Locking stable flying but not skyriding to pathfinder is stupid

[Garthekhan-icecrown]

@Antiman-bloodhoof

Blizzard has taken feedback and acted on it, they provide options/things to reduce the effects of whatever it is they have issues with, in this case skyriding. One thing many here seem to forget is it is Blizzards game, they will do what they can to provide for all kinds of players while keeping true to their vision of what they want the game to be. Fact is without Blizzard the game would not exist, same an be said if the game had no players. This is why COMPROMISE is key…

so you agree with me entirely. thanks. thats all you had to say.

@Antiman-bloodhoof

@Garthekhan-icecrown

you don’t get to speak on other peoples behalf like that my dude.

Neither do you, nor does anyone else in this thread.

me acknowledging that there is a huge portion of the population that STILL can’t use dragon riding because THEY STILL get sick…acknowledging that isn’t me speaking for them you tool, its just me making that point that there are people with problems that the person responding to me just simply ignored.

@Antiman-bloodhoof

Not debating this beyond it can sound like “Blizzard is ignoring feedback because they don’t do things the exact way players want”.

not it at all. Not even slightly.
Hiding basic modes of transportation shouldn’t be locked behind achievements.
Thus my idea to just make all flying a gold sink and call it good. The fewest problems possible, the easiest path, teh smartest path, the most logical path…

Then they can "hold true to their ‘visio’ of what WoW " is. Making it a gold sink doesn’t take away from anybody or anything. Well, except gold.

@Antiman-bloodhoof

Not to mention, she tries to speak for all who are disabled like her. Ones like here are just as likely to be out for themselves in the long run.

again, people acknowledging that other people also have a problem is just basic human compassion, not “speaking” for anybody. you can’t just use terms inappropriately like that, it’s confusing to the rest of us.
speaking for other people would be “I know how all us people with lupus can be, am I right?”…just saying that there are people with lupus is not speaking for them, it’s acknowledging.

@Zootzoot-argent-dawn

Agreed. But that same solution works for dragon riding which is why these claims are spurious IMO

its not spurious. Your solution is

@Antiman-bloodhoof

Well, it is possible, with the right mouse/keyboard to get to a point one can play most, if not all, the content they do one handed, might not be high end content or anything, but it is possible.

the tauren is talking about people with disabilities having problems using the mouse and keyboard at times.

YOU are trying to equate motion sickness to an inability to use the mouse and keyboard.
Two entirely seperate problems. Blizzard has already done just about everything they can to help people out who are like missing a finger or have other problems. As the tauren said.

But the motion sickness is still a problem for a lot of people. and people are speaking and it seems, from the comments in those threads, that a lot of people are still experiencing that problem.

It’s got nothing to do with them being able to use the mouse and keyboard or having trouble moving. ITs motion sickness. Maybe look it up, because you seem utterly confused as to what the problem is.

And again, hiding it behind an achievement when so many people are still getting motion sickness…its just rude. And that’s part of what people are saying.

[Antiman-bloodhoof]

@Garthekhan-icecrown

again, people acknowledging that other people also have a problem is just basic human compassion, not “speaking” for anybody. you can’t just use terms inappropriately like that, it’s confusing to the rest of us.
speaking for other people would be “I know how all us people with lupus can be, am I right?”…just saying that there are people with lupus is not speaking for them, it’s acknowledging.

We have acknowledged that some people have issues, we point out the options they have, like going via ground as well as argued that people that really have these issues should be accounted for. What we have gotten in return is attacked, degraded, accused of wanting to treat disabled people as second class citizens, and more.

Also, Moused has come across as if all disabled people are like here, going beyond acknowledgement and soundling more like “I have these issues, so all that are disabled will have these issues” She has even gone as far as appearing to weaponize disabilities against those of us that disagree with her.

@Garthekhan-icecrown

But the motion sickness is still a problem for a lot of people. and people are speaking and it seems, from the comments in those threads, that a lot of people are still experiencing that problem.

And these things do take time to implement, and if steady flight is available, and can be earned without issue via ground, then Blizzard might not see it as an issue outside of dungeons like the Dawnbreaker.

