I agree with you AlphaKnight - why should we be forced to play Wild - a largely broken format that has never really gained much popularity. Similarly - the new ‘Classic’ format is not an acceptable substitute for Standard. Why would I just want to play my Classic Set in isolation on their own?? The whole point of having invested in a collection is so you can play the cards in the format for which they were marketed and sold i.e. Standard. Blizzard have shafted players who have invested in Classic cards big time - and offering up the ‘Classic Format’ is just a lame attempt to get out of compensating likely millions of players who have spent time, money and in-game resources building up a Classic Set over the years.
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Yes, you’re right. This information did come from somewhere. From 2016. Nobody noticed (including me, to be honest, until someone pointed it out) that the word “always” had been removed since then. And I’m certain, that in 2017 and 2018, Blizzard had fully intended to keep the the Classic set as Evergreen, but there was just one guy, who knew enough legal, to say “are you sure? Just in case, let’s take out that word, because you never know”.
This is not some machavelian scheme, set up by Blizzard as part of their evil plan to take over the world. There’s no evil villain, twirling his moustache while laughing meniacally. People started to to refer to the Classic Set as Evergreen and Blizzard let them, because, well, that was indeed the plan.
I mean, imagine if back in 2017 someone from Blizzard said “please don’t use the word Evergreen”. The response would be “oh? The Classic set is going away, Blizzard said so”. So if a new player would come and ask what would be the best thing to invest in, everyone would tell them to keep away from Classic because it’s going away. And then two years later, this player would be angry with the playerbase for giving bad advice because he never invested in Classic since it was going away and all his decks are bad because he lacks that foundation. And people would be upset with Blizzard because they lied when they said Classic would rotate out just to sell more packs from the expansions.
Blizzard can’t win in this situation.
Regardless of whether Blizzard have been economical with the truth, or simply allowed the entire player base to carry on believing that these cards would remain in Standard - they have not been transparent or direct - and maybe that is just the way the industry works. They would prefer to make more money and have dubious marketing - than be upfront with players so they can make an informed choice about how and where they spend their money. Well - what goes around comes around - and this backlash from players is as a direct result of Blizzard not being totally honest with us as Consumers. They have made their money off us - got as much as they could out of our investment into Classic - so they need something new for us to throw our money into. You’ll see - they’ll invent a new mode that players can throw cash into…
As the saying goes, ‘Fool me once - shame on you. Fool me twice - shame on me’. Blizzard have shown their true colours - if we continue to invest in a company with very few morals - we only have ourselves to blame when they do it to us again, further down the line. Consumers have a choice - I am opting to withdraw all financial input into this product, and will spend my money elsewhere and become a ‘free to play’ player from here on out - unless Blizzard make a radical U-turn to correct this situation.
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So, what should they have done? Tell me. You have a Set that is the basis of Standard with no intentions of changing it. How would you have gone promoting it? How would you respond to the people calling it Evergreen? Please, be upfront and give me an informed choice.
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I like your posts, you are right and direct! Although you do avoid to call them what they are 
… They actually have been very direct in the announcement:
The Core Set will be free for all players and will replace Basic and Classic in Standard as a curated selection of 235 cards intended to provide a modern collection of starting cards to players of all types and make Hearthstone even more approachable for newcomers.
They even stated that they want to engage “newcomers”, i.e. make more money, from them. Direct statement!
Now, after that, old player base can ask “ok what about our promised to be evergreen classic set that we invested into?”, and we did, and activi$ion can choose to remain silent… and we can have our opinion on their broken promise, and we do. Some are obviously 100% OK with it, some of us are not. I just wanted to answer your questions with what I would do if I was them, I actually did in a previous post… to repeat - I would do the same!! There are teams of suits calculating that what they actually did makes most money from HS cash cow. And there are PR teams that decide what to say on forums and such and what not to say. And they are hard core professionals, our cash pays for their services to activi$ion. So get milked and enjoy the game, if you like… I will for sure, although I will also maximize cutting down spending for sure! If you do not like it, you can stop playing, whine, go free to play, break the terms and sell the account if they don’t catch you or whatever, I don’t care! Options are many …
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False. They said everything they needed to. Classic would not rotate from standard through regular rotation (the once-a-year one, nowhere did they say it would not rotate from anything else.) It’s like a guy allergic to peanuts did not read the “product might contain peanut butter” on the back of a vanilla milkshake carton. The business did not lie, or try to hide any fact at all. If it’s the customer that’s ignorant and fails to ask about the product and fully understand it, they take full responsibility. Did Blizzard said “no, we will not tell you how this works, just buy, buy, buy!”? Never.
