When I say unkillable, I mean unkillable to really any sort of sustained damage. Soldier has a very tough time killing Mercy.
Even a widow can 1 shot a hero while they’re under Zen’s ultimate in order to 1 shot them. The healing doesn’t stop taking 200 HP away at one time.
Absolutely. They’ve gone as far as to call me mental for even suggesting things like that.
Edit: Also, you can see that Mercy’s are pulling the “This is my opinion so it’s not spam” as well as the “Jeff didn’t say mass rez wasn’t coming back. He just said he won’t revert her.” As if there’s any denial that the entire rework’s purpose was to remove mass rez.
Care to explain why an omnic robot that literally reached enlightment with the sole purpose to preach spiritual equality around the globe has one of the best dps and debuffs of the whole support roaster?
Sticking strictly to the lore its not what makes characters fun, suprisingly, gotta use that brain of ours to come up with interesting ideas, even if they dont completely represent the backstory, I thought people knew that by now.
Zenyatta isn’t a pacifist. According to his lore, he will weaken his allies when neccessary to protect people. Mercy on the other hand is against violence as a whole.
No point, I don’t agree with you fundamentally at your core. And last time you used some silly strawman from what I remember. Needless to say if you think mechanical skill has no merit in balance than I literally have nothing to say to you. You are wrong at the very foundation and don’t understand how balance works at all.
And moving along, that’s why your thread is just a bunch of opinions. I can’t take it seriously when you believe in the above statement. Not to mention Mass Rez + 150 AoE burst heal for living allies and Mercy on top of reviving dead allies is so mind-mindbogglingly broken ultimate it’s a wonder how anyone takes you seriously. Only people that want Mercy to be broken and over-tuned like before would want such a thing.
You do understand what I mean though and you can’t deny it is the case. All attributes are present.
Majority of your points are flat out wrong. Most of the threads are spam, and you know it. Saying the same stuff over and over or flat out doomsday silly threads of the impending apocalypse or how Mercy is deed etc. Also nobody thinks you are literally a cult, it’s called a metaphor, look it up. The amount of literal thinking and melodrama is astounding. Also Mass Rez was inherently broken mechanic and there’s literally boundless amount of evidence from all the tutorials, videos of Mercies literally doing nothing but hiding to press Q. Don’t even try to deny that this wasn’t a legitimate abusable strategy,
And true.
Many of the likes on your threads are from people with 0 posts and below level 100. I’m sure you have legitimate support from other Reverts and there’s no way for me to prove it but I guarantee you a 100% you got smurfs liking your thread.
That one side silences and false-reports the other.
Of course, looking at the forums. The main body of the forums is Mercy mains, why do you think you are able to pull this kinda stuff off? The only reasons why Mercy troll threads exist is because many Reverts like them. Alas, the forums are a very very small percent of the community.
It’s funny when it’s you guys, it’s satire. When it’s someone else it’s trolling/spamming/oppresive against Mercy mains etc and those threads get flagged and immediately taken down.
I also don’t claim to speak for anyone else but myself (whereas most often than not Reverts claim to speak for all Mercy players). The opinions you read are my opinions alone and only relevant to myself. I don’t claim to represent anyone.
However the fact remains, the overwhelming majority felt that mass rez was a broken mechanic, the developers felt that mass rez was a broken mechanic and it was removed from the game because it was a broken mechanic. You may like it or not but this isn’t an opinion, this is a fact.
A strawman that was literally a quote from your post?
Because you have no counterarguments. You don’t have anything to say to me because you have no clue how to reply to that.
Unless you want to prove the above assertion wrong?
Because if you refuse to shoot down the arguments of another person, then their arguments stand.
Funny. There were 3 people who saw the ideas and all thought that the proposed Mercy would be underpowered. Only one of those players was a Mercy main.
In contrast, you are the fourth person to say that you think it will be overpowered.
And then… there’s the 884 other players who support the idea.
So.
Pick it apart. Pull out the individual assertions, and disprove them one by one. An irrelevant argument that you outright refuse to reinforce isn’t sufficient.
I do. What you mean was what I was replying to.
You forgot to put on your tinfoil hat.
This alone tells me that you are not actually reading the posts, and that you suffer from a bad case of confirmation bias.
