The irony is that often the DH is main target in lower lobbies… that math does change at higher rating. That said. The same problem is happening from manay melee classes below, i would say 1700ish mmr.
And it goes back to the oppressive melee (not spec specific) against the gotta-run casters. Melee cry about caster lobbies (i rarely ever get caster lobbies on my DH), and casters crying about melee lobbies (i literally get melee lobbies 4 out of 6 lobbies)…
Part of what distorts the issue is just how saturated the lower lobbies are with melee… and bad melee at that. The only thing going for them is that 2 melee will always be able to outlast a single caster… especially when non-cast CC are at a minimal.
My boomkin is fairing so much better against melee trains. Partly cause the toolkit is better, and the rest is because i had to get so good at running/kiting that having a caster class that can actually self-sustain almost feels busted in comparison. I actually kind of feel bad for melee now in my lobbies. Should be able to hit 1800 tonight, with less than 200 games total. Then i can see how the other half live.
Hard disagree. Sure, there times where the DH team is able to blast the opposing team, but since they are quite ausceptible to be being bursted inside of stuns… often all you do is bait them to LoS their healer (which isnt hard btw) and then gun them down.
I love it when people say, “hur hur just cc the DH”, but I play a boomy, I have 1 root dr, 1 stun dr, and 1 cyclone dr. I have to use the stun to get the clone off, and I can’t use the root on the DH because he’ll just vault out of it and by the time it’s back off DR to root him again, he’ll just vault out of it again. So rooting a DH is virtually useless.
And if I try to bash clone the DH off me, 1. I’m not root beam cloning the healer, and 2. Clone only lasts 6 seconds, if I get trinket cool, but I have to wait for DR to get off another clone on the DH. And hopefully by the time DR’s over the DH has flown around the arena 15 times cleaving absolutely everything in its path. And this isn’t even mentioning trying to get the clone off on the DH while he’s in the bash, because you still have to try and bait a precog out of his teammates if your team doesn’t cc them at the same time. And if you don’t get that precog in that small 4 sec stun window, DH is just free to go about his normal business of cranking 90s on everything within a nuclear strike’s range.
Running into Hero Cleave (Havoc+Unholy) in 3s or solos rn which is the predominant comp currently due to the meta, playing literally any caster is a nightmare.
If anything going forward, regardless of number tuning, they absolutely HAVE to remove all these stupid, baked into their rotation, immunity frames from DH. It makes the class as a whole so much more oppressive and I can’t count the amount of bad DH that just randomly immune big CCs coming their way just cuz they happen to glimpse or go meta.
I agree with this thread and the first comment. Dragonflight ended up suffering from the attempt to make classes rounded like in MoP. The DH problem is the Ret 10.1.7 problem. If they are mosquitos, they shouldn’t hit like trucks and vice versa.
At this stage of the xpak+season, when people ask me who the killtarget is, I say “the one with the least immunities” and that usually ends up being the right call.
In addition, NPCs (pets, demons, totems) are also FAR too numerous, oppressive and disruptive.
The clutter and chaos should be adressed starting with at least one aspect of bloat. Damage, mobility, utility, cooldowns… Anything! Just pick a poison
The unpruning should have been done more carefully. At the very least, I hope that PvP will see more balancing modifiers, testing and feedback hoops starting in the next expansion…
MM vs caster lobbies is somewhat broken af. You can accidentally kill a mage. But this is completely nulled out by the fact MM can’t do literally anything in melee lobbies
Yes, they gutted that… But there’s still Blur, Darkness, Glimpse (backflip immunity), Meta, and Netherwalk. Did I forget anything?
Why does every class need x10 of the same thing and to always have an answer?
DF design throws out skill and promotes zug unless you’re used to competing at AWC level.
The participation and stagnation are enough evidence, esp. after Devs claim there is no artificial MMR cap.
The guy plays boomie, the tankiest caster in the game at the moment, with the best CC in the game, with some of the highest damage in the game and comes to complain about DH? what do you want man? for DH to stand still in your roots taking all your dmg?
I’ve seen really good boomies, tanking damage from war/dk/rogue/ww/mm/DH and still winning the round.
Druids are kind of funny things:
best healer in the game: check
best caster in the game: check
best tank in the game: check
one of the best melees in the game when it has a little buff: check
Hold up.
Boomy is great rn, and downright broken when paired with a sub rogue and still easily S tier with a DH and Demo lock. However, boomy is FAR from the tankiest caster. Lock, ele, and spriest are all significantly more tanky and mage is still harder to kill. Boomy actually has the lowest self-healing out of every non-hunter class in the game.
Cyclone is definitely the best cc in the game bar kidney/dance+cheap shot, no disagreements there
Resto druid is undisputably the best healer in the game. Casters are all situational and very strong, but boomy is definitely not the best overall.
Guardian druid is awful, so idk where on earth you got that.
Feral is actually fine and very strong offensively, but does struggle without support from another strong caster like dev or destro.
Yes. Thats true of mmr and how it works. It also flexes in both directions, so if you 0-6 on purpose, your mmr will tank and it will take more than one lobby to recover that.
You did not. If you were to test this, you would make an alt, and after every lobby you played seriously, you would intentionally go 0-6 the next one to try and climb as you and the other poster suggested.
Yeah, if you play bad and lose some lobbies, then play well and end up net positive in your wins overall, your cr should increase. That’s literally always been true and has nothing to do with intentionally throwing games.
I’m saying there is more to it then just that, but simply speaking, yes you can do this.
I really don’t want to argue to much about this since you seem firm in your opinion. Totally fine! I think you can game the system though. With how MMR works, it can have a negative impact if you ‘level’ off relative to your rating. Part of the reason I made the alt hunter was to show just how much positive MMR I could generate while pushing. Winning successive low matches can translate as you move up.
For example…
If you’re an 1800 player and your last few games you go 50/50, your MMR levels off. What happens if instead, your last few games to 1800… you won all of them. You had some good queues, whatever. You’re still in the same range, but because you built up substantial padding in your MMR, you could now potentially take a loss or two with no loss to your CR and still push slightly higher. As I said, you’re not going to be far off from where your target CR likely will be, but you could probably push +100 or more.
You’re artificially creating a buffer. Each time you drop down, you’re building back up. It’s like resetting the board of a game. You toss the dice again and this time you get better results. It doesn’t always work out. You could go down the exact same path and end up and the same exact rating. Or, you could string together some wins against some lower experience players and build in that extra padding.
This is true of EVERY SINGLE LOBBY. Whether you win or lose. What you keep saying is that it is beneficial to climb to lose lobbies first to “get easier lobbies and increase the chances of climbing” that is not how that works. What do you not understand?
Not sure why this needs to go beyond that.