No, you didn’t. You repeatedly said “I want to use Thunder Clap,” and when suggested that you take talents that benefit Thunder Clap, you responded “I don’t want to use Whirlwind,” which is a nonsensical reply.
I’ve tried to help you clarify the issue, but if you can’t present a coherent position, then your feedback is unlikely to be taken seriously.
It is a discussion forum. I asked a question and you responded, but nobody is forcing you to do so. If you don’t want to talk about it, just don’t engage!
This thread clearly shows that a lot of people either don’t understand the mechanics or aren’t familiar with the changes, which is understandable considering the limited amount of time to test them. Some things also may appear to be problems at first glance, before realizing a solution is already present, so yes, there is inherent value in open forum discussion, whether it advances your personal agenda or not.
It’s not a thread for arguements, it’s a thread for feedback. Arch isn’t being aggressive he’s explaining how the whirlwind talents BUFF thunderclap without you needing to use whirlwind, you don’t even need it on your bar. By taking these talents, they make your thunderclap better.
And it’s fine if you like playing your own unique way, no one is forcing you to play a meta.
But playing a way blizzard isn’t designing the class to be played and then getting angry at people who write guides around the way this spec is designed to be played isn’t helpful to the moderators who take this feedback back to the dev team.
Please be respectful and don’t argue outside of DMs, it’s counter-productive for everyone here.
Okay then, let me be very specific. I don’t want to take the talents on the right side. I am planning on taking Mountain Thane to take Thunder Clap instead of having Whirlwind on my bar. I also don’t care about whether the talents on the right buff Thunder Clap since my primary focus is trying to max out Bloodthirst with my SMF build.
To max out BT, I need to essentially take everything on the left side, plus the 3 in the middle that do stuff with RB and Rampage, since they have some added benefits to BT.
The thing that is very annoying to me is that I also was using Odyn’s Fury, with it being on the left side, and now suddenly I cannot take Odyn’s Fury while also maximizing my Bloodthirst benefits because I will need to “waste” talents on things I don’t want to focus on in the first place. I even edited the original post to remove the mention of Thunder Clap since you seemed to think that’s everything my post was about, when it had really nothing to do with anything.
Here’s a build that gets every single talent in the tree with any mention or synergy at all with bloodthirst and also gets Odyn’s Fury. You even have 1 extra talent point to put anywhere you like. I’m not sure why you’d want to play such an abomination of a build, but to each their own. Theres some missing fundamentals of fury in there (like Improved Execute), but based on looking at the talent builds saved on your profile, you weren’t even using those in your SMF BT build anyway. You have to take massacre for this build, which might annoy you, but again, Bloodthirst is at full power, so it shouldn’t affect your goals.
Regardless, you’ve made your point now. Maybe the devs will listen, but god I hope not. In the future, it may help to post an image of a build you play on live so that Archi or anyone for that matter can help you more easily without having to guess at your goals/intentions since they were not made particularly clear to me or anyone else based on your descriptions.
Feel free to swap to Reckless Abandon / Powerful Enrage / Dancing Blades if you prefer those.
Also I don’t suppose we could get a bit of an update on what thoughts if any might be going into changes for any of the specs or General talent (If any) trees before the end of the beta beyond numbers tuning and ensuring things are interacting as possible. The last few build versions we’ve seen haven’t seen much in terms of changes for warrior save for the bladestorm related talents and intervenes new reflecting spells addition.
Mostly I’m wanting to know what internal thoughts are and or changes that may be being worked on as of right now so future feedback in between doesn’t double down on things dev’s have already changed or are in the process of changing on internal builds.
I’m specifically meaning towards more utility / movement sort of talents or perhaps if any buff towards Rally cry is being considered?
I want to echo what others have already pointed out, Critical Thinking’s second bonus is pretty meaningless now that Raging Blow is a weaker filler ability.
Mountain Thane:
Burst of Power randomly creates a weird and awkward gameplay. Changing it to just passively reduce the cooldown of Bloodthirst would make for a smoother, more fun experience.
Nerf Warrior healing. They shouldn’t be healing more than a resto druid. They’re not even a hybrid class and they’re healing passively and actively like a truck.
Warrior does no real healing, only self healing.
And if a resto druid does less healing than a warrior does, that’s just because they’re terrible at resto druid.
I’ve never come close to out healing a resto druid in a boss fight or a key. Warriors very much do NOT need healing nerfs lol
Very likely a bad resto druid has sat this example for him. I’ve ran into some resto druids that don’t pre-hot anything, they wait for damage to come out and regrowth spam
Yeah, Resto Druids aren’t at all about reactive healing. It’s all preventative. I really only have experience with Resto and Holy Priests, so I couldn’t say what the other healers’ deals are.
