Twink advantage is broken

PVP Battlegrounds
92

Cute thing that…guess you never heard of camouflage or Sniper shot. Killing a priest is cake, try not to piss one off be dead before you even knew some of them were even there.

93

Droods r op

1 Like
94

Sorry but i have yet to run into a single marks hunter that wasnt forced to run away from me or die.

1 Like
95

When I face Spriests on my MM hunter they are usually the ones doing the running. I find that MM has more damage than shadow priests have survivability/up front damage. Not saying shadow priests are a free HK but, I cant say I feel pressured when one is around; more annoyed than anything. That being said, I have been melted by shadow priests during their burst phase while my defensives were on cool down.

96

I like you :blush:

97

OP, number of twinks is not a problem either. Gear disparity is a root cause of a twinking problem.

Based on my:

Solution to a gear disparity problem:

This way twinks will have a choice:

  1. Turn xp-off and have their ridiculous gear advantage squished to a heirloom iL inside PvP Instance while xp is off.
    They’re welcome to stay in such bracket with a common player pool indefinitely, but at a price of their gear having its iL standardised, something that an average player can easily obtain.
    This is a permanent but dull pain for us, non-twinks. Its bearable.
  2. Turn xp-on and own face for a limited time.
    They will level out into next PvP bracket eventually.
    This is a sharp but temporary pain for us, non-twinks. Its bearable.
  3. The current situation is: twinks gear does not scale down, and they are not levelling out into next PvP bracket.
    This is a sharp and permanent pain for us, non-twinks. Its unbearable.
    Please upvote my suggestion to the top if you think my suggestion has a potential to address the current twink problem.
6 Likes
98

“Self Imposed Gear Disparity” is a problem.
We have confirmed active levelers (BOAs, Dungeon, Quest, Crafted, Vendor, PVP etc. are doing fine within instanced PVP.
As documented within the numerous 100+? screenshots provided.

The cause of the problem is players refusing to utilize the options provided, an item level minimum would remedy any self imposed disparities.
Until Blizzard implements an item level requirement, players will have to remain active in order to retain viability within instanced PVP.

8.1.5 is coming soon, Dungeon and Quest items are receiving a healthy item level boost.
Stay active! :smile:

2 Likes
99

Item level minimum buffs are all nice and good changes, but its the item level maximum I’m after. I do recall Instanced PvP system in WoD had all the players even with iL10 gear get their gear scaled up to an average maximum level for the bracket they PvP. Having said that, there were some gear pieces that went above that threshold. Wearers of said some gear pieces have decimated those who did not have said gear pieces. Still that was the closest to bridging the gap between twinks and non-twinks, except it should have been the other way around. How, see above.

6 Likes
100

Take a look on the PTR changes, and how they pertain to 109 scaled Items obtained from various sources.
I know you haven’t bothered to check, and 8.1.5 will be here very shortly.
Some interesting changes throughout all of our characters item levels etc.

1 Like
101

Alright I just hope the fixes are not limited to 109 though. There are few high-end gear pieces across absolutely all brackets that give such a huge advantage to those who wear it that it will take more than nerfbatting a few of them to convince me. In fact none of them should be nerfbatted because it will affect their open world effectiveness, which should remain an anything goes jungle, and I too enjoy videos of level 1 twinks winning duels vs level 30 randoms, but 95% of anti-twink qq comes from Instanced PvP by lemmings who were dragged face down and now they want to prevent twinks out from enjoying the game with everyone else. So I’ll give those PTR changes a look if you give me a link, as I couldn’t find them on wowhead, there are just class changes and what not, but nothing about the actual gear scaling part that I’m after.

6 Likes
102

After your reference to “IRL” and “40 year old swamplords” in the “Article” on other necro thread, our correspondence has come to an end. :ok_hand:

103

Aw you don’t have to be so sensitive, I got too passionate about making a point that I don’t tolerate seclusion that OP in that thread proposed. I live to see the line between twinks and non-twinks blurred and eventually eliminated completely, while OP seeks to redraw it bright and clear. But I’d totally could live with our correspondence ending if a satisfactory solution catering to my requirements was implemented. But something tells me the titans will give in to majority as both twink leaders and non-twink qqers want the same thing, and here I am stuck with my so far non-challenged suggestion between rock and a hard place. Lucky me

6 Likes
104

A little bird has told us differently.

