You know what’s really crazy? Reading the old blog posts on AV development, their original intent was for the battleground to never actually end. It actually seems like their original intent was for AV and other battlegrounds to be somewhat similar to Wintergrasp.
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So is 1.12. 1.12 just emphasizes pvp more than pve compared to 1.5 which heavily emphasized pve.
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This is where I once again remind you that less PVP happened as a result, and then you once again attempt to blame the players rather than the changes to the BG.
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Pre-release blog post for anyone interested:
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Ostensibly, one side could decide to simply swarm the enemy territory. This would involve first attacking the enemy’s forward base camp. This will be a difficult endeavor. The forward camp is guarded by numerous NPC defenders in the mid-fifties, as well as the elite camp commander and his elite special guards. Not only are these defenders numerous, and tougher due to the elites, but there will also be a tower or two flanking the way through this forward camp.
https://web.archive.org/web/20041223182307/http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/pvp/battlegrounds.html
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/shrug and this is where you blame the map instead of the players. Despite that there were plenty of games where a lot of pvp happened in 1.12.
For the next few hours after your side scores a victory, the opposition will have no NPC troops to help them.
No, this is where I blame the nerfs and outright removal of content which made zerging the most efficient strategy. Prior to that PVP was not optional.
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But it was still over shadowed by pve.
You do actually understand that the issues you have a problem with have nothing to do with nerfs and more so to do with people figuring out the most efficient way right?
Ressurects from the dead.
False.
‘1.12’ AV – began on 06-19-06 with patch 1.11, ended on patch 2.0.1, the TBC pre-patch, on 12-05-06, 169 days.
1.8 AV – began on 10-10-05, ended on patch 1.10 on 03-28-06, 169 days.
If you’re going to claim technical accuracy, please be technically correct. It was tied with 1.8.
To respond in general to Eloraell about people not willing to compromise – I would be much more behind a weekend special than old versions of AV fading away as the phases progress. Removal of content is always going to be contentious – keeping it around is simply a better idea for a ‘museum’ rather than throwing an exhibit away. Classic WoW is a museum about Vanilla WoW, and while not everything can be restored, I believe there’s a place for ‘the changing face of AV’ as an exhibit.
Maybe it won’t be popular, maybe no one will play it. But it should exist, as it was a part of Vanilla’s history – and clearly, a very -popular- and very storied topic.
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So… I’m still correct? Gotcha. We were discussing 1.5 and 1.11 specifically so thanks for that
Yeah, gonna go with no. Yes, zerging attempts began prior to 1.11. However, zerg attempts in early AV were next to impossible, because of all of the content that was later removed. To pretend they had “nothing to do” with it is insultingly disingenuous. That tact gets no more legit the more you and the other zyrius types spout it onto these threads.
Furthermore, it was not just the changes that made the zerg the most efficient way to do AV, it removed the actual fun of having the time to use the inherent tools of the BG.
SINCE people have been taught that 1.11 and onward were most efficiently completed via zerg, it is PRECISELY why all of the early content must be back in. Otherwise the once great BG will be just a wet fart.
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No, we are discussing Vanilla AV as a whole, and your statement was a blanket, that ‘1.12 AV was the longest lasting version of AV during vanilla.’
So… No. You’re not correct.
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No, me and that guy were discussing 1.5 and 1.12 and you butted in. Do you get into someone’s convo irl and tell them what they’re discussing?
If you want a private conversation, this is not the place for it, and let’s not pretend that it is.
Additionally, your statement is still incorrect as it was stated. If you wanted to compare two -specific- versions of AV, your statement should have reflected that, especially given in the history of this topic, other versions of AV have been mentioned often.
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We are discussing early AV compared to 1.11, meaning pre nerfing.
1.6 still had all of the content, as did 1.7. So if you want to get down to brass tacks, The bulk of the content existed in AV much longer than version 1.11. IIRC only bug fixes and adjustments that buffed elements of AV occurred between 1.5 and 1.7.
And you literally said 1.12 was the longest AV version in vanilla. Words matter.
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Will items like Frost Runed Headdress which is pre-raid BiS for mages be available from the summonable bosses?
Well technically the major nerfs to NPC’s were finished by 1.11. So it’s very fair to say that even in vanilla 1.11 + 1.12 was the longest lasting version, or at least an equally large portion, of AV.