Find me two identical threads. I’ll wait.
Someone doesn’t know what a metaphor is or how to use it.
How about you read the post and tell me why the assertions regarding “hide and rez” are incorrect? Would you like for me to copy/paste it here to make it more convenient?
You’re going to need a citation for that.
How many is “many”?
I’ll also need a citation for that.
Well yeah, out of 884 accounts, there’s bound to be a few smurfs mixed in.
Gonna need a citation for that too.
And I’ll need one for that too.
Maybe because our positions are popular among the community?
To me, this just looks like you cannot accept the fact that a post that opposes your position is extremely popular.
Stats clearly show popularity
“But the smurfs!”
Or maybe more of us actually attack the positions of other players rather than directly attacking the group/individuals with generalizations that are both inflammatory and unreinforcable?
Yeah. If one side stays more civil than the other, the side that stays more civil is the side that will receive the fewest silences/404s.
Going to need a citation for that one too.
You seem to have a habit of making assertions that you either cannot reinforce, refuse to reinforce, or refuse to reinforce because you cannot reinforce them.
I wish rez was instant during Valk and her gun was buffed a little more. Right now she is juggling only healing and damage boosting for about 95% of the time. If she also had to juggle diving in for an instant rez or pulling out the pistol more often the ult would be more engaging, impactful, and fun. I’ll still take Valk any day over mass rez, but these buffs would make it much better.
I already did explain amigo. If you have a character A which requires no mechanical skill and character B that requires mechanical skill, character A’s output cannot be the same as character B because no one in their right mind would choose character B over character A. Since character A would be consistent 100% of the time. This is a simple irrefutable logic that if you choose to ignore means you will need to eliminate any form of mechanical skill out of the equation when designing characters. This is clearly not the case in the design that Blizzard has for all their heroes and particularly for supports so your argument that mechanical skill is somehow interjecting bias is blatantly wrong. From there on all your positions and opinions are flawed because your original cornerstone is wrong. You cannot deny this simple balance/design logic, it’s irrefutable.
I’ve already proved your assertions wrong multiple times. Strawman all you like and bring in the cavalry to help you, the fact remains this is inherent logic when design is concerned.
This is a strawman again, involving others have no relevance to the conversation nor is any argument. Nor has any relevance to my argument.
I already did, I already am. Your basic foundation is wrong and your rework idea is blatantly OP, not to mention mass rez on it’s own is a broken mechanic.
Ah, the catch-phrase of all the Reverts, denying you have a specific sub-group that pushes the Revert agenda and that you communicate off the forums is silly and I already have more than enough evidence to back up that claim. Don’t bring out the straight jacket yet as another one of your pack-mates suggested.
This is a strawman again, I will never find two identical threads because no one writes perfectly identical to another person. The message is the same. Your simple tactics in debate are so obvious.
Being in an echo chamber is much more likely to further a confirmation bias my friend.
If you bothered to actually check all my posts and bring it out, you could have found plenty of occasions where Reverts falsely reported me for a real life threat that never happened, hi-jacked my Symmetra thread and generally accused me of stuff that never happened/attempted character assassination.
Popularity is irrelevant, truth and facts are what is important. People can demand the minimum wage to become 3k euro/month and I bet you this would get major popularity and traction but the simple reality is that it’s not the case.
Is this the to-go argument when everything else fails? If only Reverts provided citations for every opinion piece they wrote. Citation for what my friend? My opinion is supported by the virtue of mass rez not existing. This is again irrefutable fact. Mass Rez doesn’t exist, if there wasn’t enough traction this wouldn’t have happened. But the reality is that outside your echo chamber (the forums), reddit, the pros, players by and large agreed that mass Rez wasn’t healthy for the game. I’m not going to find you perfect statistics because A) you are not important enough for me to waste time with that, B) there is probably no way to get an accurate measurement in all honesty, C) it was supported by the developers themselves. At the end of the day, you cannot deny that a huge percent supported, much more than your simple 800 people (how many of which are actually smufs/alt account is another topic, also not gonna bother to investigate because quite frankly I don’t care that much). And even than it doesn’t matter because the developers with all their tools, mountain of raw data and information who can actually see the bigger picture (better than me or you for that matter) also supported this statement and hence mass rez is no longer in the game. This is simple and irrefutable fact.
