Hunters can still unlock Eagle Talon and farm the skins to mog onto melee weapons.
Going 3 ranged again still lets you “unlock” the skins and use them for transmog, just not in combat.
Which side steps the point of Legion being 2 expansions old content in 9.0 and old content is tossed aside and forgotten about by Blizzard when it isn’t outright deleted like the Wrathion quest chain.
So they could totally go back to all ranged and not bother changing Legion at all.
Or they could go back to RSV and make BM melee and unlock the mog options that way.
Or they could do the level squish and make 9.0 WoW 2.0 and trash everything previous.
Or we could end BFA with a Newhardt ending where we all wake up and X number of expansions have been us trapped in the Emerald Dream or Nightmare.
Of course, the basis of your assumption is that there are enough MSV players be worth keeping 2 expansion old content relevant, and that these players also prefer using the artifact skins over any other stave or polearm past, present, or future.
That’s just stupid… pure stupid. They aren’t going to make surv ranged again and tell people you can equip the skins, just not use them in combat.
p.s. I can’t assume people use the skins, but the dozen of you who constantly whine on the forums somehow represent the majority. The lack of logic is astounding.
I will not argue against you on this. Quite the opposite, despite how much I want ranged Survival to return.
The continued request to revert current melee Survival into once again be that old DoT-spec we had from Cata-Wod, It will not happen.
They created the “melee”-spec for the sole purpose of having that niche option within the class.
I’ve myself created posts/replies in the past of how we could implement the core abilities into the MM talents, to work as replacement for certain abilities the MM spec has baseline. However…
If you ask me, that wouldn’t be the best option either. Why? Because many players want MM to be just what it is, the heavy-hitter with intense burst.
Introducing several talents into that, which focus on a different playstyle, it holds the same risk as the changes Survival saw. It might not turn out as well(ofc this depends on individual preferences).
If we want a new playstyle/theme to be introduced to the class, the best option would be in the form of a 4th spec. Now, we know that there is a strong hesitation towards adding extra specs to existing classes. But, what could make for an exception here?
If the intended playstyle/theme can hold it’s own, in terms of having a unique fantasy to be fulfilled/if it shows to have it’s own identity among the other existing specs. This could make for that exception.
Introducing a new spec to an existing class, it requires work yes, it requires time to be put in to get it right. But this is the case with every new class/spec this game faces. At least that past DoT-based spec has it’s popularity, it’s core within the playerbase, people who want to see it make a return.
You’ve posted this exact comment several times in this thread.
It’s your opinion that you very much like the current melee spec. Nothing wrong with that.
But the fact that you keep arguing against something when there’s no actual need to. Why?
If players want a 4th spec option to get their preferred playstyle, how would this hurt your melee spec?
There is truth to this. There are many Hunters who went through the trouble to unlock the skins for Talonclaw. For Blizzard to tell hunters that you are all going back to only range again, so you can look at the appearances but not use them, would be such a mockery of MSV time.
Kindwolf is just trolling, and very poor one, they keep using the same post over and over think it will get a reaction. Giving them nothing back is just the best option.
Like I said, he’s on the same level as Yura. Yura’s posts beyond what I have quoted earlier eclipse anything longer based on how often he does that style of posting.
This thread is meme worthy at this point.
I love the heads calling me a troll.
Nothing I have said is even controversial.
RSV isn’t coming back.
MSV is as good or better than the spec has ever been.
Stop living in the past, it isn’t healthy, and enjoy the class as it is, or move on.
Think Yura doesnt bother me as much, only due to them post ever so often. Kindwolf will post in between posts just to pull attention back on them.
It reminds me of when I am having a conversation with another adult, and in the middle my son comes up asking for a cookie. I tell them dad will get them one in a sec but he keeps on with asking. You try to ignore him but they get loader, and if you give in and give them a cookie they then know all they need to do is bother me enough to get one next time.
Also having read many of Bepples post has desensitize me from the MSV haters. They mostly say same thing “hunters are range and always were”.
I am not considering whether or not I am bothered by either. I am talking about posting styles. If anything I am sure that I bother Yura more than he bothers me.
