They cost too much, and unlike the Battlecruiser or Tempest there are just better, safer options that makes Carriers not worth the cost(Production time, Minerals, Gas) besides they can easily be countered by anti-air units and have little to no role in the Protoss army composition. For those who do however find a way well that’s basically because your opponent is super bad or you are way ahead but, in a evenly matched game no way will a person think “Carriers are the way for me to win this” unless again they are super bad or you are way ahead.
Suggestions? Swap the roles of the Carrier and Void Rays
Void Rays aren’t seen much anymore in plays and should be a tier 3 unit with more Health/Shield, Damage, Supply, Production Time (Not become a MASSIVE unit) whereas the Carrier become a tier 2 unit with less Health/Shield/Damage/Supply, Production Time (unit module is decreased, MASSIVE is removed)
This will drastically make the Void Rays appear more often in game against heavy armored units as a option and the speed upgrade (Flux Vanes) will make this unit even better against units that can outrun it or chase after it when escaping.
The Carrier would have a safer spot along with the Phoenix where not as powerful but, still efficient to counter against enemy air ships and confuse the AI’s of ground targets that are anti-air.
TL;DR make the Void Rays the new Carriers and Carriers the new Void Rays
The solution to make a unit not suck isn’t that complicated, you just need to make the unit “not suck”.
Right now all of stargate besides Phoenix and Oracle sucks, so they just need to be either buffed or price adjusted accordingly .
Of course, the mention of a Protoss unit getting buffed is followed by insane hysteria, even when it’s a meme unit. In a few minutes someone here will show up to tell me that VRs/Carriers/Tempests are “great” units LOL.
tbh i dont think i’ve seen much skytoss army win in the pro scene. pheonix and oracles are great units. the rest not so much. also void rays are great units dude. you see how scary they are when they activate prismatic alignment against your marines?
To be honest, it is a price issue on Void Rays, a role issue on Tempests, an Interceptor replacement issue on carriers, and a usefulness issue on the Mothership.
-Reduce VR gas cost by 10-15 units (not a huge buff, but it would help in pairing them with Gateway units that are not just Zealots)
-Make Tempest into a specalist long-ranged anti ground only artillery unit, with low damage but a very big bonus damage mark vs Armoured
-Give carriers a Fleet Beacon upgrade that reduces Interceptor training time from 33% to 50% (depends on testing)
-Just remove Mothership. Replace it Arbiter and remove Oracle too, if you do.
It’s not as simple as you might think, since you need the Oracle/Tempest synergy to defeat Liberators if they have their range upgrade, since nothing on the ground can get close.
Carriers in small numbers are not that great and each side has a hard-counter to them, while Void Rays are surprisingly good tech-snipers in PvZ if the opponent doesn’t have that many Hydralisks out. Once you get a critical mass of Carriers though, nothing can really deal with them head-on except maybe mass Corruptor.
I’m not sure what the best answer is, although I would suggest initially that all the Interceptors get repaired and recharged when they return to their parent Carrier. An upgrade to reduce the Interceptor build time sounds like a nice idea actually (“Nanofabricators”?)
For the Mothership, my suggestion would be a “Khaydarin Core” upgrade at the Fleet Beacon that increases their energy regeneration rate by 100%, so by the time it’s out on the field, it can do things like cast Time Warp and Recall more readily.
Marines and Widow Mines are indeed the counter to VRs, but VRs still counter Liberators.
VR + HT should become a viable combo, if there is a gas cost reduction in VRs.
It would not be OP, but at least would be a viable lategame option for Protoss, which currently there are none.
Even with a gas reduction in Void Rays, they still have to get far too close to supported Liberators to do any meaningful damage. In the late-game, a good Terran player will have both Liberators and Ghosts, which will remove the energy from High Templars so the marines and mines can survive. I don’t think Void Ray/Templar will ever be viable in PvT because of how vulnerable Void Rays are to marines and Widow Mines.
Void Rays have some utility against mech, although struggle against Thors and well-controlled Cyclones.
In PvT VR are next to useless. You are better using mass-Phoenix + 3/4 Tempests + Disruptors to clear MMM+Libs. Disruptors keep MMM at distance and Phoenix with Anion Crystal Range 7 attack Libs giving Vision at the same time to Tempests. This combo removes the need for Oracles and works up to 6600MMR.
Use and mobility of Phoenixes counters the drops at the same time.
If you have patient ，review 2016-2018 community forums
You will see HUGE number of terran whiner complain about carrier for two years.
TVP have no eco advantage(2 base VS 3 base)，also have no TCH advantage(carrier A MOVE)，PVT late game=AUTO WIN
In truth,carrier is hard to counter in ZVP late game，but with old hydralisk,lurker or overlord drop or roach，host combination,P is very very hard to enter PVZ late game，you can check it in match：stats VS serral WCS 2018 .So it’s hard to see zerg complain about carrier
but carrier almost never appear in PVT late game，expect gold level TVP terran whiner’s match.Unfortunately balance team listen to them.
If you have patience to review 2018-2019 forms ，you will see all P units T whiner complain about got nerfed：carrier，stalker，Colossus，Immortal，zalot,ob,tempest,templar,forge TCH.
And all T units they complain about got buffed:Battlecruiser,Viking，Raven，ghost EMP,stim，Thor.And they want more
these are old forms:
Too many ,you can check TVP is broken 2018 2019 in google
carriers are like BL/SH/(old)infestTerran with 1-3 they are not so strong you always need +6. then several Interceptor/Broodling/Locust come simultaneously and have more impact.
so you can go to master with carriers /2-4Archon/Ht(for storm) in PvZ.