PS. Thanks by the way, got a meeting later today with foreign investors and I feel like my English is going to be sharp as cowboy’s spurs. These debates are very useful to wake up with a cup of coffee.
Objectively incorrect when you realize that this is a game, and players decide who to play between two balanced heroes based upon what is most fun for them.
If Ana and Mercy were of the same power level, players would chose based upon who they like to play more.
Skill =/= consistency.
Want a counterexample?
Junkrat.
Playing Junkrat doesn’t require much mechanical skill. And yet… he’s one of the most inconsistent heroes in the game. Pharah, who requires more mechanical skill, is far more consistent.
Consistency (or lack thereof) is balanced by burst potential (or lack thereof). Ana is less consistent than Mercy, therefore she has a much higher rate of healing on her Biotic Rifle than Mercy does on her Caduceus Staff. On top of that, she has Biotic Grenade, which features instant AoE heal for 100 health.
Overwatch was designed to cater to a broad fanbase, pulling not only from FPS players, but MOBA, RPG, and RTS games. If they were to make heroes that require high mechanical skill objectively better than the heroes who do not, they would alienate a very large portion of their playerbase. Thus, they balance (or try to anyway, they aren’t very good at it) based upon hero power levels, not how a few elite players feel about their aim.
I just did. Seen Junkrat vs Pharah.
You haven’t even brought said assertions up.
Find me a single instance in which I created a strawman, and tell me exactly how that was a strawman.
I’ll wait.
Until you do, I will assume that any quote from you is fair game, as I have been assuming thus far.
Lol.
You spent about half of these two paragraphs creating an argument. Then you spent the other half bragging about how you created an argument.
I did not put words in your mouth, nor did I say that you made X argument; it is not a strawman. I brought up additional information that provides context, and illustrates why another person saying that the proposed build is OP is not concerning to me.
…Maybe that explains why you say I’ve been constructing “strawman” arguments. You don’t know what an strawman is.
I have seen zero quotations from said thread.
No, you haven’t. You haven’t even provided the context for you to begin doing so.
That was literally the first time I, or anyone that I know of, has said that.
And it’s appropriate. You are constructing conspiracy theories that have no basis in reality.
Last I checked, we’re all for another rework.
Did you read the rework proposal? Because if you did, you would know that.
Oh, that’s no secret. Is there a problem with some of us communicating off the forums?
Let’s take a look at that “strawman”. Here is the relevant part of where the chain started:
To which you replied with:
But in order for a threads providing legitimate feedback to be spam, they must not be unique. Therefore, if you are arguing that the threads are spam, unless they are irrelevant or inflammatory, you must also be arguing that have identical counterparts.
Which, now that you realize you cannot reinforce that assertion, you ditch the position and accuse me of constructing a strawman.
My overall view on the Mercy rework has been the same since October. If anything, the confirmation bias came from the patch notes, as nothing screams “failure” like 14 consecutive nerfs. I have kept in touch with reality. You, on the other hand…
And then there’s the good old “you all are cultists… no wait, that’s a metaphor”.
I’m not going to go digging through your post history to find something that reinforces a point you are making when the burden of proof is on you.
“Go find me something that proves my point.”
You sure did a great job of making it relevant:
And you have yet to actually open the post to say why any of the assertions there are not the above.
Nope. It’s the go-to question when someone makes an unsubstantiated claim than most people in their right minds find to be intuitively absurd. There’s no point in trying to kick the leg out from under the table if the table doesn’t have a leg to stand on.
Now that is a metaphor.
We don’t go around saying that we are being mass false-flagged by the opposition without providing a source that supports our assertion that they are doing so. For example:
That Sprinkles person abuses the flagging feature quite often. Need proof? Don’t take it from me. Take from them!
Sorry, but “You are false-flagging my posts” and “The majority of players hated mass-rez” aren’t exactly opinions. They are assertions that are either correct, or incorrect. There is no “that is my opinion” here.
Is this that recycled argument of “The developers did it, therefore it is justified/correct”?
Oh boy.
You’re talking about the same people who:
Wanted D.Va to be more of a bully tank, so they granted her 100 additional armor.