My problem has more to do with the fact that he cannot just ignore posts. He has to respond and he just feeds the trolls. That along with the MSV haters have made this forum into the antithesis of what it once was.
Factually incorrect as stated by Ion Hazzikostas the lead game designer himself.
They created melee Survival specifically to give melee players another option (which makes 19 melee options now) fully aware that the overwhelming majority of Hunter Class players chose that Class to be Ranged Shooters (which is basically down to 1.5 options).
Representation doesn’t necessarily matter as much, I think. We knew with Survival Hunter that we were making a niche spec. It is a melee spec for a class that has traditionally being range. I think that a lot of existing hunters, they are all hunters because they want to be a range class, and so we don’t necessarily expect them or want them to feel like they should be changing; but for new players picking up that class, it is an intriguing option; and we have seen a lot of Survival Hunters doing extremely well at very high levels of play. So the fact that they are not playing as often, I don’t think reflects upon their potential so much as it just does where the audience is at right now. That’s not much of a problem
Which they then decided was a problem by completely reworking the specialization for the very next expansion to include a bunch of ranged abilities and drastically reduce the melee abilities.
No one thought Blizzard would ever create Demon Hunters and step on the toes of Warlocks until they said “we’d rather you didn’t play Demonology”.
No one thought Blizzard would ever make a melee Huntard.
I did for a bit. BFA MM feels nothing at all like Ranged Survival and it you actually think so, you don’t know jack about hunters prior to 7.0. Explosive shot is a slow projectile that doesn’t deal damage until after 3 seconds. That is nothing like an instant shot with charges and a baseline passive that procs free and instant hard hitting shots and ways to force procs on demand.
Probably the smallest group of players ever for a specialization. In an expansion that had a much larger active population of subscribers. Meaning less total (of every specialization) today than 1.5 years ago. Also predicated on the notion that those skins are popular transmog options. I scrolled back through this thread looking for MSV players, only found like 3, and none were using Talonclaw appearances.
There’s the very real possibility that 9.0 will drop the Character level cap from 120 down to 60. That move would annoy exponentially more players than reverting Survival back to ranged and making 2 expansion old irrelevant content more irrelevant.
It’s also very apparent that the RSV fan club was and remains vastly more popular than the MSV fan club.
I’m glad the dozen or so guys in this thread that like MSV are happy, but you guys have 18 other melee options to choose from. There are only 2 ranged shooter options to choose from, and neither of those appeal to players that preferred the previous 3rd option.
There is a even smaller number of Sub rogues (SV 2.9% vs Sub 2.2%)
How many Hunters do you see using using Artifact skins? If want to use the forums to make judgments I could say there are you, Bepples, and Yura making all the arguments for RSV while the number of MSV are growing.
Old content becomes irrelevant as soon as the next expansion is released. Blizzard makes tweaks and changes each new release, so a level squish will make little difference on the availability of a aging expansion.
Based on your own opinions, there is nothing other than your own observations to prove the popularity of MSV. Bepples has made it clear that wow sites that show numbers do not provide enough variability to changes that effect each patch, one spec could be popular because of a raid then dropped next for one that has higher damage.
How many of those 18 use a pet?
How many can use range and melee abilities?
How many wear mail?
All these small differences can distinguish one spec from another.
If you want to say all melee class are similar enough, then using a gun/ bow over a wand makes little difference, and if you not happy with Hunters you can try one of the other 11 range specs.
Would this satisfy players? Creating a new class that introduced three new spec based on Bards, Dark Rangers, and RSV. Call it Archer then there would be another range class for players that uses range combat, but does not use pets. Bards could be healers, DR could be ranged rogues, and RSV could be called Ranger.
Yeah you guys have way to much time invested in this…it’s really sad.
Call me whatever you want, I’m honest. Dwelling on the past keeps you from moving forward.
And MM can/does play like RSV. Sure you don’t have things like old explosive shot. But it’s still a ranged Archer, with the ability to do damage while kiting.
This me me me crowd, expecting Blizz to cater the them is absurd.
This is your opinion. You’re free to have one ofc. But as apparent with all threads, like this one, many do not agree with you.
