New: Take an extra turn. (Once per game)
I LOVE IT! FINALY NO MORE STUPID INFINITE TURNS! 
Well⌠eventually⌠you are right⌠I am confused a little bit⌠
pretty good changes all around and seemed to target the right cards for the most part (though wild changes i think still need to address shudderwok shaman with the same time warp nerf, blood of gâhun priest with summoning a 5/5 copy, sing-along death knight, coldarra drake Reno, and maybe a few others), and I think some of the nerfs couldâve been a little harder like with reno, but hopefully it works out + future changes are made if necessary
We donât need new features or even card bug fixes. We need core game stability fixes. My game crashes twice per match, sometimes more. I canât invite friends. My friends canât invite anyone either. We can only play solo. My turn ends 5 seconds before the timer runs out.
Just like the ministry of truth, the opposite of the statement is the reality: player agency means to player agency, just like âincreased communicationâ means the devs abandon this place (since before the pandemic.
âYou think you want it, but you donât.â
-actiblizz
Chaotic tendril rogue dead, only deck I had OOF Iâm done!
3 Likes
Wow, bet against me bro, I bet wheel lock is completely out of meta now
Wheel is my only meta deck climbing to legend and most of the time I win just at the last turn, not to mention there are nerfs to reno and forge (I think the latter changes are fair tho, itâs OP to stall 2 turns with reno or having two giants on turn 4, but the nerf to wheel is unnecessary, it kills the archetype right now until Blizz gives some more OP late game cards to warlock in future)
The new rules for âNo Duplicates cardâ are the worst change. I got punish for picking the wrong loaner deck.
1 Like
Before this gets looked over the paladin whizbang deck seems to not work. all the no duplicates card seem to not be working properly. Other than that the patch is fantastic and the other whizbang decks feel alot better so far.
I think that was the idea. Being able to fill your deck with tntâs then draw your entire deck was likely deemed to powerful. They were meant to be random events, not something you could reliably count on.
It is interesting how Blizzard wants more âplayer agencyâ and lists Reno as one of the problem cards then changes all the âno duplicatesâ cards to eliminate their only counter. Even at one more mana I see the Reno change as a buff as there is no longer a way to disable it. I can understand the thinking that you donât want players playing plagues just to counter âno duplicatsâ decks but the fact that this counter is so popular should have been a hint that Reno needed a bigger nerf than just a one mana hit, espically when you are going pair that nerf to a powerful âno counterâ buff. At the very least I would have expeceted it to remove ALL minions, not just enemy minions while leaving your side of the board intact.
1 Like
most the changes are good. EXECPT one the T.N.T its still totally broken even worse putting it in are deck. might as well just make it say they win the game. it would be less painfull.
Wheel Warlock is destroyed. Did you see the rest of the nerfs to the deck? Having to last another turn is huge. AND Reno can longer be used in the deck which was the biggest survival tool for it after playing Wheel. AND Forge of Wills was nerfed! The deck is dead. Not because it was too strong, but because people whined about it.
Whatâs wrong with Brann? Is it even playable rn?
It still plays fine using only 1 of each card. I came close to winning several times after tweaking my deck to use the new Reno.
Close is the operative word though. That one extra turn is everything.
But itâs also hard determining if itâs really that one extra turn or War deck is still way over tuned. Brann and TNT are everywhere right now. Brann is insane value and probably needs to cost 7+. And TNT would be fine if it was only 3 - him with Brann is just insane value.
Did the team forget about Brann?
The ladder was so much fun after the patch until Highlander Warriors started to appear everywhere. Brann is unable to counter! He is so powerful that, unless my opponent has a very bad draw luck, he enables so many crazy interactions that easily bring tremendous value. I donât think this card aligns with the teamâs idea of âhigh player agencyâ.
On the other hand, Spell Mageâs power level is also overtuned. She is too RNG based. When she high-rolls, itâs almost impossible for any deck to counterplay. You can only pray for their bad luck. I donât think this is a healthy archetype.
4 Likes
Alright, I suppose Iâll give reviewing this patch a go, putting some initial impressions or emotions aside.
For some background on my side:
(Highlighted by me)
Well, yeah⌠Donât get me wrong, the patch in general isnât that bad â many of the changes seem completely fine, but the⌠general direction, if you will, raises some questions. Iâll elaborate on that below, as well as point out some individual changes that âresonatedâ with me somehow.
So, one of the big themes has been the elimination of âhyper-efficientâ, oppressive AoEs, right? Nothing wrong with this idea, itâs indeed a problem, and the design team has declared this and its intentions. However, the steps taken so far remind me of some âmemeâ forum guys would use, dunno where itâs from, but Iâll try to imitate the style:
Blizzard: Raises the issue of âparticularly hyper-efficient AoE board clearsâ.
Also Blizzard: Buffs Reno Jackson much more than nerfing himâŚ
So, yeah, about that, as some people would say⌠Whatâs baffling here is not just individual cards or decks, although itâs also an interesting discussion, but the inconsistent, incosequential course of action. Are you trying to reign in Reno or give him some plague immunity to boot at a rather small cost? 
So far, it looks like this: one step forward, one step back â which doesnât really seem to take you in that general direction, you know.
Being able to draw your deck to avoid the downside of these cards is an interesting deck construction challenge, but it has in large part devolved into turbo-draw decks that tend to be less interactive and not in the spirit of these cards.
If you look at the pre-patch âmetaâ, thatâs mostly Warrior, apart from actual singleton builds (which are probably even happier after the patch â more on it later), and Warlock, which isnât really everything. Thereâs also the âsingletonâ DH, which might be hurt more than benefit from this change â now Kurtrus truly has to sacrifice a single copy of everything, including those Window Shoppers, which doesnât look too bright⌠So yeah, make the âsingletonâ tyrants, namely Warrior, even stronger, make at least some of the weaker ones even weaker â isnât that strange?
