Blizzard is so close on the graphics

WoW Classic WoW Classic General Discussion
1

To me the goal of graphical improvements should be making the game look better in a manner in which you don’t even notice. They should be subtle and blend in. To that end Blizzard has done mostly an incredible job. When I played Classic it looked and felt like Vanilla. The subtle shadow differences only made the game look a little crisper. The extra foliage didn’t bother me. They didn’t use new textures or anything; it was simply more of what already existed. And from an rp perspective I imagined the grass had grown in a dozen years of no one travelling over the terrain. However, there was one area that failed to meet the aforementioned criteria. That would be: the water effects.

Vanilla water had a distinct look and feel. The water moved and rippled. It had motion and life. When you stood on the shore and hear the sound of the tide it made sense as you see the water moving. This really became apparent in the Classic demo as I was on the Ratchet docks and toggling between the original water and the new water. Besides the fact I don’t like the look of the boring, lifeless, stagnant new water…listening to the movement and yet seeing no movement had a jarring effect. Besides that, the water simply doesn’t fit in with the rest of the Vanilla look and feel. It’s not a subtle change. It doesnt’ blend in with the rest of the surroundings. It stands out. It’s obvious when you look at a screenshot, or video or stream that you’re not looking at Vanilla when you see that water. That goes against what I consider should be the guiding goal in graphical fidelity.

So besides the subjective view that the updated water doesn’t look good, sound good, feel good or match the graphics around it. And the objective view that it’s not an authentic recreation of the Vanilla world. There’s also the fact that the new effects give an advantage. You’re able to see things beneath the surface that you can’t see with the old effects. Just some quick screenshots I took from the demo…

Gee, I wonder what’s under the water: https://i.imgur.com/bOMRpVh.jpg
Oh, there’s actually a sunken ship: https://i.imgur.com/CsjvhqU.jpg

Anyone seen my voidwalker?: https://i.imgur.com/eXeIcmT.jpg
Nevermind. Found him: https://i.imgur.com/vdHna19.jpg

And those are just two quick examples. The implications for questing and pvp are obvious. So for all of these reasons I think it would be best if Blizzard only allowed the original water effects. They’re iconic. They’re immersive. They capture the look and feel of Vanilla. The new effects don’t mesh with the world around them. The change stands out, rather than blends in. And they give gameplay advantages. So I’m hoping the devs come to the same conclusions I have.

Edit - Thanks to Galdor for showing me how to include links.

8 Likes
2

Paste the link then highlight it and click the </> symbol.

1 Like
3

I will be playing with only vanilla graphics but those that want to play with new water should be allowed to if they wish. The advantage in pvp is miniscule, as most races/classes can only stay submerged for a minute at most.

2 Likes
4

I think it’s more to the point of why have the new water at all? The justification for change comes from that perspective, not the other way around. If it’s simply a matter of ‘so people have the option’…that sets a precedent for all kinds of toggles. It’s better and more consistent to simply stick with Vanilla means Vanilla. And the advantages the new effects give aren’t minor. From a questing perspective I’ll have to use the new effects to see what’s below. From a pvp perspective I’ll have to use the new effects to see who might be hiding beneath. Keep in mind shaman and warlocks can give anyone underwater breathing. I believe there’s elixirs as well.

2 Likes
5

The justification for the change is simple. They are using 7.3.5 as a base, and they would have to remove the new water from the game, leading to additional dev time. The same for all the other upgraded graphics options. It’s best to just give people the option rather than strip the options out and potentially add a host of new bugs to iron out.

1 Like
6

The old water effects are already in the game… All they have to do is remove the option for the new effects. That’s no development time at all. By the way, they hired a person and recreated all the old character models. Fidelity obviously is important. This is just one element I feel slipped through the cracks.

2 Likes
7

Sounds like leaving the old water on would be a challenge!

Come on Mogar, take the old water challenge, test your limits!

3 Likes
8

I know you’re trying to be clever, but of course what you’re saying is rather silly. The other topic was about adding things that were never in Vanilla. My topic is about maintaining the authenticity. I apply the same logic to both issues. That’s called consistency.

By the way, I’m sad no one got my ‘slipped through the cracks’ pun. You know…because we’re talking about water. My jokes are just too subtle. Unlike the impact the new water effects have on graphical consistency. That’s not subtle at all.