Tell me, which is rude from the view of all sides:
Hiding steady behind an achievement when people are getting motion sickness
Complaining about having to deal with motion sickness when, if it is caused by dynamic flight, they can avoid it entirely by going via ground

I can see the first being rude to players, no questions asked, but the second can come across like “you are not doing things our way/you are not giving us the option we want” to devs, more or less telling them that it is pointless to provide options unless they include the one some players want, rude indeed.

[Quivermethis-rexxar]

@Garthekhan-icecrown

me acknowledging that there is a huge portion of the population that STILL can’t use dragon riding because THEY STILL get sick

Tbh I wouldn’t go with this since you can’t prove it, but I agree with a lot of your points.

@Garthekhan-icecrown

people acknowledging that other people also have a problem is just basic human compassion, not “speaking” for anybody. you can’t just use terms inappropriately like that, it’s confusing to the rest of us.

I would agree, but because I know who they are talking about. I can’t.
They’ve been using their disability as ammunition to throw their opinion around. They think because they claim they have a disability, they can say whatever. And if you disgree, then you lack empathy, compassion, are a bully. Etc.

Its been a major problem in these pathfinder threads. I myself have disabilities, but I wouldn’t hold them against others or use that as my battle cry. And we can’t forget the age old ‘but mah disability!’ we’ve seen thrown around countless times in the 3k posts.

[Antiman-bloodhoof]

@Quivermethis-rexxar

I would agree, but because I know who they are talking about. I can’t.

Really, if most of the side for removing pathfinder were like him, I would have zero issue debating.

I am not physically disabled, nor do I get motion sickness, but even I can say I am disabled (autism, a mental/social/developmental disability) but even though I am autistic, I can still be empathetic and compassionate even if I have issues communicating such at times.

[Zootzoot-argent-dawn]

@Garthekhan-icecrown

me acknowledging that there is a huge portion of the population that STILL can’t use dragon riding because THEY STILL get sick

LOL how are you acknowledging something for which you have no data genius?

[Zootzoot-argent-dawn]

@Garthekhan-icecrown

It’s got nothing to do with them being able to use the mouse and keyboard or having trouble moving. ITs motion sickness.

You keep missing that we’re not talking about motion sickness bro.

@Garthekhan-icecrown

Also,

@Evilperiod-aggramar

Motion sickness is not the only problem some people face with dragonriding; Many people have gone in and out of this and other threads talking about limitations.

There’s motion sickness and then there are those who claim they can’t Sky Ride because of a disability yet somehow have no issue playing the rest of the game. You pointed it out yourself.

[Nayaga-lightbringer (Nayaga)]

@Antiman-bloodhoof

We have had disabled people come into this thread and say it does not matter to them.

Not all disabilities are the same.

[Nayaga-lightbringer (Nayaga)]

@Zootzoot-argent-dawn

@Garthekhan-icecrown

dragon riding caused motion sickness.

And if there are still issues even with all the options turned on and players aren’t reporting them that’s on them.

Yes we are reporting our problems with motion sickness and Skyriding. Here is one example: Skyriding and motion sickness

[Nayaga-lightbringer (Nayaga)]

@Zootzoot-argent-dawn

That’s spurious. How does someone function as a player in other aspects of the game if they’re incapable using their mouse and a couple of buttons?

Like how does someone who can’t use Sky Riding actually fight mobs in dungeons, raids and the open world since both require using your mouse and keyboard.

Some people with a KB and mouse can clear Mythic raids, other can’t even complete a heroic dungeon. Not everyones skill with KB and mice is the same.

It’s not a matter of “Get Gud”. I love golf, I played the most when Tiger Woods dominated the game… No matter how much I practiced, paid for lessons and played the game, I would never remotely come close to Tiger’s skill. Again, not everyone has the same skills.

[Jarnock-moon-guard]

@Garthekhan-icecrown

dragonriding was designed to slow us down. One mistake and you are grounded for a solid minute

So stop making mistakes, idk what to tell you. I don’t have this problem.

[Garthekhan-icecrown]

@Antiman-bloodhoof

What we have gotten in return is attacked, degraded, accused of wanting to treat disabled people as second class citizens, and more.

nobody said those things that I saw, an not me. So stop talking to me about it.

@Antiman-bloodhoof

And these things do take time to implement,

nobody said it was going to be done tomorrow.

