Nope don’t care about word firsts, or in the case of tbcc world second first, but I’m not biased in regard to how I read his statement, dual spec is not necessary in tbcc. I respec multiple times a week on my rogue to PvP and raid, I don’t seem to have an issue farming gold casually.
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In-fact, players should not be able to remove gear once equipped, this would make choices really meaningful.
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There’s an entire thread based on how they felt about dual spec (in actual TBC) and the pro dual spec people in there just ignored it and said it doesn’t matter anymore lol. There’s really no winning with you lmao.
bluetracker.gg/wow/topic/us-en/98646792-we-need-free-respecs-or-spec-swapping/
All you’re going to do is move the goalposts anyway, but here you go.
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People tend to forget that this game was originally supposed to be an RPG. At the time, this one was a little more forgiving and casual friendly than other options at the time. Players tend to focus on perfecting game mechanics and forgetting the RPG aspect of the game. It’s not wrong to want to play a different type of game, but it is unfortunate that this one is being pushed so hard to be something that it was not originally.
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Blizzard actually said, “Good but hard choices” and that you should “have a real investment in choosing your spec”… But yes, they added dual-spec in WOTLK because they said “Committing to being sub-optimal for parts of the game you enjoy is just a drag.”
The cost was designed to be so expensive that people would rarely if ever respec. This meant that players would choose talents based on their overall playstyle instead of just switching back-and-forth between cookie cutter specs.
Your spec would in some part become your identity. You are the healing druid or the tank druid or the kitty druid or the pvp druid, instead of just the druid(like all the other druids).
Many have claimed that the 50g respec was intended to be a “gold-sink” but that is false. It was supposed to prevent you from respecing except when absolutely necessary.
The fact that people can and do switch specs multiple times a day, or between raid bosses, is against the way the game was designed, and should not be allowed.
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If that were the design intent behind gear then sure. My view is that we should play the game within the constraints it was designed for. That’s the game! Don’t petition the devs to play the game for you while you collect purple pixels from warn out done bosses.
The point is - respec costs and having to choose a spec are there by design and so having it changed for our convenience is in effect changing the design intent behind the mechanic.
If we can do that with one thing then why not other inconvenient design elements? Doesn’t mean we will but where does the line get drawn between enough change and too much change? If we can’t argue that something is in the game by intent then we can’t really argue against any change.
It begs the question as to where do we define that it is actually TBC we want to play versus something else?
If you wanted to change something that was having an unintended impact on the game then I’d be right behind it with you.
But you’re not, you’re advocating changing something that is working exactly as intended because … because it is working exactly as intended.
By inconveniencing you through forcing you to make talent choices and commit (slightly) to a talent path and role it is doing exactly what the mechanic is designed to do.
If you like convenient to play games play something other than a remake of a 2007 grinder MMO.
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Yeah OK literally nobody would do that nobody would be in favor of this at all quite frankly you wanna talk about a way to kill the game more congratulations you just found it.
But the record no it doesn’t It’s like it or not what’s good is known and 90% of people are going to go with what’s good nobody really takes these hybrid builds.
I think the respect would be good for the game and for the record before you call me a retail player I’ve played the game sense vanilla thank you.
For 16 years So yeah
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Yeah so you play retail then?
A lot of the people who came to Classic quit sometime after or around Cata, because they didn’t like the design direction of the game. They’ve come back to re-experience what it was like to play the game when it had greater consequence for choice and more RP elements. There’s not a lot of games around like that anymore.
I don’t actually understand why people that are happy with the modern retail game would bother investing time in TBC? It’s old content. You said it yourself, you’ve done it all before. If you don’t particularly like the game mechanics of the time then I don’t see why you’re in Classic - what’s the attraction? Is it so you can rekill bosses you already know how to beat?
If I could find a game like TBC that had new boss fights I’d be there in a heartbeat. But unfortunately they don’t make games like this anymore, and even when they rerelease one a whole lot of people complain about it and beg to have fundamental game elements changed.
I don’t get it.