9

You said you’d feel forced to use the new water for the advantages it provides in PvE and PvP, despite how absurdly small they are. Are you going to apply that same logic to the rest of your gameplay? Are you going to download every addon that provides an advantage in PvP or PvE? Are you going to pick your class solely on the advantages it has over the others?

You’re constantly entering class balance threads to tell Ret paladins and other sub-optimal specs/classes to stop caring about min/maxing, that Vanilla is an RPG and you should play how you want to play. Take your own advice, play sub-optimally with the old water.

However, we both know you don’t actually care about the 1/1,000 chance that using the new water will save you from a Fire mage Pyroblast, you’re just looking for logical reasons to exclude the new water because your previous “it wasn’t in Vanilla, it won’t be in Classic” mantra has been broken by the reveal of the Classic demo.

You’re afraid, as other no-changers have feared, that “Pandora’s box” has been opened so you’re grasping at straws trying to get them to exclude the new water as it’s a 100%, factual change from Vanilla World of Warcraft.

5 Likes
10

I’m not sure what your post is trying to say. I’m saying Vanilla means Vanilla and Classic should be a recreation of that experience. I apply that philosophy to any issue, including all that you’ve indicated. You can try to deflect, distract and change the subject all you want. But those tactics won’t work on me.

By the way, it was Ion Hazzikostas who said they’re worried about opening Pandora’s Box. So apparently he shares my sentiments.

1 Like
11

Aqua ninjas for da win!
The new water is much easier on the eyes while fishing.
The old water made me go cross eyed and gave me headaches.

3 Likes
12

For nochangers, what would be wrong with blizz giving each individual player a button to toggle graphics between old and new? This doesn’t impact you and allows for others to be happy.

1 Like
13

While I think that people have massively overstated the “advantage” of using new water, authenticity is important to Classic and attention to small details is going to be important to authenticity.

1 Like
14

Indeed. It’s the small details that make the game. And little changes that might seem insignificant will add up. Authenticity dies a death from a thousand little paper cuts.

15

I’m saying you do not apply your logic impartially. You’re constantly telling people that min/maxing and playing optimal classes is a BfA mentality. You then go on to say:

Can you really not see your own hypocrisy, when it’s clearly being pointed out to you? That’s a min/maxing mentality, you’re saying you’ll need to use the new water for the absurdly small advantages it will provide in PvE and PvP gameplay.

2 Likes
16

I’m hoping that perhaps it’s just that the Devs haven’t gotten to detailing the water effects back to Classic/Vanilla style? I didn’t play the Demo, and don’t know all the tech stuff that goes on with what they’re trying to accomplish, but maybe that’s all it is?

I know that the Demo was just a sneak peek at Classic and that the Devs have lots of work ahead of them. Maybe water effects is on the to-do list :slight_smile:

17

Kinda like profs in BFA.

18

The Vanilla water is in the Classic demo. Mogar made this thread because he wants everyone playing Classic to see the same world as he does and the optional new water clashes with that desire.

1 Like
19

First of all, it is completely consistent. Both of my stances are dictated by authenticity. Classes were balanced a certain way. The game looked a certain way. Both should be maintained. And yet you call this inconsistency?

Secondly, stop trolling. You’re not talking about the water effects. You’re not talking about your opinion about them. You’re not talking about the mishmash of conflicting styles. You’re not talking about advantages or disadvantages. You’re talking about ME. It’s the classic tactics of forum trolls. Talk about the issue or don’t talk at all. I’m not going to continue to be sidetracked by you.

Anyway, back to the subject. I’ve laid out my thoughts. Hopefully, maybe, possibly someone from Blizz will see them and at least take a second to think about what I’m saying.

1 Like
20

I completely agree but I think it is too early. There are many things about the demo that the panel said “was not meant to be taken as the final product”. There are new graphic options and I think a lot of us knew that this was going to be an option. But things like texture, depth etc- are still being worked on.
Like they showed at the Vanilla Recreation, that there are a lot of things they still have yet to fix. Like the lamp posts for example (even though that was a texture error). Either way.

It depends on how they go about this. Will they release a alpha and let people test it? Or will they not ask for feedback at all and just release it? Like with the past few beta’s. It’s like they always opened beta, only as a sort of early access but ignored everything that came from testers.

Just to add: They did make very clear that the vanilla player base is to point out things like this. Mistakes and what not. I hope that this topic brings it to light.