@Antiman-bloodhoof

Tell me, which is rude from the view of all sides:
Hiding steady behind an achievement when people are getting motion sickness
Complaining about having to deal with motion sickness when, if it is caused by dynamic flight, they can avoid it entirely by going via ground

I think the most rude thing is how dumb your proposition is.
You think this:

@Antiman-bloodhoof

if it is caused by dynamic flight, they can avoid it entirely by going via ground

because steady flying is the same speed right?
I am sure that people LOVE being stuck on the ground just because they get motion sickness from a particular style of flying…

Or, how about just make both flying forms be a gold sink. no pointless achievements. No need for that especially when there are still so many people getting sick.
Your solution being on par with “if you are homeless, just buy a home silly”…that’s not the problem and you know it.

They shouldn’t have to be relegated to the slowest form of travel just becaues the devs demand that we see everything first. Some people just don’t care. It’s not for you or the devs to say that people have to see the content. They paid, they can play howver they choose to as long as it’s not affecting other people.

@Antiman-bloodhoof

I can see the first being rude to players, no questions asked, but the second can come across like “you are not doing things our way/you are not giving us the option we want” to devs, more or less telling them that it is pointless to provide options unless they include the one some players want, rude indeed.

not at all. not in the slightest. Its not telling the devs to not put things in, thats childish logic at best. “Well if you don’t want to see my rock collection then I don’t want to be your friend anymore” with these all or nothing scenarios of doom.

They can leave both flight styles locked behind a simple gold sink. No need for cheevos, everybody wins. There is no downside to this idea.

[Garthekhan-icecrown]

@Nayaga-lightbringer

Yes we are reporting our problems with motion sickness and Skyriding. Here is one example: Skyriding and motion sickness

hey, how dare you confront people with evidence that contradicts their insane and absurd version of reality where motion sickness = not having fingers or trying to just take the easiest path through a problem.
Hiding the standard flying behind an achievement, of any difficulty level, is just insane as op said. Dragon riding makes a lot of people sick still. They should not have to be stuck on the ground just becaues they are human and get motion sickness lol, because regular flying isn’t making them sick. So they locked regular flying behind a cheevo and then put the flight form that makes a lot of people sick out for free.

IT’s just ignorant.

[Nayaga-lightbringer (Nayaga)]

@Garthekhan-icecrown

Dragon riding makes a lot of people sick still. They should not have to be stuck on the ground just becaues they are human and get motion sickness lol.

As I’ve said before, no game feature used for accessibility should be gated behind an achievement.

[Garthekhan-icecrown]

Right? Next they are going to ask that the color blind options to be hidden behind Ahead of The Curve.

Standard FLight = Gold sink. Win.
Dragonriding = Gold sink. Win.
It’s literally a win-win, nobody loses, everybody wins, we all have the features we need to go abot our game-day and we can go back to ignoring each other in peace.

[Antiman-bloodhoof]

@Nayaga-lightbringer

Not all disabilities are the same.

Not saying they are, but does that excuse:
X: I’m disabled in A way but this issue does not bother me (keep in and mind A could be close to or the same disability otehrs have)
Y: Your disability does not count then, , in fact I am not sure you are disabled at all.

This creates the idea that there is a hierarchy of disabilities, why should my disability be any less then yours or Moused’s? Why should those that have learned how to make the sweetest lemonade out of the sourest lemons be treated as subhuman just cause we took a different attitude towards disabilities?

@Garthekhan-icecrown

nobody said those things that I saw

This thread is how long? it can be eays to miss things

@Garthekhan-icecrown

Your solution being on par with “if you are homeless, just buy a home silly”

Bzzz, it would be if you are homeless and on the street, find the closest shelter. The argument frim some, not you, but some comes across more like “if you are homeless, demand to be given a mansion to live in without paying for it”.

@Garthekhan-icecrown

They can leave both flight styles locked behind a simple gold sink. No need for cheevos, everybody wins. There is no downside to this idea.

See, if more argued for this, there likely would not be all this rigmarole over the achievement, and I’d be agreeing with you fully. I was doing nothing more then pointing out how some from one side has treated the others. This has created bad blood for all, so do you mind if I add one other thing to your idea?

Steady flight: gold sink or quest/quest chain at 8s
Dynamic Flight: gold sink or quest/quest chain at 80

All have to go through the campaign and leveling process on the ground, same as it was in BC, Wrath and MoP.

