You are missing the point, they are not as interested in your unfounded opinion but your EXPERIENCE with the system.
I have, for the last two days, I have ad nauseam, and today Blizzard told me they don’t want to hear it unless I’m an alpha tester.
My feedback is that the system they’ve implemented should be removed, and not “repaired”. From one coder to another, they’ve gone down the rabbit hole. Again.
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Its not needed to solve their stated goal of preventing players from delaying moving forward until big abilities are off cool down. Just have the “Exhaustion” debuff not clear until the start of the next level/floor (as stated by Bellular and others).
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It removes player agency for being able to AFK if needed WHEN needed.
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Its not normally done in a rogue-like dungeon crawler. It defeats the purpose of a dungeon crawler. It ruins the dungeon crawling experience. (Quick aside: I LOVED the idea of Islands, until I tried them and found out I was being rushed, and could not explore. Never walked into another Island instance after that.)
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We already have speed trial gaming mechanics in the game (Islands, Mythic+) that already exclude much of the customer base, don’t add more.
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Blizzard said they would not use timers, and customers returned to the game because of that.
And on and on and on. Literally dozens of posts going into detail on the above points.
And if my own opinions are not enough, they’ve had an earfull from the alpha testers and YouTube content creators on the subject.
Not only tired of repeating myself, but of having to defend my opinions again and again and again, only for them to not be listened to because I’m not in the alpha.
3 Likes
If there’s no timer, or any other sort of hesitancy, then what exactly makes this Tower unique. Your just killing mobs, that get progressively stronger at the same relative pace you do.
Unless you’re arguing that certain specs may have it inherently easier then others?
Where’s the lie? 
i think you are being a bit of hypocrite here. you made an exaggeration of his words then you backed down to justifying your own words by saying “it is possible on principle.” that was definitely not the impression you gave us on the original post. you couldve also taken his words as “it is possible to blahblahblah” and not take it as extremely as you did. so you tell me, are you trying to talk about possibility? because if you are, so can blizzard be, therefore, it makes your justification hypocritical. if not, your justification is invalid so no, commentors did not miss your point.
… I’m confused. Have you played the alpha of Torghast? It sounds like you are not in the alpha. How are you feeling something without actually feeling it? Its already a stretch of feel to talk about an experience happening on a monitor but i think we can both agree that you can feel the difference between classes based on what buttons you press, when, and how much effect the buttons have. But are you saying you “felt” the new gameplay out by reading about it.
It sounds like you are literally the people my post is about. You dont have feedback to give. You aren’t playing it so you cannot have feedback. Your opinion while interesting is not feedback. That said they will probably read it anyway.
Edit: finished reading past the point where you said you werent in my target audience. Literally wait. Your ideas COULD work but SO COULD THEIRS. let them have a week or two to test this route first.
Its time pressure debuffs, which equates to a timer. They both make you move when you don’t want to, and take player agency (the ability to AFK and/or explore) away from you.
OR, just have the “Exhaustion” debuff not clear until you get to the next level/floor.
They have said previously they do not want you to feel like you cant explore. But no they don’t want you to afk in the middle of a floor. They plan for breaks at the beginning of the floor and with the feedback given on patrols I’m sure they are working on making the safe zones actually safe indefinitely.
The lust thing is not the problem i have. My problem is the fact some people really think its reasonable they need an hour to explore a floor or clear it. if you really wanna spend an hour a floor I don’t think your expectations are reasonable. That said I understand needing a break hence why the safe areas should be safe.
Thanks for the detailed explanation. It does sound like their words made just recently don’t fully match what they implemented. I’m sure it sounded good though. 
1 Like
I think players are legit concerned here… how many times in BfA were we told to “wait and see”? How did that turn out?
I can say I’ve been pretty disappointed every time this phrase popped up. This feels like we’re in store for more disappointment. Players are surfacing their concerns on the forum in an attempt to get ahead of bad game design for the sake of play time metrics.
I can only assume you’re not a grumpy old player, that’s possibly a bit burned out of the current Blizzard regime, if you’re defending Blizzard and devaluing the concern players raise on the forums.
You’re assuming its unfounded, you do not know that.
Someone can read and watch videos for hours and hours, and have a good understanding of the mechanics, in combination with their real experiences in the game running dungeons and using abilities, as well as knowing their real-world responsibilities and knowing they need player agency/choice from the game they are playing for their recreational time.
My understanding of rogue-likes is that they are primarily single player games. There doesn’t need to be any method to artificially restrict your ability to wait on an ability cooldown or similar, because choosing to do so (or not) is entirely your own choice, based in how much you value your time.
That isn’t the case in WoW, as perceived power relative to other players directly impacts your ability to get groups and clear non-Torghast content (e.g. raids) quickly.
The only “rogue-like” I’ve played (if you can call it that, which I don’t think you can TBH) is Diablo. What you do in Diablo has zero impact on the player base at large.
That is not experience. Do you want someone who spent a year studying brain surgery or someone who has years of actually experience doing it? There is a difference between seeing someone else doing something and actually doing it yourself.
2 Likes
Its not unique with a timer.
That’s not what he’s saying.
I was averaging 10 minutes per floor 1-18. I spent 20 minutes failing the first couple rooms of a run I started at level 19.
Over an hour per floor, starting at 19, at 170 ilvl, is completely reasonable.
1 Like
I think you’ve replied to the wrong person, based on what you wrote.
What does it matter to you how long someone else takes to explore?
I assume you mean me? I am relatively new in that BFA was my first full expansion with my own account. But I am not devaluing the concern players raise. I just see things differently.
- The pessimists are right and forum posts mean literally nothing because blizzard never listens. In which case these sorts of posts could give interesting ideas even though they are never implemented.
or 2. Blizzard listens but only rarely. Only if the idea matches something they were already planning and they wanted more time to tinker with. In which case these types of posts are most helpful when more ideas are shared and not people whining " X is bad remove all versions of X in your future plans".
I assume you think i devalue players’ concern because of my abundant use of “whining”. But frankly that’s what a lot (but not all) of the posts related to Torghast have read like. Sure I think it’s likely that Blizzard will have you “wait and see” and still not do what you want. But your missing their side of it, some people out there worked to make a thing, think its in good shape and are being told by other people they are wrong. I think its much easier to convince a content creator their idea needs a few edits instead of straight up being removed.
Of course I don’t think this is bad game design though so my opinion is slightly biased. I am a casual and don’t want to have to do 2 hour runs to get the sufficient amount of mats to Mythic raid next tier. The idea that Blizzard also doesn’t want us to need to climb hundreds of floor floor makes me happy.