Not through dubious marketing. Just not extremely obvious (which business does, which food manufacturer prints “contains food that may cause allergy” bolded on front of their package? None.) hints. If they earn more money it’s because they provided stuff for more new players.[quote=“Winter-2780, post:409, topic:53997”]
not being totally honest
[/quote]
They’re honest about wanting to make profits and manipulate people through loot boxes. They did not promise Classic being in standard forever. If other players told you it’s false info from the fault of consumers, just because they don’t bother spend resources to erase lies from the community, doesn’t mean they’re dishonest.
They did not fool you. You are willing to take the risk to understand the product and spend money on it. Therefore you are responsible for knowing everything about it, the information’s there for you to search, the company’s not greedy for not reminding you three times a day about it.
I’m not a shill or a troll. I just don’t have ANY sympathy for consumers who did not take responsibility to be aware of businesses and their products themselves when they can but failed to do so. Sorry, but I don’t defend people who screwed up because they’re ignorant.
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I am afraid I disagree. Food companies now by law have to put on ingredients contained. We all know where that information should be listed (i.e. the ingredients section) and the information there is explicit - it will say ‘this product contains/may contain peanuts’ to use your example. You can’t misunderstand that statement - it is factual.
Blizzard do not do this. They have some 2 page long list of terms and agreements, written in legal jargon. If they too were explicit all they would need to do is have a box in store beneath the product. Customers should be able to look at it and understand easily what formats they will be able to play their cards in and for how long. Expansion sets are easier as we know they rotate out of Standard format every 2 years. However - nowhere is this stated in any product description - it is yet again, just on their webpages/common knowledge and understanding of how the game works.
Blizzard will never be this clear, transparent or explicit - because it means they cannot then easily go back and change things without having consequences. Had they been transparent with Classic Packs, consumers would not have invested into them (I know I wouldn’t have).
A person with a peanut allergy buying a product containing peanuts does not have to wade through 2 pages of legal jargon that may somehow loosely imply what they are about to eat may or may not contain peanuts. They know it will be listed on the ingredients. If it isn’t and the product does contain it - companies now can be sued.
I’m sorry but that comparison does not work.
It goes back to the Misinterpretation Act 1967:
If you relied on that statement when deciding whether or not to go ahead with your purchase, and this then turns out to be wrong, you may be able to claim compensation.
Blizzard should have clarified what Classic Packs were/were not long before they decided to just make them unplayable in Standard. People have read what Blizzard have put on their official website over the years about Classic Packs being around forever in Standard play - and bought on that premise.
To be transparent - Blizzard should include a clear, visible statement underneath card packs in store stating:
- ‘…Cards purchased remain the property of Blizzard and may be rotated in and out of the game’s formats as we dictate to maintain game balance’*
A statement like this would have gone some way to prevent players investing into a product blindly. Of course it would probably put people off ever wanting to ‘collect’ golden cards at all and they would lose a lot of revenue. But if they want customers to respect them and avoid future backlashes - honesty is the best policy!
For those of us that bought cards long ago before the concept of a Core Set - a full dust refund should be offered, the same as they have done previously for cards that have been adjusted/nerfed/rotated out of play into Hall of Fame.
My argument still stands that Blizzard have broken the above law and many of us feel we have been mis-sold Classic Packs that we wouldn’t have otherwise spent money on had we known the cards would drop out of Standard play.
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Just how much did you invest ($$$ and dust) into the Classic Set?
EDIT: (ok, you mention 240 golden cards…,but not all of those were crafted, some were opened…)
Besides the two Welcome bundles, and the Golden Classic pack bundle, I did not invest extra money into Classic packs.
Years of Tavern Brawls and quests with Classic packs got me nearly the full set besides the legendaries.
Now, I didn’t go out of my way to craft golden Classic legendaries and such, but as with any golden card you craft from the expansions, it eventually rotates out of Standard. It’s ultimately a Wild investment in the long term.
