Fall dynamic RCR does not work at all with RCR mitigation.

Cain’s Set:

  • Doesn’t work if you are in town. Doesn’t work if you idle at the start of the rift. You have to be within 1-2 screens of RG kill.
  • Question: If 4 keys drop natively, can you get more than 5? (is the dice rolled individually for each key, since keys don’t drop in a stack).

The most pressing issue from my PoV is the Crimson’s snapshotting mechanic, which needs immediate attention. Furthermore, Squirt’s Necklace only yields a -5% penalty instead of the 50%. Overall I was pleasantly surprised with the power level of Stone Gauntlet - it’s an insanely strong item and is likely to dethrone St. Archew’s for LoN variants where perma-CC-immunity (or immunity during stack gain) is apparent. When reading the Patchnotes I was certain Stone Gauntlets was more of a niche item for non-self-attacking Thorns or Reflect (Ivory Tower) builds; turns out it’s way more viable than I thought.

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Very nice, sVr. Thanks for the effort. Agree 100%.

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While it makes sense, I’m surprised that CC immunity can negate movement speed penalty from Stone Gauntlets.

Edit: Invigorating Gemstone should work well with Stone Gauntlets if they make CC immunity also negate attack speed penalty, especially for WD and Necromancer since they lack the ability to stay immune to CC.

Regarding Captain Crimson’s 3p bonus snapshot CDR/RCR at specific moments, I find it extremely lazy that they implement it this way. It should be dynamic.

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Flavor of Time, as it stands, will add one more powercreep.
I think it’s cool to implement new items, but if this is not balanced correctly it will not be “one more” option, but the ONLY option. Twice as long for speed, chanelling, and especially power, is a bit of a stretch.

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I have not tested this, but Cratic posted that it is rolled per key so you can get up to an 8-drop (he reported a max of 7 in actual play).

  • Question : If 4 keys drop natively, can you get more than 5? (is the dice rolled individually for each key, since keys don’t drop in a stack).
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I have personally only witnessed up to 5 but I’ve only been giving it a couple of attempts.

Do you mind sharing who so I can ask them directly?

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I mis-remembered, it was Cratic here on the forum, not a stream that I saw it in.

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Personally, I am in favor of not having an effect, regardless of how much it’s going to be balanced, like this in the game. Pylons shouldn’t be scaleable by design. Anything that does scale Pylons, such as Frailty for example scales Conduit, is broken by design. In my worldview, FoT in its current state, or any slightly downtuned state, shouldn’t exist. We are going, at some point, to be forced to use it.

I’d advocate to rework this legendary affix, however, in terms of expectation management and with the developer resources at hand it’s that is likely not to happen. I am already more than happy with what we got (conceptually speaking the “type” of changes we got). Just because I strongly disagree with this “one implementation” does not warrant a change, sadly. Developer time is precious and we have to manage our expectations here.

Fair enough!

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I Agree.
In that case, we might be able to lessen the “negative” powercreep effect on this item.
Not the “double”, but something like 10-15%, just for the “clicker”

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Executioner should work on follower, just like Thunderfury and Blinding Sands and the like. If it’s not intended to work on Follower, the power should read different or be raised (15%?)

Stone Gauntlets are interesting. I thought they would suck. There is potential here to be a viable item.

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Correct, I was testing solo Tal Chantodo Cain’s on stream and saw as high as 7 keys drop from one RG kill. Limited number of rifts tested (maybe 20 or so), but I saw very few 3 key rifts after putting on Cain’s.

I will see if I can pull a highlight clip later to share.

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Ty for confirming! <3

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But does that outweigh the slower Rift completion time over time? If you average 1 extra key per rift on t16, but complete rifts 30% slower, I think you’d lose keys over time?

Still, it’s a viable choice in multiplayer or ZDPS builds in t16 rifts, assuming that’s a thing. At least it’s some kind of option.

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:sob: how can that be okay :cry:

Missing t

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I’d consider this also a bug. DHs got Wohjanni last season (which adds 3000% dibs damage)
So you can get 3mi + more sheet damage as Rapidfire DH with Aughild and Crimson - but it wouldn’t add any damage at all (or >2%). That’s cleary bugged and not understandable.

DIBS shouldn’t be used with sets - it is complicated - like what does +15% skill modifier do if you get +50% more DIBS damage? It is also bad for group play because all your buffed DIBS damage might not mean anything. Sure these 150+ groups will figure that out - but not average players.

Aughilds and crimson should work as a unique modifier - like all sets do - if cc3 is to strong - just lower the buff.

DIBS is an oversight IMO - in former patches we got rid of it mostly - now they are bringing it back. New Devs? Wohjanni’s bug is inherited from last patch - but it needs to get fixed - because now wohjanni +aughild and/or crimson don’t work together at all.

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Most welcome!
The clip with 7 keys is at the start of this video:

If your Cain’s build is going 25% slower, then in general, no, it’s not worth putting on a Cain’s setup. However, there are other factors to consider (utility, power, ease of use, group play).

For most classes, Cain’s will not be worth going for near the beginning of a season.

For example, in testing, the Tal Chantodo Sage build was only getting about 3-4 minute clears in T16. However, upon boosting the power (going from ~1000 paragon, no trapped equipped, less augments, ~10k INT, to 1300 paragon, lvl 100 Trapped equipped, more augments, ~16k INT), I was getting similar clear times (maybe still 20-30s slower on average as compared to Cold Vyr Chantodo), but this still puts Cain’s within range of being worth configuring if you really want to use it later on in season. Notably though, this setup would not have enough damage to run in group, IMO.

There are other considerations. The Tal+Chant+Cain’s build is unable to place Avarice band, which makes it much harder to gear out. Even with 10+ pickup, it can still be bothersome to scoop up orbs on occasion, and you will likely have less Gold% secondaries.

Generally the CDR and AS gearing is more strict with this build, and this makes it harder to configure properly.

I would expect other classes to have similar quirks and issues.

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Really great work here, sVr. Thanks for taking the time to post this! I can’t address all your points here, but here’s a couple updates.

Squirt’s Necklace

  • Re: Adding an icon. Something we’re looking into doing.
  • Sent over bug re: DR

Executioner

  • Asking about intent on working w/ Follower. Will, heh, follow up.

Echoing Fury

  • Phew, lots here.
  • Mostly I have a lot of questions/bug reports out on this one. No updates yet.

Flavor of Time

  • There is definitely a bug here. The intent is that only players wearing the necklace receive the double duration, regardless of who clicks the Pylon.

Stone Gauntlets

  • The description is purposefully vague, to match other items in the game with similar mystery. Some people like the puzzle, others don’t, and that’s okay. Happy to send this feedback either way!
  • Sending the other reported bugs along too

Actually, for that matter, I’m sending most if not all of this along (I usually link threads directly in my reports), but wanted to share what I could clarification-wise while I have it.

That was basically the intent; more of a late-game, “I need to make it rain GRift keys” build maker for setting yourself up for pushes. :slight_smile:

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I was expecting it to work like Nemesis Bracers where only if a pylon or shrine is clicked with them equipped then it would apply the modifier. In this case, it would double the pylon buff time for all. That brings up a question, do the gloves of worship do the same? I haven’t tested it…

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Gloves of Worship only benefit the wearer, but it does not matter who clicks the shrine, unlike Nemesis.

Flavor of Time is supposed to work the same way as Gloves of Worship.

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Wtf. No, it’s not okay! Why always punish solo even further?

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