And yeah, about that Brann WarriorâŚ
And thatâs not all: Aftershocks had their previous nerf almost reverted. Lost direction again?
Some other changes to Warriors of all kinds look rather minor, to be honest, and more like regular balance changes than a drastic change in direction. Non-singleton Warriors can no longer abuse Reno, but thatâs it. Brann is even stronger, and as for that boombozo⌠Itâs mostly against slower decks anyway, and why bother when you can do a guaranteed board lock with Reno now, followed up by Inventor Boom to just finish them off on the spot? No more tentacles (a bit more about it below) â okay, fine, but it was merely one of many options for them anyway.
The next point was about OTKs⌠Okay, Zarimi and Nature Shaman have had their stuff delayed a bit, but itâs still there, and some of those changes, especially for the latter, look rather minor, to be honest. What do they call it, âbaby stepsâ? Well, I guess itâs a start, as long as a general sense of direction is not lost.
Another one that resonated with me, perhaps as a DK player, was about DK cards in particular, namely Threads of Despair and Sickly Grimewalker. Okay, I get it â the general theme is toning down those âhyper-efficientâ AoEs, as dicsussed previosuly, which isnât that bad, however, as for the particular class and its match-ups⌠I dunno, in my experience, the former card was mostly used as a defensive tool against decks like token Hunter or even, cough cough, Zarimi Priest â and itâs not like the DK was totally dominating there, you know, just keeping up sometimes. Threads of Despair is an excellent card in this regard, no question, and is probably still useful, but does this change really balance the meta? I dunno⌠And that poisonous stuff â more often than not itâd be used to answer an early big Zilliax or giants, as opposed to oppressing the opponentâs board with your virtually infinite removals, which often do something else as well, in a Warrior fashion, being more of a reaction tool to big threats, much like the Threads of Despair. Just as a demonstration: the ultimate DK board wipe with these cards is Sickly Grimewalker + ghoul (hero power) + Threads of Despair, which effectively is like Twisting Nether and even costs the same now⌠except that it takes two cards. Is that really so âhyper-efficientâ? I dunno⌠Itâs not like the DK was particularly dominant vs this kind of aggro anyway, in fact, it seemed rather⌠balanced, perhaps less so after the supposed balance patch?
Alright, what else⌠Some buffs â dunno if theyâll suddenly make those weak cards immediately playable, but okay, itâs an attempt, at the very least⌠Some positive changes, too.
In particular, taking Zilliax out of stealth is nice (and that âgirlbossâ change looks not bad, too, btw). Also the nerf of tentacles, elegantly disguised as a buff to Sunset Volley ---- yes, yes! Those were particularly annoying to play against, besides, you know, the Yogg event has long ended â isnât it time to play something else? From the latest expansion, too (looking also at Odyn Warriors and Sludge Warlocks), perhaps, no?
Speaking of which: Whizbang has received some attention, which is also a plus â sadly, it was really weak even in, say, Gold before.
Alright, this might not be a comprehensive review, but at least here are some general ideas and particular changes that I wanted to point out. Overall, itâs a big balance patch, and itâs not all bad, but the âgeneral directionâ raises some questions whether the announced course aligns with the changes implemented so far. As noted by the developers, this probably isnât a final design, so thereâs still opportunity for them to consider the points discussed here and other potential actions to be taken.
(Updated and complemented a bit)
This update was mind-numbing enough that it brought me back to the forums.
Reno Warrior- what is the counter now? Before it was give them cards. Now they canât double up cards, but it wasnât like they didnât have replacement options. They just use card 1b instead of 2 1a cards. And this is a nerf?
A plague dkâs only shot was high rolling helya and negating reno. If you didnât, you lost a large percentage of games. Now, even if you high roll Helya you are dead by turn 8.
Double tntâs into your deck, 4 8-cost minions on their side for 4 gold, and they can full clear your board if you ever try to unload cards. Early, they just pop 14 armor in one turn and watch you beat your head into a wall.
Hand buff Pally is even worse. There youâre dead by turn 8 too, but they donât even need a legendary to do it.
1 Like
Flood Paladin for the win.
A couple more thoughts or observations (I wonder whether playing vs yet another bunch of singletons Warriors prompted me do write this)⌠The first one didnât make it to the post above, and the other one is an afterthought.
So, about the approach to balance patches⌠Anyone remember a class called Demon Hunter, with poor lilâ Window Shoppers? The one killed with extreme prejudice, so that you generally donât even see it at all on the ladder, apart from guys who apparently didnât âget the memoâ, as North Americans would put it? The real question we raise here is, why has it been treated in such a way? Sure, a lot of arguments for and against it could be put forth, but one circumstance stands out, be it a coincidence or not: that was one of the cheapest, if not the cheapest, competitive decks outs there. Some lists would even forego âGoing Down Swingingâ, leaving Zilliax the only ârealâ legendary card there, two pairs of epics â and that was it. Such an atrocity wouldnât do, would it? On the other hand, what have we got there in the winners of the latest big patch? Wallet Warrior? It figures.
Another point was about that âplayer agencyâ part. Fix Brann, fix Brann, said the community â I could link a number of relevant topics here⌠So, back to that âmemeâ language again:
Blizzard: â Increasing the overall feeling of player agency is our key focus with this patch, and it will continue to be our key focus in future patches until it feels like the trend of powerful low-agency cards and archetypes has been reversed.â
Also Blizzard: Buffs one of the most uninteractive decks in the game (a quick reminder of its key features: 2x double Dirty Rat, T.N.T., Reno, etc).