The War Within: Dungeon and Affix Updates

Greetings!

With The War Within beta now underway, we are excited to share additional updates regarding dungeons and the affix system.

Heroic & Mythic Dungeons

In Dragonflight Season 4, we experimented with our existing dungeon difficulty progression to offer additional endgame options for players who enjoy more methodical dungeon gameplay. This updated dungeon difficulty progression is also an opportunity for players that do enjoy Mythic Keystones to have a place to build mastery over dungeons before the pressures of a timer kick in. You can read more about those changes in depth here. We plan to continue this model of progression into The War Within with some exciting updates!

  • Normal
    • This difficulty is unchanged.
    • This difficulty always includes our 8 War Within dungeons.
  • Heroic
    • The tuning and rewards of this difficulty are increasing to be equivalent to a baseline Mythic (Mythic 0) dungeon in the previous system.
    • New mechanics and other adjustments from Mythic will not be present in this difficulty.
    • This remains a queueable experience.
    • Starting with Season 1 of The War Within, Heroic dungeon difficulty will feature our roster of seasonal dungeons.
  • Mythic
    • The tuning and rewards of this difficulty are increasing to the equivalent of a +10 dungeon with affixes in the previous system.
    • There are no timers, affixes, or limitations on changing specializations or talents while in the dungeon.
    • The goal is to create a mega-dungeon like difficulty for this experience. This difficulty should present a meaningful challenge and provide commensurate rewards without the pressure of the Mythic+ system.
    • Starting with Season 1 of The War Within, Mythic difficulty will feature our roster of seasonal dungeons.
    • Mythic difficulty will be unavailable until with the War Within Season 1 begins.
    • Mythic difficulty will now have a daily lockout, changed from weekly in the previous system.

The seasonal dungeon roster for Heroic, Mythic, and Mythic+ difficulties in Season 1 of The War Within includes the following dungeons:

  • The Stonevault
  • The Dawnbreaker
  • Ara-Kara, City of Echoes
  • City of Threads
  • Grim Batol
  • The Necrotic Wake
  • Mists of Tirna Scithe
  • Siege of Boralus

Mythic+

The Mythic Keystone system will carry forward changes from Dragonflight Season 4 with updates to the position of affixes in the system and updated affix buckets.

  • The Mythic+ system will have rewards up to level 10, with +2 starting from what would have been a +11 in the previous Mythic+ system.
  • A +5 should be as hard as a +15 and +10 should be as hard as a +20 in the previous Mythic+ system etc.
  • We intend to better align reward and difficulty increases in the Mythic+ system by updating the introduction points of affixes in Season 1 of The War Within.
    • +2 - Fortified/Tyrannical
    • +4 - A new set of passive affixes
    • +7 - Bursting / Bolstering etc.
  • Dungeon ratings should be equivalent to what they represent in the current system.
  • There should be a smaller range of Keystone levels to find groups for, and more meaningful progression between each level.

Affixes

Before we dive into the specifics of the new affixes, we would like to outline our goals and the purpose these affixes serve. Our overarching goal is to minimize the mechanical overlap between affixes and dungeon trash design in the current +4 affix bucket. We aim to achieve this through a more passive approach, focusing on the following objectives:

  • Shift the source of challenge to the dungeon itself by simplifying affix design and emphasizing creature abilities.
  • Reduce visual noise, nameplate clutter, and the cognitive load on players during trash combat.
  • Allow for varied and context-specific gameplay decisions depending on the dungeon they are applied to.

Additionally, these affixes will include a positive effect. The aim of these positive effects is to highlight different damage types each week, allowing each specialization additional opportunities to excel during the season.

  • These effects should feel like a bonus, offering an advantage for different damage profiles each week without being essential to complete a dungeon.
  • Players will have an opportunity to flex towards different talents, gearing options, and consumables to capitalize on these effects.

New Affixes

  • Reckless
    • Non-boss enemies without mana ignore 20% armor with their attacks, but their armor is reduced by 30% and they take 10% increased Arcane damage.
  • Thorned
    • Non-boss enemies without mana inflict Physical damage to their attackers when attacked, but take 10% increased Holy and Shadow damage.
  • Attuned
    • Non-boss enemies with mana inflict 20% increased magic damage, but take 10% increased Nature damage and 30% increased damage from Bleed effects.
  • Focused
    • Non-boss enemies with mana have 30% increased Haste, but take 10% increased Frost and Fire damage.

Note that these tooltips indicate whether the affixes apply to creatures with or without mana. These affixes will not affect every creature.

With our new passive affix bucket set to replace the current +4 affix bucket, the following affixes will be retired for Season 1 of The War Within:

  • Afflicted
  • Incorporeal
  • Entangling
  • Storming
  • Volcanic

To match the number of affixes in our level 4 affix bucket and align with our affix goals in The War Within we will be retiring the Spiteful affix for Season 1 of The War Within. The +7 affix bucket includes the following:

  • Raging
  • Bolstering
  • Bursting
  • Sanguine

Tyrannical and Fortified Affixes

We are still experimenting with how these affixes fit in with our updates.

We believe these changes will offer a refreshing experience for players at all levels each season and redefine how the Mythic+ affix system influences dungeon gameplay. We look forward to your feedback and discussions on these topics and we’ll see you in dungeons!

