Raid vendor would solve all these issues, save currency for x many weeks, buy the item you want. Problem solved.
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I’m more impressed that despite never getting any loot you’re somehow 243 item level wearing 10 SoD raid drop items and 4 mythic+ Items including a 252 weapon and all your domination slots.
Only 1 slot less than heroic level, and it’s a domination slot so you most likely have higher item level but won’t wear it because of the gems which is normal.
I personally would like to know just how many raid clears Blizzard wants players to do in order for them to have a complete set of gear.
10? 20? 30?
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I remember during TBC (actual TBC not classic) i got my priest fully raid geared in 2 weeks. How is this possible? Because the loot system was better.
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Loot sources fundamentally have to be balanced against each other. The current state of raid loot might have been fine pre-Legion, but in it’s current state (ESPECIALLY since item upgrades massively upped M+ loot consistency), it’s not.
It’s an inevitability since raids are so much harder to organize than M+ that progression has to be strictly scheduled.
When you’ve only got 7-12 hours per week to clear a raid, eventually you’ll reach a point where getting a couple items isn’t worth the hassle of spending a huge part of your budgeted raid time.
I’m sure some guilds decide to start extending earlier because M+ gives them the loot they need. But there’s so many factors that go into the decision to extend or reclear that there’s no one-size-fits-all answer.
I mean, I have no issue with extending. I think extending is a natural part of progression and will happen regardless of whether M+ is a viable loot source or not.
But if the GV is going to exist, then the raid one needs to be designed around how raid guilds actually work. Because the second the guild hits the point whether it has to bench people or extend the raid, the GV no longer functions for those people.
3 Likes
I’ve gone entire raid tiers without having that one piece I wanted drop. Other tiers I have everything a couple weeks in. That’s literally the way the game has always been. People complain like crazy about the vault. But it is literally free chance at loot for things you have ALREADY done.
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Drop rates kinda are crap this xpac
I’ve yet to get anything off the new world boss, and I got a single ring from killing the previous 4 for months on end
Probably enough to take you right up to the next patch lol
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IMO the great vault shouldn’t even exist, and some other solution created for mythic+ that prevents unlimited mythic level gear.
But I feel now that mythic+ exists as a real gearing path at the same item level as mythic raids and covers every slot (neither of which used to happen with valor) it’s always going to make raids feel worse just due to how much easier everything about mythic+ from the actual tuning where the rewards stop, to logistics, capability to carry, etc.
There doesn’t seem to be a way both raids and mythic+ existing together that doesn’t cause some sort of resentment from players who enjoy one or the other. I guess maybe it’s a non-problem and just let it be, who knows.
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I personally think the GV is a great system. I just think that the raiding slot for it isn’t very well designed for how raiding actually works.
Reworking it to be closer like the PvP vault where your progress determines the upper limit while there is another metric that determines the way you unlock slots in it would actually do a pretty solid amount to fix the divide between raid and M+ gearing.
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Sounds like a boosters dream. Selling 1 time “progression” so players can get 252 gear in their vault every other week.
Basically how PvP was in s1 where you buy “progression” in one bracket then farm low rated in another bracket the rest of the season. Only lessened a small amount in s2 because you have to win a game every week for it to count.
It’s tough to have a system that works.
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This has been a design philosophy problem with Shadowlands as a whole. I think the devs greatly overestimate players’ patience, and that’s why we see them being stingy with gear drops, having long unsatisfying grinds, and zones that are nothing but giant puzzles. Then they wonder why sub numbers drop.
Annoyance does not equal challenge.
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The Great Vault is insurance. It was created to offer M+ players choices so it wasn’t just a roll of the dice on that ONE item in their weekly chest.
Raiding’s Great Vault needs to be similar insurance, but that requires a different approach.
I think the raid GV should be fundamentally different. You kill bosses, you get “Vault Points”. You pay Vault Points to unlock boxes in the Great Vault. (Again, this is for RAIDING ONLY.) And the boxes have exponentially increasing unlock prices, so you get a lot more out of unlocked 1 or 2 boxes for 10 weeks than spending the same points to unlock 3 (or even 4, if that’s a thing) in 1 week.
The point of this is that, while you’re extending, you spend those Great Vault points you’ve been accumulating all tier, to keep the loot flow coming in when you’re on extend and aren’t getting points anymore.
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If you never get loot you value the loot you do get more right :]
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Designing the game to be boost-proof shouldn’t take precedence over designing the game to be better.
Though considering the current price on raid clears it’d probably be more economical just to buy a +15 each week.
But in any case, it is a rough suggestion.
3 Likes
Raiding should just be redesigned. The “extend” meta is not how raids were played back in the day.
So far many guilds I’ve seen do 2-3 raid days and then 1 “fun” day of heroic. That fun day could just as easily be early Mythic bosses… except Blizzard use a bizarre lock-out system that doesn’t allow you to kill early bosses in a raid if you progged bosses early in the week.
Just change how raid lock-outs work in Mythic Let people farm earlier bosses without setting back their progression on prog nights.
This is actually one of my biggest gripes with the system and is really disheartening for players who are pushing higher content. When I got CE last tier, I literally had one piece of the nathria set unlocked in my mog window.
It really sucks that some people get lucky during prog and get the pieces that they want and the others are just screwed because now you’re extending. The mythic lockout restrictions also have a role to play here.
The other gripe is having to share one vault between PvP and PvE. The separate caches in BfA were actually much better because these 2 modes of play require completely different gearing philosophies for most specs, whereas raiding/m+ have synergy.
This is what happens when they crank raid difficulty to 1000000.
It’s also only a “problem” on mythic.
Oh you mean rng heh heh
This has happened because they removed titan forge and wanted to balance the drop rates without it
The extend meta is inevitably purely because raiding by design has to be strictly scheduled. You have your 7-12 hours and eventually you’ll hit the point where using those hours on anything but progression is a waste of time.
Changing lockouts would make Mythic raiding a bit more accessible, but it wouldn’t remove the need for extending.
1 Like