Backtracked on that and decided that they wanted D.Va to be less of a bully tank, so they reworked her health/armor and buffed DM. They supported this notion with “Protect the Rip-Tire”.
Doubled back again and decided they wanted D.Va to be more of a bully tank, nerfing DM and granting her Micro-Missiles.
Left Sombra in garbage tier for well over a year after her launch before buffing her into… almost-not-garbage tier for two weeks. Then they… nerfed her back into garbage tier.
Left Sombra in garbage tier for months before changing her, allowing her to ascend to… still garbage tier.
Left Bastion in garbage tier for months before reworking him into into god tier. They then left him in that state for about a week on PC (a full month on consoles) before nerfing him once again back into garbage tier. They have not touched him since then.
Took 8 months to grant Widowmaker a simple cooldown reduction buff; one that had been universally requested by the community for that duration. Then they half-backtracked on that exact cooldown reduction.
Left Hanzo in garbage tier for nearly two years before finally reworking him, at which point he began to dominate the meta for months.
Took months or years to fix obvious and trivial issues (bugs, hitbox irregularities), or sometimes completely ignore them despite obvious discussion on them: Genji’s deflect, Doomfist’s hitboxes, Reinhardt’s Earthshatter, Mercy’s post-rework GA bug, etc.
Listed known and fully-functional features as “bugs” so they can remove them. This has happened twice; once to Mercy, once to Lucio.
Are responsible for Mercy’s rework and how it turned out.
Have yet to bring Torbjorn out of garbage tier.
Have yet to bring Mei out of garbage tier.
Have yet to bring Reaper out of garbage tier.
Have yet to bring Symmetra out of garbage tier despite two reworks.
Decided not to add an LFG system until two years after the game’s release.
The Recent Sombra changes were universally unsupported, and they went through anyway. The developers don’t care about how unpopular a set of changes are once they hit the PTR. At least some of it is going through.
There have been only 3 instances that I know of where the PTR has been altered before going live.
Strange how the official Overwatch Forums are suddenly our echo chamber.
Hm. Once again, this looks to me like you cannot accept that the community on the forums hates the rework.
You realize there are no statistics that back your claim, therefore you cannot provide them, thus your assertion isn’t reinforceable and can disregarded as false or invalid.
See the list posted above.
I cannot argue against it because there are not statistics for it.
You cannot argue the affirmative either… because there are no statistics for it.
And much more than the 800 people (now 930) agree with my position.
Is that suddenly so?
Because before, you seemed to be quite interested in that. Why the sudden turnaround?
you talk like mercy threads are actually spam, which they are not, they are justified opinions. Also spam is not “spam no matter what” as usually the identification of “spam” in a message is subjective.
Oh I’m sorry, I could be missing something. Are you trying to claim that you don’t try to get people on these forums flagged (which is against the CoC by the way)?
Also, by your logic, are you not constantly spamming my thread with your constant derailing of my topic?
“Spam is spam right?”
~Sincerely Yours xoxo,
a Lover of True, Fair, and Fun Balance. xavvypls
Please, first of all try to stop false accusing the Mercy players of spamming the forums because:
1- The megathread got permanently locked thanks to people abusing the SR system (and I can bet something that the Mercy mains didn’t do that)
2- They want to play their favourite character but they hate it since it has been turned into a braindead and sluggish mediocrity which main purpose is to forgive bad game by her teammates if they can at least die next to a wall. Complaining about that is just fair and an obvious consequence of a poor game’s development which has endured for an entire year, time enough for being really upset.
This situation is beyond old. Please, it’s time to stop! (insert meme)
The amount of literal thinking and melodrama is astounding. Also Mass Rez was inherently broken mechanic and there’s literally boundless amount of evidence from all the tutorials, videos of Mercies literally doing nothing but hiding to press Q. Don’t even try to deny that this wasn’t a legitimate abusable strategy,![:smiley:](https://d74zh8edaijub.cloudfront.net/en/overwatch/images/emoji/twitter/smiley.png?v=5" ":smiley:")
![:slight_smile:](https://d74zh8edaijub.cloudfront.net/en/overwatch/images/emoji/twitter/slight_smile.png?v=5" ":slight_smile:")
Your basic foundation is wrong and your rework idea is blatantly OP, not to mention mass rez on it’s own is a broken mechanic.