I think adapting the game to be for modern gamers would kill the game, because it destroys the main draw as to why anyone would want to play it. It’s a niche audience - people that like older game mechanics, but it’s a niche none the less. Rereleases like this are not general consumption games, they have a target market. Retail is the general consumption version of WoW. It’s the version of the game that has new mechanics, and new boss content and new quests. The only reason to play TBC classic is to re-experience that kind of game.
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OK 1st off let’s get something straight you sure seem to assume a lot You have this assumption that I’m one of these people from retail that love Is retail.
And agree with every single design decision that they made and I think it’s the greatest game in the world buddy you could not be further off.
2nd of all really modernizing are you joking Thirdly let me ask you this what other changes have you ever even seen seeing me suggest or get behind aside from dual speck and things that actually makes sense.
On top of that let’s talk about the same faction battlegrounds for a second that is a change but it’s Is good for the game.
I would say all the changes that blizzard has made to TB C over all are ok.
And speaking of changes let’s talk about drums for a second I mean if we’re really going with absolutely no changes do you really want the term mediterranean to be here I sure don’t I remember it it wasn’t fun.
I mean is it world Buffs No but it’s pretty close or rather the philosophy and the culture that would go around it would be.
I don’t agree with most of the decisions blizzard made as far as actual design decisions I think some of them were OK but either didn’t go far enough or is far enough or too far.
For example and I know this is a hot take I personally think the world was better after the catacles and breathing a lot of areas were just more fun.
And didn’t feel so bloody empty the biggest example I can give this is desolous and the barons.
I quested Through both of those areas I can tell you on either faction they’re both miserable and boring as I’ll get out.
But as I said that’s the only thing I would ever say I would ever say I liked about catechism I hated what they did to my class.
His holy power is an absolute stupid idea it was good for holy and nothing else and just made red in protection have added junk.
And I’m not going to go any further into that otherwise I’m just going to rent.
My point is I stuck it out why because I had faith that blizzard was going to turn it around And it’s a shame the specialization idea was cool and constanthis was cooling concept.
But they didn’t go far enough with it I think they should have had talent trees with the specialization system is gin system gives a little bit more character customization.
But again I don’t want to go on a rat every single expansion brought something good to the game depend on who you ask.
Is the most damaging features to the game as a whole lfd,lfr, Achievements.
Now if they had brought in the group finder they put in in legion the game would be in much better of a state overall.
I because the social element wouldn’t be dead Is that’s the reason I came back to classic I want to make friends you can’t do that in Retail.
Is let alone I kind of want to get away from add on of warcraft is or craft which is another thing I would say let’s talk about how many ads are average player uses now and key bindings.
Is macros not to mention weak or as which didn’t even exist back in the day so that’s why I say to recapture this feeling of 2 thousandand 7 it’s not gonna happen somebody because the way we play the game is different.
And the reason I say about the bosses yeah what I’m saying is if dual spec helps the player base if the biggest defense in battling about it is the argument that it makes the game easier.
Hate to break it to you but we’re already there you wanna make the game harder People can always just click again.
I’m a clicker I’ve always been a clicker I’ve been a clicker for 16 years I kind of missed out on the whole key binding thing And I got sick of the pressure OK you try to play this class OK here’s your list of add ons Is key bindings week aoras.
Before you even start to play your class So again dual spec would be a good change especially WI the way the game is right now and again whenever I think of a change the 1st thing I think of.
How can people abuse this what’s the worst possible consequence to the game overall that could happen.
And as I said earlier if the worst thing that happens your top gilis are top guilds even somewhat semi hardcore guilds.
Say for Is a grand total of Maybe 4 boss fights say Is for this specific fight if you’re this class you have to have these 2 specific specs Is at least gives people the idea of trying tanks and healers.
Is which by the way there’s a shortage of right now in speaking from someone’s point of view that plays as a tank by the way.
Yesterday I have a lot of healer friends that say the same thing farming’s farming’s a nightmare And not every single person has time to love is has time to level up an alt go through that reputation grind again.
I’m not saying reputation should be made easier I’m not saying the arena grind should go away I’m not seeing any of the grinds should go away even the profession stuff which for the record I have my own opinions on.
I’m saying is a feature that makes healers is healer’s and tank’s lives easier and pvpers.
