Getting False Reported (I can't close or delete this thread, can a GM please do so? Thank you.)

[Bagnus-proudmoore]

@Mirasol-mannoroth

We all know you are allowed to advertise crafting in the trade channel. What you can’t do is advertise so often it become spam. You can keep reposting the same thing over and over, but that does not change the spam rules. Heh.

I know. But I can’t know what “spam” is since it isn’t defined. Its just a word right now, with a different meaning depending on who you ask.

@Mirasol-mannoroth

No, they pay their own subs. Those paying customers get a say in what they want to see in chat.

And so do I and the people who have bought from me correct? Are these people reporting me more important than me and my 250 customers? I don’t think so. I also think if I had been reported by more than 250 I’d have been squelched.

@Mirasol-mannoroth

Spam, is a sub part of the language rules.

Spam has its own separate report button. If it falls under “language” then why does it have its own button?

@Mirasol-mannoroth

So yes, other players who pay to play this game do get to report you and it may impact how often you can advertise.

So the few can affect the many in this case.

@Mirasol-mannoroth

Stop annoying realm mates and you won’t keep getting warnings.

Impossible, as some people on my realm think any form of advertisement is annoying.

@Mirasol-mannoroth

Also, how many customers you have plays no part in this.

I don’t see why not considering you say “the people reporting me are paying customers too”. Are the people who appreciate my “spam” not “paying customers too”?

[Mortdred-alexstrasza]

@Terise-blades-edge

if it gets to the point where an actual Silence is applied, you won’t be able to sell to your customers

That’s assuming he’s never had an account action/silence since 2018, if so you are looking at a 10 day (I think) suspension.

[Terise-blades-edge (Terise)]

@Bagnus-proudmoore

hence why I was originally asking if I should ticket a gm to do an investigation

Unless you got an actual email to your registered email address stating you received an official warning, there’s nothing to investigate.

@Bagnus-proudmoore

Because spam is not defined its not possible to do that. Some people’s perspective is that you shouldn’t sell anything in trade chat ever.

If you’re not doing anything wrong, there’s nothing to worry about. People all have their own thresholds as to what they constitute as spam. Some feel messages that reach the character limit is spam, others feel linking several items in your message is spam, whereas others may feel sending back to back messages so you get your entire sales pitch out is spamming.

All anyone has tried to do here was offer helpful advice, but it seems you took it personally or as an insult. The regulars here really have seen it all and they know policy pretty well.

What we do know is it takes a lot of reports in a short period of time to get a squelch. Maybe just modify how you advertise your services. Change it up every now and then with different wording.

We all trying to help you here, so please take our advice!

[Wolfess-khazgoroth]

wow, this post has gone on way too long. End of the day, people can report you for whatever they want, and Blizz is not going to investigate it or look into it or punish anyone for it. Blizz is not going to punish people for having opinions or sending in reports.

Blizzard is reactive. They take action on reports. Just make sure your posting is within their parameters and your fine. So use the right channels, dont be spammy, watch your p’s and q’s (no swearing etc).

[Bagnus-proudmoore]

I’ve never had an actual account action ever. This week was the first warning I’ve ever received in this game. Its just I’ve gotten 3 this week. The first one was at least for an actual reason, even if I personally believe it was just a sad Karen who didn’t like a joke, but since then I’ve stopped sending messages to random people as much as possible. The second time was a day after I levelled my alt paladin so I was curious if it was due to ElvUI which announces in /say when I interrupt a spell in an instance group. But now I’ve gotten it a third time without running instances with anyone other than guild/friends who I’ve played with for years so I know wouldn’t report me over it, which leaves just my trade chat posts, where I only post profession stuff and avoid joining in the random conversations about politics, Thunderfury, sexual preferences, and so on that fill Proudmoore trade chat. Sometimes its more degenerate than the Goldshire Inn on MoonGuard, and thats saying something.

[Bagnus-proudmoore]

@Wolfess-khazgoroth

Blizz is not going to punish people for having opinions or sending in reports.

You don’t consider a squelch a punishment, I do.

@Wolfess-khazgoroth

Just make sure your posting is within their parameters and your fine.

Their parameters are so loosely defined that this is not possible. There are people on my server who report any and all advertisement in trade chat, yet Blizzard states the following.

@Linxy

This week the 9.2.7 update introduces the new chat channel: Trade (Services). The Trade (Services) chat channel is used for searching and advertising services like raiding, dungeons, or PvP activities, keeping the original Trade chat channel available for traditional buying and selling of items and profession services.