14 Likes

I’m worried in pugs people are going to only take the specs that provide the extra damage…

So on Reckless weeks people will want me as arcane and group kick, but on Focused I can stay frost. Attuned and Thorned? Well, making my own groups, which isn’t a bad thing, but not an option if everyone is doing it.

27 Likes

Ok, important read there!

Firstly, really glad of the following, it removes the most obnoxious ones from that pool (although entangling as a bit of a nothing burger)

The new affixes however… at first glance I have the following concerns;

  • On Fortified weeks all these passive affixes will be absolute cancer
  • The damage increase to compensate for the damage increase of the mobs are hyper specific and will lead to specs being cherry picked per week and others ignored - some will straight out never be good
  • The mechanic bloat that historically plagued dungeon trash mobs will create weeks where such affixes are just anti-fun
  • Combined with Bolstering and Raging and we have an absolute nightmare scenario being designed (kiting meta yay)
  • Oh and DH are again even more meta than they were, chaos damage ftw I suppose. Poor Monks…

Obviously we’ll have to see how it shapes up in live, but kiting-meta was never fun, and further incentivizing cherry picking specs for a weekly affix will not help. As it stands, its a big nope from me on these affixes

I understand the goal, but this is not going to have the effects desired here. Not even remotely close.

As for this:

All the above could be mitigated by the removal or Tyrannical and Fortified; adjust the natural scaling of the key so that it feels like a progression of a M0 into the +s, and let the other affixes add the complexity. It would not solve all the issues I described, but would be a start, only a start.

Returning dungeons;

Can you confirm which version of Siege of Boralus we are getting?

I got to be honest, none of these are fun. Removing these should’ve taken priority on removing the earlier ones

Thank you for reading my feedback, and coming to my ted talk

49 Likes

I like it, except for the dungeons you brought back.
Mists L
Siege L
NW L

7 Likes

These are absolutely not the way, and I cannot believe this got approved; so instead of balancing things better, you’re going to make it so whatever spec/class we main has 1 in 4 weeks where it’s “meta”? And what, we just take 3 weeks off in between? Get 2 push weeks a season, whenever it falls on fort for our buff week and whenever it falls on tyrann?

Please, I try to be mostly positive but this has to be the worst, indefensible idea I’ve ever seen you guys post.

55 Likes

Interesting idea, however Bolstering and Sanguine absolutely NEED to be replaced.

29 Likes

No, I’m sorry. The affixes that favor certain damage types needs to be thrown out right damn now. Trash idea, trash concept, no no no no.

77 Likes

I’m not sure if the goal with these is just to make the dungeons harder without increasing the amount of things players have to think about (because evidently incorp/afflicted were too much despite being probably the easiest affixes we’ve ever had), but that’s what it looks like.

I mean, these are the easy affixes currently on live.

On top of this dungeon being terrible (final boss, Ashvane Spotter), it was explicitly excluded from cross faction instances when that was launched (https://www.wowhead.com/news/official-preview-of-cross-faction-instances-coming-in-patch-9-2-5-327161). How will that work now?

7 Likes

Remove bolstering and Sanguine and we win. I BEG YOU!!!

35 Likes

This does not make any sense… I understand the need to be inclusive to all classes and specs, but this is not it for me. Favoring certain damage types is NOT THE WAY.

44 Likes

You guys are getting rid of the affixes people find the least intrusive and keeping the ones that are most universally disliked. BIG miss here. Please swap these two buckets:

With our new passive affix bucket set to replace the current +4 affix bucket, the following affixes will be retired for Season 1 of The War Within:

  • Afflicted
  • Incorporeal
  • Entangling
  • Storming
  • Volcanic

To match the number of affixes in our level 4 affix bucket and align with our affix goals in The War Within we will be retiring the Spiteful affix for Season 1 of The War Within. The +7 affix bucket includes the following:

  • Raging
  • Bolstering
  • Bursting
  • Sanguine

Bolstering and sanguine are NEVER fun and ALWAYS annoying. Tons of people see those affixes and straight up choose not to play the game that week.

The new expansion launch is your opportunity to make the system better by responding to player feedback, not double down on design that players have been reacting negatively to for years. I love M+ in general, but I detest most of the affixes you are choosing to keep, and I know I’m not alone.

30 Likes

Why get rid of afflicted, why are BOLSTERING and SANGUINE still a thing, they RUIN keys.

28 Likes

So uh, a kiss every 4 weeks and downsides all of them?

These sound like they are going to make certain tanks completely nonviable on certain weeks.

I really dont know who these changes are for or how they make anything more fun. Fun being what I can only assume is the point of playing a game.

And you got rid of the easier affixes and kept sanguine and bolster.

Sure makes me excited to engage with this system.

12 Likes

The wrong affix bucket is being removed.

47 Likes

Tru true. Blizz really dislikes ideas if they didn’t come up with them first, though. They’d rather double down.

7 Likes

afflicted is the reason why healers unironically think dispel needs a buff

1 Like

Who is this for??? I understand wanting to shake up the “meta comp” idea but this just made affixes 20x WORSE! Now I HAVE to have four different alts to try to push rating on because 3 weeks out of 4 the MAIN I want to play is useless? Who thought this up? Is it April Fools? This has to be a joke. SERIOUSLY WHO IS THIS FOR!!!

27 Likes