As I’ve previously mentioned, a full dust refund is unrealistic, I would be getting 120k+ dust. A full golden set would be 420k dust! You don’t even need to spend gold for packs and can craft the next 5 expansions outright (regular), not even counting spending gold and opening packs. The economy balance would break. You could almost abuse this with alt accounts, spend all your gold on Classic packs, and every new card you open is free money after rotation. Then, craft every deck you want and then some.
But I’ve already advocated for a partial dust refund along the lines of what HoF gave out. It would be scaling up to 25k dust for a full golden Classic collection, but most people would get 7-12k and be excited for the new expansion, or craft some older cards they want for the new year. People wouldn’t be able to abuse just buying Classic packs for free money as the increase in dust you’d get might only be a few 100 dust.
But it would be a nice thank you gift for playing with the Basic/Classic sets over the years: “Because of cards you own in the Classic Set, here’s a gift of xxxx dust!”
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Those are two different things, which anyone who’s not trying to find a stick to beat the dog will know. Also, while they are legally obliged to list the ingredients, FlagKiller is talking about listing only one ingredient clearly visible. The ingredient section you are talking about is the small print on the back, just like the legal jargon you’re complaining about.
They have, it’s in the EULA that everyone has to read before playing. Also, that part is even void of legal jargon.
Also, it’s interesting that you decided to reply to FlagKiller and not to my post, asking you how you would have handled it. Here, I’ll ask you again:
Blizzard had no reason to refute people talking about Classic being an ‘Evergreen’ set - because it was. That was an accepted terminology. My argument is that as Blizzard have now gone back on their initial description of what the Classic set is (i.e. where it is playable) after people have spent loads of money on that product - that is unfair, and not good sales practice.
If they were to market cards in future - then as I suggested above - a clear statement visible on card purchases would be acceptable. As far as I am aware the EULA does not appear whenever I have made a purchase. I don’t ever recall seeing it - so I am guessing it is something you have to click through when you install the game? Blizzard could make their rules a lot more visible.
I would also like to refer to the Unfair Contract Terms sub-section of the Consumer Rights Act 2015. It states:
Unless a contract term is both prominent and transparent, it can be assessed for fairness.
I contend that Blizzard have misled Consumers by not prominently and explicitly making it clear in their online shop and in-game store what formats the cards would be playable in. They have not been transparent and did not make it obvious that Classic Packs would not be a permanent fixture in Standard
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I don’t even know if the laws you used are outdated but whatever, your logic is still flawed.
You did not rely of ANY statement of the business, however. You relied on rumors, assumed statements from existing consumers who also failed to actually understand.
It’s in their EULA, you pressed agree to a legal contract that literally has this statement. If you’re ignoring agreements and statements that the publisher WANTS you to read because you’re ignorant, you’re FAILING to obtain information a consumer is obligated to obtain as to safely purchase products without misinformation.
They have been honest most of the time when it comes to purchases. They said “Classic cards would not rotate through regular rotation” which means it might still go away. Hall of Fame is already a good example of this, and people accepted it because they don’t lose a lot of their cards, but its STILL AN EXAMPLE of how nobody reacted to such violations of your self-defined “promises” after.
They have not. Your definition of honesty is saying to you right in the face “CLASSIC PACKS MIGHT ROTATE! IT MIGHT! IT MIGHT!” If you used information you assumed yourself when purchasing a product, it doesn’t count. Also, digital products work differently. Try again. They have not factually violated law.
You are 100% right, dear sir! Still, it does not change the fact that activi$ion’s cash cow milking research advisors move (in this rotation) to make sure to give collectors zero dust this year (while changing a lot) does resonate “milk 'em dry”! At least for me, and some more people, I can see. And I’m pretty sure it would contribute to a brand goodwill not to be so extremely gluttonous, they could have found a compromise of giving something to collectors. But, it is what it is, move on.
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i feel being scamed by blizzard… i spend a lot of money,efford to collect all cards from classic set and now its gone … thanks blizzard… rly nice from you 
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I have said all I want to say at length on this post. Some of you agree with me and some of you do not. We are all entitled to our own opinions.