Plot twist, what if the devs actually decided to remove MSV in favor of a DoT-based ranged spec.
Would you still say the above?
You are right on this. Which is very sad as there isn’t actually a need for it.
Not really, as with the quoted statement you posted, he says that they created the spec with the intention to attract new players that might originally have stayed away from the class as it lacked the melee-aspect.
Along with essentially making it more attractive to anyone who would want to try out melee-combat. The spec is not solely intended for already existing hunters to switch specs. And it’s not solely intended for other melee-players to switch to either.
The goal was “diversity”. To attract anyone no matter their origin within or outside of WoW, to try out the class in case they preferred melee-combat over ranged combat.
Idd. Which also to a degree, nullifies the above quoted statement. As the spec, while still having partially a focus on melee. It’s now more of a hybrid spec. Not really ranged, but not really melee either.
What is a major risk with this type of change?
-Well, it might cause those players that like ranged combat to still stay away from the spec as it’s not purely ranged.
-And, it might cause those that prefer melee-combat to stay away from it as it’s so different from any other traditional melee-spec currently in the game.
-There are those that like the current iteration of it, but probably even fewer than it would have otherwise been in case it would be either purely ranged OR purely melee-focused.
So true.
Perhaps. Who knows really.
But either way, we don’t actually need to revert anything in order to get the ranged Survival spec back. The DoT-based style we had in the past is unique enough to warrant it’s own spec. Despite keeping the other ones we already have. It very much holds it’s own identity. IMO ofc.
Heh, fairly true yes. Though I’d say this depends more on the fact that the skins for the hunter artifacts weren’t that great visually. Again, this always depends on who you ask. I’m sure some players loved them.
We have seen this tendency idd. It’s sad.
Or well, on a character progression level, it SHOULD become irrelevant to make way for the new expansion. But on a lore perspective/focus on the immersion and story. This should NOT be the case. The main storylines for each content/past expansion should be updated to fit the narrative of the most recent additions(when there’s a need to)(Garrosh is still here for those that level up new characters, huh?).
Keeping some ties to what the narrative was back when it was the current content is ofc good to allow for different perspectives. But not updating it at all to fit with the continuing story, makes it less of a complete experience.
It basically alienates large portions of the content as it makes much of it feel like it involves a different game.
There is no real way for us to tell what is the most popular(MSV vs. RSV). Like you say, a large portion of the numbers are based on players changing spec due to performance/or “viability”, rather than simply sticking to the style that they like the most.
True.
Again, which is why there is no point in arguing that the current MSV should be reverted in favor of the old RSV-spec. We should focus on trying to get it back in a different way.
Another proof provided of why the game is in such a bad state and why the way it is now. It’s divided is because it’s people who like their content streamlined and easy vs people who are against streamlined content and like a challenge.
I don’t agree, the game is as strong as ever.
And I’m not sure what the easy mode argument has to do with this.
I’d say having MSV for two expansions is plenty of proof. Do you have any indicating it’s coming back? Highly doubtful Blizz would revert it, it would make them look bad if nothing else.
Yes, I’d play MM and probably my DK and Warrior more.
Nope, none of us have said that it IS. What we say is that we WANT it back.
I fully agree with you on that. Which is also why I have repeatedly said that this is not how it should make it’s return.
Now, you will always have those that keeps saying that(because they don’t like MSV), current MSV should be reverted to ranged, like the spec we had prior.
I can fully understand why you wouldn’t want that to happen.
Rolling MSV back to it’s ranged predecessor, it(most likely, there are never any guarantees) will not happen.
Which is what most of us are doing now as well(classes/specs may vary ofc). But why should this mean that you cannot hope as well as request for something you liked in the past to make it’s return to the game?
Especially if it can be done without hurting anything currently in existence?
i disagree, maybe for some one new they would see it the same as you.
content wise (the raids, dungeons, world pvp) the game is stronger than ever.
the reward system is bad and doesn’t feel rewarding.
class design in general is in a poor state, pruning, and all classes need fixing.
too much accessibility (easy mode) is bad for an mmorpg.