I see that the reply seems to be taking a while. I don’t need a long-winded post. I want 3 things from you.
It’s not just waiting around to be sold, it’s used to buy wow time as well. And the amount of time to farm the gold needed for a boost, is way longer than it is just to level them up themselves with dungeon boosts, and this is how they do it. They do not buy boosts.
Not to mention the “they make more gold in the amount of time it takes to level” argument is so insanely stupid I’m getting tired of explaining how this works.
These botters are sitting on an unthinkable amount of gold. Go to a gold selling website right now and most of the time the sellers have their inventory or stock posted for you to see so you know how much you can order.
They are sitting on WAY MORE GOLD in classic than they will ever sell, there is absolutely no urgency to start making more gold NOW NOW NOW. They just have a steady flow of income coming in from their stockpile they are not scrounging around trying to make the most gold as possible ASAP.
Them spending money, tokens, or whatever in order to get a level 58 character just a couple days sooner is directly cutting into their funds and stock for literally no reason at all.
I’ll use an example for you that maybe it will be a little easier to understand.
Let’s say you make watches.
You make 10 watches per day.
On average you sell about 2 watches per day.
Do this for 2 years.
You will be sitting on about 6k watches now, when on average you still only sell 2 per day. Sometimes it may be higher sometimes lower.
You have an opportunity to spend some of your own resources that could earn you money in order to make 20 watches a day for let’s say an extra 4 days.
Why on earth would you cut into your own income of any kind to make 20 watches a day for a couple days when you already have 6k watches in the stock? Why not spend literally nothing and just earn the same amount after a couple days wait.
This is what botters do. They do not buy boosts. At least the ones who are actually botting full time, maybe a random Andy who wants to bot farm his own side account might do this, but those bots are extremely trash.
This depends, if you have a ton of bots farming on retail or just one, but either way you’re cutting into time by having more than one account running on your botting program in order to fund a single boost, when you could instead have all those account in classic getting dungeon boosted by a different bot running a script.
Buying a boost for a single account is around half a mil gold in retail, or about 450k to be exact.
A pretty decent bot in retail would probably take 50ish hours played time of retail to get this.
The reason people don’t do this isn’t just the time it takes that doesn’t make sense, but also you are earning NOTHING in the mean time besides levels when you do this.
When bots boost in classic they essential kill two birds with one stone. They can boost 4 characters at the same time at a quicker rate as well as while they are boosting the mage who is boosting them is also gathering a TON of materials for the AH at lower levels, as well as a ton of raw gold from the end level instances all while getting the other characters a level boost.
Sorry bud but you have no idea how these botters work, they have the bot already, they aren’t going to pay blizzard to skip levels when they literally have the tool already to do just that. The only ‘botters’ who pay for a boost are the noobs at botting who generally just bot for their own benefit for gold or mats and these players almost always are the ones who actually get caught because they do something dumb like set up their bots on elemental plateau because they think they look legit enough not to get caught lol
Your example itself is flawed. If this is how you do math it’s no wonder you don’t understand what I’m saying.
You’re also an idiot if you make 10 watches a day and only sell 2 per day. The demand there isn’t high enough to continue doing business, so the logical conclusion would be to stop making watches altogether.
I don’t see people going “Man, I can’t seem to sell this gold. I guess I’ma just stop botting now”. Please stop using this example. It doesn’t make you seem a smart as you think it does.
450k gold, 50ish hours, 9k gold per hour. 157,838 per token, So, close to 1 dollar per hour. This makes the rest of the math easy, as now 1 hour of retail gold farming is worth 1 dollar.
Conservative estimates of dollars per hour of a level 58 bot. Got those? I do. Hint: It’s about 3 dollars per hour. Shocked? This is based on instanced farming at level 58, converting the gold per hour gained into raw money. Much less hoops to jump through than with Retail to get the raw cash too.
Cost of leveling: From my own personal sources, they state it takes around 60 hours to get to level 58 while botting with the new EXP metrics. Remember, SM boosting has been nerfed into the ground. Mage boosting takes considerably longer now. Yes, this is taking into account Stocks, Mara, etc. You still only get 5 lockouts per hour at best.
60 hours at 3 dollars per hour is 180 dollars. What is cheaper, 180 dollars is 35 times 4, which is 140 dollars?
Math is easy. Boosts are worth. Anyone telling you otherwise is probably lying to you.
Doesn’t matter. The importance is how much money is coming in. Leveling takes time and effort, the latter of which these botters really don’t put much in.
It’s EASIER to boost, and it’s worth the money. Understood?
And his post touches on the subject, but he just dismisses it out of hand
It makes it much easier for a random Andy to get started into it. He acts like its only the established bot farms we have to worry about. And acting like gold is some finite resource.
I’m not even going to bother reading anymore because this is clearly a waste, you have no idea how botting and gold selling works at all. If you believe the amount of gold made is anywhere close to what they sell then this conversation is meaningless because of how little you know lol.
I mean this isn’t even a discussion or an argument tbh. GO TO THE WEBSITES THEMSELVES. They will tell you HOW MUCH GOLD IS IN STOCK. For some sellers it is literally gold cap for the website, as in 10 MILLION gold. Even the casual sellers are sitting on half a mil. They do not sell as much gold as they bring in sweetheart, and if you don’t believe this very basic fact then this conversation is useless from the start so I’m not even going to bother with you.