Is lives just easier that’s OK in my opinion heaven forbid that healers can farm in a decent rate.
And to be real for a minute if I had my way the only actual changes I personally would make to tbc Dual spec, and Is wrath classes.
Is Y overall especially around DPS His class balance was at its absolute best Is the damage disparity between the best and worst DPS.
Is with the exception of bm,fm,and Subtlety rogue and thos wer pvp Specs for the record like they are now.
Best DPS was 18k Is worst wise 11k Is not the exact numbers but yeah.
And Is make hit a little bit easier for tanks to get That’s it so yeah.
So yeah I’m not here to destroy the game but when I see something that could make the game better I’m going to say my piece on it.
And in case you haven’t noticed I’m not the only person that feels that way
No I don’t. I assume that what you said is true, that you’ve played for 16 years straight. I don’t assume you love Retail. I wasn’t using retail as an insult but rather, to describe the current release of the game.
But I do assume that it is the version of the game that gets new content and adapts to modern market demands.
If anything Is assume it does that badly, otherwise why would loyal fans be in classic as their main game?
I’m similar, I don’t like where retail went. In fact WoTLK was where they took a path I didn’t like. But if I had a game with TBC game mechanics and new bosses I’d be right there!
Classic exists from a financial perspective to pull in new subs. Ostensibly those who ditched wow in the past.
If you’ve played for 16 years straight your not adding a sub fee by playing classic.
It depends on which feature we’re talking about Of everything that they have implemented and to the game over time I can say the probably the best thing that they have ever put in was dual spec.
And yes I’ll say it was even better than Tri spec or quadspeck for some classes His back gives people player choice.
Dual spec gives players choice waste if you give them The Choice to take in switch between everything then there is no choice.
And that’s why I’m in favor of it And yeah I’m not gonna lie you have a point but my point is just because the game is garbage now doesn’t mean that everything they put in was bad.
Aside from the Is raids That’s the only thing I will ever consistently compliment retail and World of Warcraft as a whole the raids are always amazing but that it
Sure I get that. I’m not trying to be a smart @## when I say this, it’s a choice we already have in TBC classic. It just costs some time and gold each time. It’s meant to be somewhat inconvenient so people don’t switch willy nilly, but it’s also meant to be a choice.
we should also remove the ability of mages to teleport. players should not be able to ignore the laws of physics.
I’ve changed my mind. Respecs should be free. Go to your trainer, pay nothing, redo your talent points. Have fun. Try something silly, experiment. The limitations and cost involved punish players for trying to be different. When Blizzard or anyone else criticizes the old talent point system because “everyone just googles the best builds and uses those” they ignore the fact the system is literally designed to discourage you from trying anything new. It’s a similar problem with conduits in retail - but that’s a whole other can of worms.
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gold buying to respec? really? lol… You can make the respec cost back in minutes
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Well, the modern gamer works 8 hours a day, studies 8 hours a day, and has no idea how to use contraception thus accounting for the rest of the time. They therefore have loads of money and no time to spend it all. So with their 5 minutes a week free time they buy up big purple pixels and respecs in WoW TBC classic - retail has new bosses and is too time consuming.
This is the first time I’ve read the blizzard forums since I used to play back in 2006. I can’t tell if these posts are just meant to be sarcasm or if they actually are serious? So much negativity, it’s nauseating to read. If you despise the game this much, maybe try something else out?
“Universal support” to remove the option to respec? No, I’ve never heard anyone suggest this because it is an awful idea. I don’t want to play the same style forever. I’m at the point where I can only upgrade my guy through raids so after my guild clears the raids for the week I’d like to still play the game without just tanking the same heroics for the 50th time. So I’ll respec arms for a weekend or fury to dps a heroic for a change.
If I didn’t have the option to do that I don’t think I’d want to play the game after awhile.
Maybe the way the game was played back in 2007 originally But this kind of just comes with time like it or not people are Is more goal oriented now and like it or not there’s a lot of things that people know now that we didn’t back then.
I’m gonna use my class as an example powder tanks back in the day you were a healer if you were a paladin that was what people thought is what people thought and I know it because I try to ask to be ADP S because I was excited to try it.