[Quivermethis-rexxar]

@Garthekhan-icecrown

nobody said those things that I saw, an not me. So stop talking to me about

@Garthekhan-icecrown

hey, how dare you confront people with evidence that contradicts their insane and absurd version of reality

Yikes. You clearly aren’t here to even try to talk about this amicably.

Sad because I gave you a chance. You ingored me and proceeded to do exactly what were talking about lol.

@Garthekhan-icecrown

IT’s just ignorant

Your takes? Agreed. Oh well +1 to the toxic ‘but muh disability’ crowd.

[Casandora-stormrage]

2957 post and still going and not one word from Blizzard. What a bunch of BS.

[Nayaga-lightbringer (Nayaga)]

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Your takes? Agreed. Oh well +1 to the toxic ‘but muh disability’ crowd.

People on both sides of the Steady Flight topic have been toxic.

[Garthekhan-icecrown]

@Antiman-bloodhoof

“if you are homeless, demand to be given a mansion to live in without paying for it”.

LOLOL yeah, asking to be able to use standard flight so they don’t get nauseous.
How rude and entitled of them to just want to play the game they are paying for. Definately the same thing as asking for free houses.

@Antiman-bloodhoof

See, if more argued for this, there likely would not be all this rigmarole over the achievement, and I’d be agreeing with you fully.

so you agree with m e fully, because thats what I have been advocating from my first post in here…you just didn’t read it well enough.

@Antiman-bloodhoof

All have to go through the campaign and leveling process on the ground, same as it was in BC, Wrath and MoP

naw. just needed the gold. And max level. Don’t remember any story or cheevo requirements. People are paying to play this game. They are under no law that decrees they must see every quest of a story…they have the right to just run aruond with no armor fighting squirrels in Redridge and taking flight patters to the Isle of Quel’danas just to wave at a demon and then fly back to Ironforge for a cold brew.
You don’t get to dictate that to them.

Flight is not a privelage. I’ts not a right. its just a basic feature of the game. You don’t have to do achievements for any other kind of travel…so why this one?
It’s juts absurd and backwards to think the way you do because it just doesn’t jive with reality most of the time.

Flight never hurt anybodies immersion. If anything it just deepened it because you really felt like a champion. literally above it all taking a better vantage point so you could fight the scourge. Or the Scarlett Crusade. Or some dragons…
THe only people who seemed to be actually affected by the introduction of flight are the bots / mat farmers who just grind them ores all day every day. Everbody else just got to have more fun exploring all the secret little places they had always wanted to go, like the fishing hole by Stormwind that you see every time you take a flight east lol.
Every year, every expansion, some new person comes in arguing against some aspect of flight, and they always have some lame reason and logic behind why they don’t like it, and it almost always sums up with what you said, pretending its some kind of entitlement vs just asking for a feature to be standard so that people can go back to playing THEIR way intstead of the way some random developers THINK you should be playing.

It’s not up to them, or you, or me. It’s up to the person paying their sub. IF they want to have flying and just run around the skies randomly dropping in on alliance settlements to wreak havoc and then fly off and do it again three zones over? Thats on them.
I like how you started off pretending to “white knight” and tell people “you don’t speak for others” and then turn around and say some Fun Police crap like this.

[Garthekhan-icecrown]

@Quivermethis-rexxar

@Garthekhan-icecrown

hey, how dare you confront people with evidence that contradicts their insane and absurd version of reality

Yikes. You clearly aren’t here to even try to talk about this amicably.

Sad because I gave you a chance. You ingored me and proceeded to do exactly what were talking about lol.

I make a joke with you, and I am toxic…okay. Makes no sense, but sure.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Sad because I gave you a chance.

psycho talk because I only responded to you ever once, and it was in a joke while being on your side and agreeing with me.
So you gave me a chance to disagree with you? I am confused, and I think you are too.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

ou ingored me and proceeded to do exactly what were talking about lol.

I never talked to you until I made the joke you didn’t get…

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Oh well +1 to the toxic ‘but muh disability’ crowd

what?
motion sickness is not a disability…it just means they can’t use dragonriding. They can still move and play and do regular flying.
Nobody is talking about whatever you think you are talking about…