Funny, if they had that much gold and weren’t able to sell it, prices would be plummeting. They aren’t.
Like I said, you’re just being lied to and don’t realize it.
Edit: I can already predict your next reply: But they have that much!
I don’t care how much they have. I care how much they are SELLING. They are LYING to you if they are saying they are unable to sell their gold.
I didn’t dismiss it, I explained what happens when these casuals start botting, and a boost isn’t exactly what’s going to get them started into it lol. Casual botters always get caught, they just do. The bots available for the public today are actual trash, the real botters have private programs. These are the bots you see running into walls, getting stuck on a mob that is getting pulled away from them, etc. These players aren’t crashing the economy, these players are mostly just botting for themselves and almost always get caught before they even do anything meaningful with them.
That’s not just dismissing it, this is a fact.
Just like the price of diamonds should plummet too. Go ahead and be a botter who wants to sell your gold cheap, see what happens lol. Youll give away too much of your gold and then there will be so much in the market there wouldn’t be any need for you anymore.
These botters aren’t stupid dude, they fix their price to get the most out of there inventory.
There was a guy happy about bots making mats cheaper.
The sad truth is bots don’t really make mats cheaper, they make gold worthless. The price of the mats actually go up, as demand increases and the value of gold plummets. This makes it harder for the casual andy to afford things.
If we didn’t have bots spamming dungeons for gold, then the gold you made would be worth more. More purchasing power. People never think about that, sadly.
And you act like this isn’t an issue. These very “casual botters” are seen constantly ruining players experience and time.
jfc you can easily see on these very forums people posting about the same bots being up for months or more. And nothing is done about them.
Whats easier, scripting for a boosted character for yourself to farm a very specific thing. Or scripting the entire leveling process?
I think most of the people happy about bots are also people purchasing gold, so they don’t really care about gold value.
That’s just obvious.
Ok I understand that you don’t get how these work so it frustrating to you, but no casual botters are not really an issue at all simply because they get caught very quickly, and even the amount of things they can do during their time up is minuscule compared to a guy with a full blown bot operation.
It’s like complaining about a guy having a hummer for air pollution when an industry next door pumps out a thousand times the pollution in a minute compared to the hummer. Sure the casual bots are a ‘problem’ but not enough to justify the changes that you are attempting to push.
The ones you are talking about are dungeon farming bots, these bots are not a causal botting program because these are scripted lua unlocked bots. I’m not going to go into too much detail because I’m sure I’m not even suppose to be talking about this stuff but these bots are the ones I’m talking about that ARE the issue, these are not causal.
I think people think about this all the time which is why people like me were asking for gold wipes for tbc.
This is why I haven’t blocked you. I don’t actually think you’re a troll, I just think you’re misinformed about botting. I also very much liked your thread on the arena changes.
I agree. I think we should also be wiping gold going into TBC.
I also think Blizzard should be enforcing their TOS and banning bots. Then this ENTIRE DISCUSSION WOULD BE MOOT
Obviously there were no bots before this
Game ruined
or you know just buying said multiple tools. Which is the entire point you keep wishing to ignore.
or… they can just buy 5 boost and immediately start farming for those two days.
After going to multiple gold selling websites to get the current price of WoW gold. For 40 USD(Not counting the 15 sub cost because that would be incurred regardless). You could at the cheapest website buy about 1100 gold.
BRD Rogue pickpocketing is roughly 50-60g/h. This means that in a 48 hour period that you claim it would take to level up that new bot. The Boosted Bot would have already farmed 2,400-2,880 gold in BRD. More than making up for the money they have spent. In addition, they do not have to worry about the character being reported while it is leveling up.
ZF matches that of BRDs earning power. When Frostadamus revisited this gold farm he was able to push it up to 70g/h. If bots could match that it means they would be earning up to 3,360 gold in that 48 hour period. Over triple what they spent to make the character.
Yeah, that is going to be profitable for me dawg.
Yeah, we shouldn’t bother with logic. Our bias that the boost won’t be profitable to bots is correct.
Finally someone who actually knows what they’re talking about.
I’m not trolling at all, I completely understand the botting situation. Just because I know that bots don’t buy boosts doesn’t mean I’m trolling or even like bots.
I hate bots, I think there should have been a gold wipe, I think they need to change gold farms in dungeons completely making them useless to everyone, I just understand botters don’t buy boosts. I use to bot myself. I understand their community. I still go to their sites to see what their new systems and programs look like because I like to read about that type of stuff and understand how it works. They just don’t buy boosts man idk what else to say. I know if you aren’t in this community how it could make sense for them to do it, but they just dont.
Not even to mention, these bot farmers already have an ARSENAL of end level characters in the first place lol. There’s no need for it. The only people botting a boosted character are the low crappy botters that i mentioned before who have no idea what they are doing.
Yeah they should. And I believe they should completely nerf any and all dungeon farming to the ground, full stop. Idc if this “effects” legit players either. It will be better for the game. When you let a system play out that allows someone to farm endlessly with no competition in a dungeon where nooone can see them this is what you get.
This would force bots into the world and actually get them reported in mass by players much easier so they could actually get banned. If you can’t see the bot, you won’t catch it.