Pretty much everybody’s opinion was no you’re a poutin You heal that’s what you do On top of that Warriors and rogues were very much still regarded as top DPS.
And pray much this is another difference back in the day the only If you were APVP or you generally didn’t PVE But this comes with time and knowledge we know now the 2 are kind of needed.
For example I know all of my best and slot weapons pretty much come from pvp I don’t like it.
And I also say anybody that plays a healer or a tank to quest or the farm it’s a nightmare and on top of that you have to try and make more money because you have to take that physically is at 50 gold into account every single time.
So if something gets screwed up or things don’t go right are you and I’m just getting well farmed out and a word.
You may just be making that 50 gold and that’s it so essentially you accomplished nothing.
So yeah That’s why I’m advocating for dual speck Is because quite frankly I just think the game should have had it by default it makes the game better.
And again as if stated beforehand many times And as you even pointed out The absolute worst thing that can happen.
Is is that the top guilds require one extra layer of sweatiness Oh no the top guilt require you to have a secondary PV secondary PVE speck for certain bosses to kill it faster.
I mean honestly But if it helps all those healers and tanks and who knows maybe even would encourage some people to try those roles.
I say yes please give it to us I would put dual speck on the same Is category as Guild banks.
That’s where I would put it
Not only are you wrong, but this is exactly what the devs wanted.
Think about it, why would they start respecs cheap then continually increase the price unless you don’t respec for at least a month?
The 50g respec was designed to lock you into your spec, while allowing a few respecs when you’re still learning the game, and the option to respec periodically if you truly want to try something new.
It was absolutely not intended for people to respec two+ times a week to switch between PvP and raids. And the fact that people can and do respec between raid bosses is an aberration that must be stopped.
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OK 1st off I think it’s funny you say few respects are weak I know people that have to respect as much as 3 times a week is 3 times a week sometimes more.
Is secondly there is a very easy solution to this Just make it so you can’t respect in raids because originally not a lot of people remember this.
You couldn’t Is the original implementation of dual respect was you could respect in cities in the outside world dungeons and that was it you couldn’t respect in Is raids.
But I’m gonna go back for a minute and here’s the thing how many fights is that going to matter realistically Maybe for any entire expansion.
Is the truth is realistically 99% of the time if Can’t kill a boss without dual speck you can’t kill it with.
I want to respect mainly to help tanks and healers help to quest And farm And for people that want to jump into PVPI think it’s a stupid restriction.
And I would make an argument that I don’t think the developers put that much thought into that.
I really think it was meant to be intended as a gold sink Because at some point Is inflation gets to such a point it’s ridiculous and we’re seeing that now the problem is.
Is the difference between your average player and your sweaty player the gold is ridiculously higher.
On top of that gold is extremely cheap to buy and blizzard won’t do anything about people selling gold or buying it.
But it’s an oxymoron because if there’s more taxes in the game Hey guess what that’s going Make people want to buy gold more.
Is on top of that BC is the last expansion where you could literally buy power literally buy it.
Is so yeah I say #Dual’s back And honestly if it’s really such a big deal with the whole rate thing just make it so you can’t respect in raids done.
But again it shouldn’t be that big of a deal because the bosses are easy anyway Dual spec does not give you this huge advantage you think it does.
Is like realistically it just doesn’t It’s helpful yes it gives you a little bit more flexibility and makes you a little bit more toolboxy but just because your dual spec it doesn’t mean you’re gonna go from needing 5 people to do a dungeon till you be able to solo it.
Besides if you’ve ever watched an interview with Kevin Jordan which by the way was the main designer.
The reason they put that in was Is for a gold sink on top of that There is a lot of things that they just did not assume.
World bucks for example Is he never intended people for those to be used in raids well look what happened there.
As far as changes goes let’s talk about stuff that wasn’t in the game as a hole Is the nerf to drums that didn’t come into wrath, Is same faction battlegrounds that are going to be coming it’s going to be coming in that wasn’t in just the game until wod, Is the professions change So you can’t keep switching your professions and getting the jewel cracker gems and the ring Is enchant.
Is all changes but all good changes in my opinion Is so yeah Again I say #DualSpec