With the separation of trade services into its own chat channel, a new policy will take place. Any boosting, carrying, or other similar services offered for gold that’s advertised outside of the Trade (Services) chat channel will be considered spam and the proper actions will be taken, so be sure to switch your service advertisements to the new chat channel when it becomes available after this week’s regional maintenance.

@Wolfess-khazgoroth

So use the right channels

I am.

@Wolfess-khazgoroth

dont be spammy

Impossible as “spam” is determined by the individual, and some individuals on my server think “spam” can be posting once ever.

@Wolfess-khazgoroth

watch your p’s and q’s (no swearing etc).

I have been. I just avoid as much contact with random people as possible now. Not worth the risk of offending someone, so I’d rather say nothing. If there was a way to sell my goods to people without having to advertise I’d happily do so.

[Mortdred-alexstrasza]

@Bagnus-proudmoore

even if I personally believe it was just a sad Karen

This isn’t helping your cause, I’d drop the name calling. All people here are doing is attempting to help by offering advice and their knowledge. Blizz will not/can not investigate anything unless there has been an actual account penalty, which there has not been. You can continue on the razors edge as you have, or look to alternative methods.

[Jetsum-echo-isles (Jetsum)]

@Bagnus-proudmoore

We have different ideas of whether or not squelches are a punishment. I think they are, you don’t.

Squelches are there to let you know that enough of your other realm mates considered that what you were doing was spam. That is a social punishment in that your realm mates said you needed a time out. If a silence or suspension is not added to it, then the GM staff, aka Blizzard, decided that what you received the social punishment from your realm mates for did not violate Blizzard’s rules.

In other words, Blizzard did not punish you, the other people on your realm did if you were only squelched.

[Bagnus-proudmoore]

@Mortdred-alexstrasza

All people here are doing is attempting to help by offering advice and their knowledge.

and I’m saying as long as “spam” isn’t defined it can’t be helpful.

@Mortdred-alexstrasza

You can continue on the razors edge as you have, or look to alternative methods.

“The razors edge” of posting in the correct channel once every 10+ minutes. I’m starting to get a headache.

[Bagnus-proudmoore]

@Jetsum-echo-isles

In other words, Blizzard did not punish you, the other people on your realm did if you were only squelched.

The power to punish should never be in the hands of the player. This is bullying.

[Captmogan-wildhammer]

I feel for ya,I wld’ve just put you on ignore and let you continue selling your profession goods in peace

[Jetsum-echo-isles (Jetsum)]

So you are saying that you can do whatever and other people have to put up with it even if they don’t like it? There have always been social consequences for your actions. You may not like it, but that is the way of the world…of warcraft.

[Bagnus-proudmoore]

And thats all I ask. If someone doesn’t like what I post then they aren’t buying from me anyway. Ignore away. We probably wouldn’t get a long anyway, so nothing would be lost. But ignoring isn’t enough anymore. The power to punish is now in the hands of the players, and they’re going to use and abuse it.

[Bagnus-proudmoore]

@Jetsum-echo-isles

So you are saying that you can do whatever and other people have to put up with it even if they don’t like it?

Absolutely not. Theres an ignore feature in this game. If you don’t like me, feel free to use it. Don’t try and get me punished for doing what Blizzard tells me to to the best of my ability.

@Jetsum-echo-isles

There have always been social consequences for your actions. You may not like it, but that is the way of the world…of warcraft.

Yes, there have. It was called being put on ignore, and before cross server you wouldn’t be able to join groups because if you were super annoying you’d just be blacklisted.

Typically these days if someone messages me and says they don’t like x about what I’ve said or done or w/e I simply say “I’m sorry you feel that way” and then offer them a solution to the problem by suggesting they ignore me, turn on a filter, or w/e.

For example I’ve used ElvUI for about 11 years or so now. In all that time I’ve had 2 maybe 3 people mention how the interrupt announce feature is annoying. So thats an average of 1 person every 4 to 6 years. I told them both “Sorry you feel that way, but its meant to be helpful. You can put me on ignore if you don’t like it.” Or something along those lines.

[Melaesia-proudmoore (Melaesia)]

@Bagnus-proudmoore

If it gets removed it never should have been there in the first place.

Well, sure. That’s easy enough for us to say from our limited perspectives. But Blizzard has put this system in place to prevent a larger issue. Is it perfect? No, but really, no system can be perfect. (Haven’t you seen Tron? :P)

@Bagnus-proudmoore

We have different ideas of whether or not squelches are a punishment. I think they are, you don’t.

