Why less drops? I can see keeping the total drops constant. “Functionally”, personal loot has less drops than FFA already. The reason for my apparent contradiction in that keeping total drops the same means “functionally” less in personal result is due to player stratification.
A well-geared player or a selective player may only be interested in a small fraction of the drops. Consequently, they do not pick these drops up. In a FFA environment, B-tier items that dropped would likely be picked up by less geared party members. In a personal loot game. if the B-tier item was assigned to the well-geared/selective player, they would not pick up the item. Consequently, the total items are functionally already less in personal loot games in comparison to FFA even though total drops are constant.
Why not? As it currently stands in Diablo 2, you’re not guaranteed to getting all the items that drop, so even if a lot of loot drops, you have to compete with other people to get the items. If they bring personal loot in Diablo 2 Resurrected, while keeping the drop rate the exact same, it would mean that more items drop while playing with personal loot as compared to having shared loot active, especially if you’re playing with friends.
Getting 5-6 items with shared loot and getting 5-6 items with personal loot seems to be the exact same amount of loot. No matter if you pick those items up or not.
Only difference might be who get those items. But the amount is unchanged.
If you playing with friend cooperatively the loot drop system is largely irrelevant.
Lets assume Baal drops 5 items currently in an FFA 8 player game game. Three players get nothing. In a personal loot 8 player game game, Baal still drops 5 total items and 3 players still get nothing. It is the same in that regard.
FFA drop game currently yields X total item drops and has Y players.
The equivalent personal loot game with the same Y players, drops X/Y drops per player, resulting in X drops.
If you’re playing with friends in a personal loot game, you effectively get anywhere from 2-8 times the amount of loot that you would’ve gotten when compared to playing in a shared loot game.
If Baal drops 5 items in an 8 player shared loot game, and 5 items in an 8 player personal loot game, it isn’t 5 items (shared loot) vs 5 items (personal loot) that Baal dropped. Instead, it’s about 5 items vs 40 items (5 items dropping for each player).
The amount of items is still the same. Only way 1 player gets 2-8 times as much loot is is the other people are just there to carry and trade all their loot to one player. As you can also do with shared loot.
It is still just 5 items being dropped. Not 40.
Doesn’t seem like anyone are arguing for higher droprates. It is basically just how WoW and other games handle personal loot.
Not nearly to the same amount as 5 loot dropped and shared in an 8 player shared loot game is still only 5 loot when given to another player. While 5 loot for each player gained and shared in an 8 party personal loot game is about 40 loots. There’s hardly a comparison.
5 items individually, but for the party as a whole, it’s 40 items.
I didn’t assume anyone was, however having personal loot active would naturally involve more droprate, unless that droprate was as I had suggested before altered to dropping fewer items in an personal loot game.
I’m pretty sure most folks mean something similar to Diablo 3 when they say personal loot; as in everyone gets their own item when loot drops. So again, if Baal drops 5 items, that would be about 40 items dropped all together in an 8 player game.
Now honestly, you could say that it doesn’t matter, however in terms of progress, reward, and efficiency, this would make personal loot far more rewarding than shared loot, when instead shared loot should be more rewarding but carry the risk of not actually being able to gain the item.
That is not what I or many others mean as Shadout noted. I was exceptionally clear in my response about what I was discussing. In my example, I clearly stated that Baal dropped 5 items total for both FFA and personal loot. You are arguing against something that I and almost everyone who has talked about the personal loot option do not want (the whole 8X loot nonsense).
Also, do not confuse personal loot and drop rates. D3 has always bee personal loot. In the early days of D3, the drop rates were very low. Currently the drop rates are very high. As this illustrates, personal loot is a distinct concept from loot drop rate.
Like I said, that’s what I see most folks mean when they’re talking about personal loot. Now if that’s not what you mean, then fine. However, my earlier post was based on that idea of personal loot.
The only forum posters I have seen say that are people who are adverse to the idea of personal loot and do not know what the advocates of personal loot wanted in that total drops remain constant. It is easy to shoot down an idea that is I want 8X drop rate.
Looking at some of the threads over in Diablo 2 Resurrected says otherwise. Also If all you say is “I want personal loot”, then it’s easy to surmise that the person saying that is wanting loot for each individual player, because that’s how Diablo 3 does it. Even the OP of this thread gave the implication of personal loot similar to Diablo 3 (where every player gets their own loot), hence why they suggested that the droprates should be altered to avoid inflation.
of course drops would need to be altered for PL. But it shouldn’t be cut too much if it would be worse than what you’d get by soloing as people would just solo the bosses.
As someone else who has argued for personal loot, I also do not mean inflating it eight times over!
I don’t know why this keeps coming up. As has been pointed out before (Repeatedly) if (for example) Baal were to drop 5 times in a free for all loot game, then he would continue to drop 5 times in a personal loot game, it just means that, some people will miss out on any loot at all - just as is the case today.
Some at least, I think would change their minds. I think those in favour of retaining shared loot, and shared loot only, fall into the following categories:
Those selfish enough to not care about anyone else.
Those who intend on using Pickit-R (resurrected Pickit to use the D2R vernacular) to hog loot.
Those who genuinely believe D2/LOD was perfect.
Those who misunderstand what personal/instance/assigned loot is.
Those who genuinely feel shared loot is core to D2 and have some issue with allowing a non-shared loot option for those that want it.
I think that covers the range (I could be wrong though). Of those groups, only the last 2 would be worth debating the subject with I suspect.
Maybe because that’s how Diablo 3 handles it, and as such one would assume that’s what people who ask for personal loot are also asking for. Which is why if it’s not the case, then it should be specified. My question is why would someone assume folks know exactly what you’re talking when it comes to personal loot when literally the only Diablo game that does support personal loot do it in a way that some folks want to avoid (in this case loot for each player)?
How is that a misconception of Personal Loot, when that’s how it works for Diablo 3?
I get that D3 does it that way. But that’s D3. It’s not D2, it’s not even most other similarly styled games, it’s yet another mechanic showing up how bland and flawed D3 is.
That said, FrodoFragins is 100%, in-arguably, wrong! when they claim that loot drop rates would need to be adjusted, in even the slightest tiniest way to accommodate personal loot.
They don’t, and the argument is, I suspect, used by some people in favour of shared loot, as a smoke screen to throw people off the track.
8 people kill Baal - what Baal drops from that death can be exactly the same in quality and quantity regardless of where shared or personal loot was being used.
Pretty much all the looter games out there have Personal/Instanced loot… not just D3…
PoE has it , Grim Dawn has it , Wolcen has it , Last Epoch will have it (confirmed from a dev) , Torchlight has it…
All the looter shooters have it as well…(destiny 2, borderlands 3, The Division, Anthem, Warframe etc.)
Even MMORPGs have it as well…
FFA is really an outdated feature that creates toxicity and drama over loot… but we can have it as an option if some people want it.
And i’m pretty sure that if we have both options , the majority will play with Personal/Instanced loot option online… just like in PoE (which has all 3 options) the most popular is permanent allocation (personal/instanced loot).