Enjoy BFA. :wink:

1 Like
105

I like this because your change would have no effect on on me, and little on the bracket. Heirloom ilvls cap at 114 at level 89. BiS gear generally is of lower ilvl :grin:

2 Likes
106

How about we set a minimum ilevel that must be met in order for you to participate within instanced PvP?
This way levelers will have a choice:

They can obtain the gear with ilevels appropriate to their level thereby helping their chances of survival. I realize most of them are lazy and this would be unbearable for some. It would be a dull pain for us.

Or they can choose another route besides leveling in bg’s, perhaps pet battles or mining, since neither of those award gear that they would wear either. This would be painless for us and since you still get to level, painless for levelers as well.

You see, we twinks would prefer players coming into a PvP environment who actually want to PvP. In case you didn’t realize, PvP stands for Player vs player, not " permanent virtual path "which apparently most levelers think is their birthright since the 7.3.5 experience nerf.

21 Likes
107

Welfarê, A very similar fix to what you have suggested has been tried before during WoD as this post highlighted: Twink advantage is broken - #99 by Tarjana-amanthul Everyone’s gear inside a battleground was scaled up to a same baseline. I loved it with the bottom of my heart, as legacy items became viable again. Having a lot of them it was immensely fun to use them again, just like old times. Basically this: https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/18300111829?page=1

Being the worst PvE expansion, WoD inadvertently became the best PvP one due to this brilliant baseline gear scaling inside PvP Instances. 1-shots, or even 3-shots were eliminated. It was the closest to balanced PvP in a whole history of WoW, and all because gear disparity was at the lowest point in all history of WoW. But WoD ended. In legion, all of the legacy procs were disabled. Maybe what you are suggesting will bring that balance back. It is true that undergeared players will miss out on some PvP fun. But guess what, being undergeared in a PvP only means that they will be on a receiving end. And then they go to forums and complain that PvP is imbalanced. How is that even dungeons, let alone raids, have a gear level entry requirement, but PvP Instances do not, is still beyond me. One thing I know for sure: endlessly tweaking classes balance is fighting windmills, because no matter the class balance tweaks if someone shows undergeared with all the class balance tweaks in their favor, they will still lose.

6 Likes
108

Well be empathetic OP.

Imagine being a veteran and losing to some newbie hot shot who just picked up the game. That would be humiliating. Gear disparity ensures skill (or lack-thereof) is not an issue.

109

Valarien-area-52 surely a “veteran” would have skill to help them if not win against a newbie hot shot, but at least hold their ground?

And what stops a newbie hot shot to deck out in top gear and own a veteran in average gear anyway?

6 Likes
110

Sometimes people are just gifted at certain things. I’m not in my prime anymore, there are younger people that can run circles around me with their reflexes and natural talent.

I could play a FPS for years and get better slowly. Someone else could pick up the game and be crazy good in a week.

Investment, time. Those two don’t equate to skill though.

111

My thoughts exactly. Most FPS does not have gear problem. Its just skill. That’s why noone in their right mind there suggests splitting players into separate brackets. Because based on what woud you split them? Now compare it with WoW. I hope we aren’t argue that having class specific PvP queues would be moronic, are we? Paladin only queues anyone? Class/Spec advantage would be nullified there, yes?

Then why is suggestion about splitting xp off people who are 70% about gear advantage has more likes than any one of us fingers and toes combined, unless you’re from chernobyl? Entombing the problem and hope it goes away is just as idiotic as class specific PvP queues. The gear disparity problem won’t go away. But what it will do is get bigger and worse with every year. Suggestion to squish iL inside PvP Instances would cull the very incentive the maniacs among twinks who join normal PvP Instances and roflstomp lemmings who spend 3 times longer qqing on forums after they have been gy farmed than actually gearing to prevent being gy farmed.

6 Likes