But haven’t people already accepted that authentic Classic is impossible? You can make the same game and the same rules (like Vanilla Era), but you can’t make the same players. A truely authentic experience was never possible.
Blizzard can only control what it can control. The players are different, but part of the beauty of Wrath Heroics were how simple and accessible they are. I’m quite sure even the most tryhard elitist min/max people wouldn’t be behaving like this if they had just been the authentic dungeons. Particularly if it used the original RDF rules. Classic players are all about efficiency and min/maxing. So if you pose the option of…'Hmm, should I stand here and twiddle my thumbs for 15 minutes, or just bang out a braindead easy dungeon"…guess which they’ll choose? That’s just human nature.
Fair enough. The deserter debuff was applied to kicked players for ‘reasons’ sometime after Wrath. The result is, of course, the opposite of a solution for “bad behavior” as arbitrary kicks are hardly “good behavior.”
And this “bad behavior” started when? This change didn’t come about in Wrath, as I’ve said. It makes zero sense to give a deserter debuff to players who are kicked as a “deterrent” for bad behavior with a dungeon queue CD in place. It made even less sense when there were in game GM’s.
As I previously stated, there was a time when GM’s dealt with players like this very quickly. GM’s could see every action and every conversation that happened. Some years ago, there was an exploit in AB where players could glitch through the gate before the match started and cap bases. This happened in one of my matches and several of us reported the exploiter. A GM didn’t contact me but another player let us know he had been contacted. A few minutes into the game and “poof” that player was off the map.
I can honestly say that I never experienced these “trolls” that some of you talk about. If I had, I would have reported them. And I don’t think it was prevalent because that’s back when Blizzard had GM’s and actually did their job. The deserter debuff for being kicked was never a thing in Wrath. If these trolls were actually a thing, they became a thing when Blizzard stopped doing their job.
I have no doubt that this decision was the result of Blizzard’s increasing unwillingness to maintain oversight of their own game. And like the automatic squelch, zero in game oversight, dependency on player reports for bots, cheats, etc., they have made the game increasingly more frustrating when it comes to dealing with “bad behavior.” It may be better for Blizzard to have the players overseeing their game, but it’s not better for the game. And the deserter debuff for kicked players may deter the three idiots out there who want to be kicked (again, who cares? kick them) but it exacerbates far more toxic behavior.
Blizzard has a long history of making bad decisions. Their refusal to maintain in game oversight is just one of them, and the deserter debuff for being kicked is just an extension of that.
it’s what the majority voted. 3 votes = kick. 2 votes doesn’t = kick. Not voting at all counts as a no.
And the answer:
I may have missed something here, Noodlefish, but have you considered using the "Vote to kick" option?
In other words, go ahead and kick them. Let them twiddle their thumbs for 15 minutes, queue again and perhaps get the same dungeon they don’t want to run.
Dungeon Cooldown doesn’t prevent people from queuing specific dungeons, this has been mentioned several times. So if someone wants to queue and then just be toxic for the fun of it, they can.
Does it happen often? Probably not, but it does happen. The problem is that it is possible and has no penalty.
There should be a penalty that prevents toxic players from re-queuing at all for a while. Oh wait, that’s deserter.
And those who over-use the kick system will eventually be unable to kick for a long time and can’t arbitrarily kick people.
Evidence shown that it had happened in Wrath. Could probably find more if you could somehow access the ancient forums in their entirety.
Yes we’ve been over this before. Doubtful there’s anyone who spends their WoW time queuing up for regular DTK or w/e only to sit there and demand to be kicked for the purpose of trolling. But even so, as the blue said:
I may have missed something here, Noodlefish, but have you considered using the "Vote to kick" option?
This is a non issue.
Yeah I’ve seen it. Literally DOZENS of players out of twelve million. 
I’ve had friends kick other players so they didn’t have to contend with them for loot. Tell me you’re clueless without telling me you’re clueless.
Oh, look another alt with 1 post rotating into the forums to post another fictious story about things that are not actually an issue.
Tell me you are a toxic sock puppet without actually telling me you’re a toxic sock puppet.
The concept that a lot of people, including those at Blizz, fail at is weighing the impact of “solutions” on the average player, versus on the intended target. Somehow, this calculus has gotten screwed in Classic. Somehow it’s considered acceptable for a change to have severe negative repercussions on a substantial chunk of players (say 10-15%) if it prevents a negative playstyle for a minuscule number of players (1-2%).
I just got kicked at the beginning of the gamma and also got deserter. Is this the way Blizzard wants me to stay engaged? Now I have to way 30 mins to queue and wait another hour to get the group together.
So we shouldn’t complain. How many you kicked today for no reason you bully?
Are we assuming that the kick was for bad behavior? What about getting kicked for the hell of it?
There’s about a 5 minute wait period before anyone can be kicked.
Dont feel bad, yesterday i got kicked 2 pulls from final boss on the daily, i was pushing 7400 DPS and never took agro. Blizzard needs to pull Kick off now as its being abused badly.
Yup… 100% correct
45 minute queues, get kicked after 2 minutes in dungeon because they don’t want you to possibly roll on an item for an alt guild member they’re gearing up, have to wait 30 min before you can requeue for another 45 min.
Seems like Blizzard should be restoring like 3 hours of gameplay everytime this toxic behavior happens. It’s not like they make us agree to anti toxic behaviors every few months before we can log onto our characters.
Yeah, it’s absolutely mindless. We don’t need an anti-troll deserter debuff mechanic that griefs honest players when trolls can already be kicked and replaced in a matter of seconds.
This is such a total failure at the most absolute basics of game design that it’s pitiful.