No one is saying that it’s not inconvenient. But that’s not a punishment, from Blizzard’s perspective, not until they review it and apply a silence or suspension.

Yes, the system can be gamed. It has been made very difficult to game, and it’s important to not immediately default to “I can ignore this, because it’s just someone is falsely reporting me”. The better default is, “Some people aren’t liking what I’m doing, so let’s see if I can alter it.” Just because you may not be rising to the level of a suspension doesn’t mean that their opinions should be dismissed.

@Bagnus-proudmoore

The people who have bought from me clearly outnumber

That’s not any kind of assurance that what you are doing is ok, and more importantly, it’s not an indication that a previous customer didn’t get sick of seeing your ads and reported you themselves. You provided a service, great. Providing a service to someone doesn’t mean you are immune from following the rules.

@Bagnus-proudmoore

I’m going by videos of people testing it on YouTube.

Never, ever something you should base a belief structure around.

@Bagnus-proudmoore

A raid of 10 people seemed to be enough to trigger a squelch if memory serves me correctly.

Actually, from past Blizzard posts, it’s more about a percentage of people in a given channel. Again, these metrics have never been disclosed, so anything you see or hear is nothing more than assumptions. Even the percentage I mention above doesn’t have a number on it.

@Bagnus-proudmoore

wondering if I should have a GM investigate a potential harassment through false reporting going on

Once again, it is not harassment to report someone. Even if there’s a huge group of people trying to control the conversations through squelching (not very likely, but again, not out of the question), that’s still not harassment. It’s not going to be looked at kindly by Blizzard, but there’s nothing you can do to “get them” to investigate it. They will see when they investigate the reports.

@Bagnus-proudmoore

Which is not defined anywhere.

Please stop with this circular argument. No, it’s not fully defined, and that is according to plan. They do not want people to have more information to make gaming the squelch system any easier.

You can suggest that they clearly define it, but given the Blue responses we have seen regarding this issue, they aren’t likely going to do such a thing.

@Bagnus-proudmoore

I’ve worded my messages the best I can as it is. If anything I wish they could be even longer.

If that’s going to be your attitude, then I’m afraid that you’re likely going to continue to have these problems. Again, that’s your choice. It’s up to you to decide if you want to make changes to avoid these complications or not.

@Bagnus-proudmoore

Its just I’ve gotten 3 this week.

Your realmmates are trying to send you a message. It’s your choice whether or not you want to listen, but don’t be surprised if these issues keep coming up.

@Bagnus-proudmoore

Theres an ignore feature in this game.

There’s also a Mature Language Filter. There’s also a spam throttle (2 messages in 30 seconds). Blizzard has been VERY open that just because these exist is no excuse for breaking the rules.

[Captmogan-wildhammer]

exactly what i was saying earlier. If someone isn’t hindering my game play I’ll ignore but some in the wow community get malicious and try abuse the system

[Bagnus-proudmoore]

I think its partly how society is today. Not interacting with people you don’t like isn’t good enough anymore, you know they exist so they must be punished. But I’d rather this not start turning into some political debate so I’ll leave it at that.

[Mortdred-alexstrasza]

@Bagnus-proudmoore

if you were super annoying you’d just be blacklisted.

And that is what a squelch is, a realm-wide blacklist for a period of time until/unless an action is applied. At this point the thread is best moved to General, there is no point in continuing on here as it will either get moved or locked, either way it does not belong here where it is just the OP going around & around.

[Bagnus-proudmoore]

@Mortdred-alexstrasza

And that is what a squelch is, a realm-wide blacklist for a period of time until/unless an action is applied.

Not even close.

A squelch works exactly the same as a silence. The only difference is a squelch won’t leave a “mark” on your account.

@Mortdred-alexstrasza

At this point the thread is best moved to General, there is no point in continuing on here as it will either get moved or locked, either way it does not belong here where it is just the OP going around & around.

Agreed. I think I’m done here. “Spam” can’t be defined so nothing is helpful in that regard, and I know I’m not swearing to randoms anymore and only doing so around friends/guild so hopefully I’ll be fine. I was just kinda hoping I could maybe get Blizzard to investigate a potential harassment problem, but I guess not.

[Terise-blades-edge (Terise)]

@Mortdred-alexstrasza

the thread is best moved to General

It was originally posted in General Discussion 3 days ago. Some people were saying to post in Customer Support, which is what happened. However, rather than looking for an explanation and suggestions, it seems the argument just carried over to CS, which is extremely counter-productive.