I have taken what I believe to be right action, and written to Blizzard’s legal department and made a commitment to myself not to spend anymore money on Hearthstone unless Blizzard come back with some kind of fair compensation.
There isn’t anything to be gained from continuing to argue back and forth between certain posters on this forum as it just feels toxic. We have both had our say on this topic so let’s agree to disagree and move on. I am moving on and will start to focus on trying to continue to enjoy the game as a free to play player.
The next expansion is around the corner, as is the Year of the Gryphon… I will see you all on the other side =)
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It doesn’t make them more money from harming the collectors. If anything the game will be better because more free cards are offered. Most classic cards are UNPLAYABLE and using most of them in your deck does not win you games or allows you to have fun when more powerful cards are available. Most of classic stays in the Core Set, if you care about iconic art, flavor and some shiny digital paper over actual gameplay, I feel really bad for you. They aren’t milking a penny from you by taking away what you paid for.
So… Blizzard was right until they were wrong? They are not allowed to release a core set but must stay the same for ever? Is that what I’m reading?
Yes, it is a large window in a normal font that displays the EULA that you have to click through. It’s not even a small windown in a small font, or even a hyperlink to the terms of conditions like many other companies have, but actually something that fills the screen. How much more visible can you get?
The point you’re contending isn’t in a section of a contract, it doesn’t say anywhere that Classic will be a permanent fixture in Standard either.
Don’t feel bad, you are wrong, I LOVE the core set, the game will be A LOT more awesome! And about zero dust compensation topic too, I moved on. But you are naively wrong about “doesn’t make them” statement, it does make them more money avoiding to GIVE AWAY free dust/anything to collectors, rewarding us with anything free, since researches calculated that we will obviously pay even more if they give nothing for free. We are most loyal milk cows out there , so they make sure we get nothing! That was my only point. Activi$ion IS an insatiable gluttonous stingy thrifty organization that maximizes profit, i.e. milking the cash cow called HS, to make more than tenfold profit while investing tiniest fragments of our milk into devs. No harm done, true! But milking, oh that sweet cash flow… they make it happen big time! Rightfully so, I must add, their game (AWESOME game), their rules! We can only choose to pick an option what to do from now on, there are many options on the table. I picked mine! 
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I just want to recommend Hearthstone to people again.
But when returning players come back with the news of the Core Set, and see their Classic investment not rewarded with some extra dust to start the new year off with, then I think it’ll just turn those people away again.
Of course, we can argue that the duplicate protection, new rewards track etc, are all “objectively” better for the game. But we had to discuss and fight for those changes too.
Right now, people on Reddit for eg: are quick to shut down any mention of “extra dust”, with the Core Set being “so good, 235 cards for free!!”, “you have Classic Format”. Yes, I didn’t say these weren’t good things!
But we’re also losing the HoF dust we used to get. And why did we get HoF dust in the first place? Because the “definition” of Classic Set, and by extension, Standard, changed. Every time it has changed, we’ve gotten some extra dust as compensation.
But this time? No. Instead it incentivise players to dust their rotating out Classic cards, which contradicts the recent strategy by the devs to value our collections.
Additionally, Blizzard have tried to change cards without calling them a nerf, to avoid giving out dust. When they tried to change how Tess worked, and pass it as not a nerf, there was an outcry, as Tess is such a beloved card, and they reverted her.
Sonya change with The Caverns Below, however was not so lucky.
I would try and make a YouTube video about this, but I don’t know if I can make it good enough, quickly enough to really be noticed unless I send the idea over to someone like Solem, who makes good videos already.
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Why? It would be the same as if they returned earlier. If they had returned last year, they’d have their Classic investment and that’s it. Now they have the core set, and that’s it. They didn’t get any dust then either.
We got dust because Blizzard was kind enough to give it to us. That’s why we got it in the first place. They had no obligation to do so. It was not because the “definition” (whatever you think that means) had changed. In fact, the definition of Classic (and by extension, Standard) hadn’t changed, it was still a set you could play in Standard. It just had a few cards removed.
Let’s not downplay this here.
Taking cards away from a set, with those cards no longer playable in Standard, is in essence is changing the “definition” of the set beyond just buffs or nerfs to cards.
No, they’d get some dust back for owning copies of Acolyte of Pain, MC Tech, Mountain Giant… up to 10 different cards in total.
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