And this is something that annoys me about these forums. It doesn’t matter what you say on here, people will just look at your profile and discount your opinion entirely.
Like if I said I don’t like Ravager for whatever reason, someone will look at my profile, see I don’t have it, and say “Well you didn’t take it anyway, so problem solved!” and ignore anything beyond that. It’s all snarky replies and talking down to others because you don’t do what everyone else does.
Case in point.
I’m done here though, not worth offering any more feedback for me since it will just be ignored, as SMF has been for 15 years.
I just want to give my little bit of feedback for what it’s worth.
This is from pretty casual, if I do main warrior I am just an AOTC and M+ for the mount and what not.
I was sad to see the annihilator/storm of swords go the way of the dodo; more so annihilator. But have recently discovered part of that playstyle lives on through Mountain Thane (Thunderclap essentially replacing WW on a short cd). It gives good cadence to the playstyle and for that I enjoy it very much.
Couple of things I do not care for is Anger Management desync with Avatar, Thunderous Roar, or Champion’s Spear. Honestly rework Anger Management to just make Recklessness, Bladestorm, and Ravager on a 45 second cd to better sync up with cd’s.
I have a love/hate relationship with Reckless Abandon as well, I do like the changes you implemented but find myself often over capping on Fury when I pop it. Prolly just me, once again I am casual.
The tier set to me feels very meh, and honestly most tier sets look the same way being first tier in the new expansion, which is fine all together, but through testing I actually didn’t find myself pressing Raging Blow nearly enough for the tier set to be good, so as a 4 set it felt extremely weak. Would feel better the other way around that BT increases RB dmg stacking up to X amount since we cast a lot more BT’s than RB’s.
Warrior could also use some more group utility. Either aoe silence, or maybe a suck all the enemies in on bladestorm/ravager type of thing.
Pls change Depths of Insanity, it’s just a bad talent IMO.
This probably won’t change. I believe the intent is for the tier set to just be a % passive increase in season 1 because of the emphasis being more on the hero talent combinations and keep things simple, and it’ll likely become more interesting and complicated as the seasons go on.
But you also have to understand that this game isn’t based around people playing odd-ball builds for funs sake, most things are balanced around certain playstyles and synergies and some things just don’t work together. You’re free to play what you want and it may seem passive aggressive when someone says something like.
But it’s likely from a standpoint of this person plays at a upper casual / high / Competitive level and your choices make no logical sense to them as the spec isn’t balanced that way. Again you are free to play how-ever you want, just don’t take comments like this to heart, and keep your mind open to understanding most don’t play the way they want, they play the way that numerically works the best because they want to push leaderboards, earn cosmetics or just not be the arrow in the knee of their party.
I do agree it would be cool if they could make SMF work it just historally never has found proper balance. At this point I think they’re better off just making it cosmetic and letting warriors transmog between 1h/2h weapons freely for the visual fantasy.
This is true, though somewhat ancillary, since it’s not really about optimization vs playing how you want.
Truth of the matter is that you cannot design around every individual preference or self-imposed limitation. Paranitis makes a great example of this in his adamant refusal to path down the right side of the tree, for no reason other than because he doesn’t want to - both I and Nathreim pointed out that the Whirlwind talents benefit his stated gameplay desire (to use Thunder Clap), without impeding his ability to take Bloodthirst talents, but he has still refused.
And that’s completely fine. Whatever self-imposed limitations you want to set for your own gameplay are completely up to you, but they are not relevant points of design feedback when the “problems” are self-imposed. You simply can’t design around every individual whim and infinite possibility, any more than you can design around the person who insists on playing Fury without Rampage.
I wish I could say this was a disconnect between high-end / low-end, or even that its an SMF problem, because contrary to what that person may believe, no warrior with any experience is praising the inclusion of SMF as a talent. That being said, even if it wasn’t a talent it wouldn’t make creating a build that solves his problem with 100% accuracy any easier, because they are fundamentally trying to avoid amping core abilities that define what it is to be a fury warrior. We can’t reasonably expect blizzard to be able to cater to that kind of player without adversely affecting the vast majority of players that actually like what Fury is. I’d suggest trying a different class, but I doubt they would take that advice all that well.
Blizz needs to allow prot to use 2h and shield, we all want to use polearm (spears)… Should just let all warr specs use 2handers. There are some people that even want to dual wield shields, I am not a fan of that personally, but could be interesting I guess? I guess the transmog route would be fine too I guess?
