I really like games where you’re playing in unmapped territory. The most consistently unmapped game state is always late game, so you can be far more creative. That and proxy rax build orders. :^)
In a mirror matchup, I suppose. But, I often feel like supreme late game is 100% decided by the balance team. I mean that, despite knowing it sounds juvenile or whatever have you.
But yeah, most games it just feels like “I’ve played this same exact game 10000 times.” You’re just going through the motions on auto pilot. Already know how it’s going to play out and who is going to win, etc, etc. It can be hard to not burn out pretty quickly like that. It’s kinda like beating a game. It’s kinda natural to quit playing a game after you beaten it.
There was a lot of that in BW. I always viewed it as a game of many decisions. And SC 2 more of a game of predetermined decisions and “what comp you chose.”
Unmapped scenarios helps keep the game feeling fresh, but I’ve never really felt creative late game in SC 2. Like at all. So that’s kinda interesting.
I feel like late game is where players fall off the most, there’s more room to outplay your opponent in regards to decision making, mechanics, etc.
Maybe because only Maru explores lategame Terran.
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I dunno imho Zerg are much worse than toss. Toss at least doesn’t have units that Terran can’t counter (aka Lurker). Toss have such unit compositions though, but that’s super late game that almost never happens.
Also Disruptor killing 30 of your supply when you moved screen away from your army for a split second happens. With banes its not THAT bad. But I still hate Zerg more than Protoss.
I think people hate getting wrecked by proxy void ray + SB, as well as not knowing how to properly scout and executing their opening correctly. Actually you can see BeastyQt getting 16% win rate vs toss in one of his recent videos (and he was same mistakes as I did which is funny; it was playing as toss and watching uThermal guides that helped me, but I digress…).
Hellion-Banshee/Liberator than double stim drop pressure to controll creep spread (creep is like Zerg’s main resource) and than push with 200 2-2 marine-tanks-medivacs as soon as you got it.
If you fail plan B is 4M with addition of Ghosts. M with emphasize on Marauders and Mines with DCs. Marines are more like harass unit at this stage. You are not Clem, you won’t do perfect splits simultaneously at 3 points on the map.
Maybe your Zerg is sleepy snail and he forgets to get Lurker range upgrade or that he have a unit called overseer. Think of Lurker as new Broodlord-Infestor.
Alternatively, neraly everybody dies to hellbat push with marauders and marines. Reactor first, 4 marines, hellions, tech lab on barraks=>concussive shells, 2 marauders, Viking than Medivac from Starport. Viking is to hide your build and then for an emotional pressure. You want Zerg out of his comfort zone, you want him feel harassed and triggered. It is in this stage that he might forget that he have Lurkers or need to do upgrades for them.
If he sees Marauders you effed. But if he don’t this build hits like a truck. Also focus 3-d with this push, its highly unlikely that Zerg will just die, but when you kill his 3-d and cancell his 4-th by leftover marauders and marines you should have no trouble in finishing him of with tank-MMM pressure.
Blink Stalker pressure into Colossus-Charge-Storm is hard to deal with, but manageable.
Phoenix-Charge hits worse, but its auto loose for toss if playing against 3 Rax.
Worst is Phoenix-Colossus, especially when Disruptors are out.
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Ok so you are participant and disinfo like the rest toss pasters. Can’t take u seriously esp with the stolen builds mantra
Why don’t u guys just meet Myanuz
I’ve been making me a list of “serious fellows.” Congratulations on making the list. Obviously, a no brainer. Got you next to Pauly Shore and Carrot Top.
Serious breaking news. The kinda news you gotta call your children at school for. Best strat in P vs T is cyclone, viking. If you can avoid losing all your units to force fields or disruptors you win the games. How hard can it really be to not lose to force fields in P vs T? If that’s a poison that has to be picked, picking it every time. And the viking is the low key best harass unit in the game from a risk/reward standpoint.
Other matchups… I dunno. Let me get like a week, instead of a day, to “solve those.” I got my serious thinking cap on, though, so… why not?
The last person who called me a goof ball/nonsensical got a serious talking to, cause go figure. I invented the term “post/forum face.” Argue that one too, chumpy.
Hey playa, just a question on my mind. I’m playing a tvz right… you know the matchup in which terran usually trades cost efficiently yet I had an army twice as expensive as the Zergs and still lost… Just wondering what I did wrong? Seems like this guy was a big fan of MC too…
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That’s the respect I expect from everyone, going forward. I mean, I’ve had the chance to play Terran for at least a day, after all. It would be unseemly and ignorant to not treat me as a SC 2 Terran guru. For crying out loud, I already solved T vs P in a day.
Sounds like you experienced a case of “being a bad player” at the wrong time. Unfortunately, it’s only acceptable to play bad vs Toss.
In seriousness, how did you manage it? Given a pretty expensive army, surely not just losing bio to banelings.
I’m going to need another day and a half before I’m ready for my “I’m the best Terran player alive” series. So answer a question for me, myself, and you can be apart of what molded the best ever. What’s the Terran equivalent of void ray, carrier, disruptor vs Zerg? You know… the comp that can a-move/steam roll mostly everything?
Now, if you can answer that and you still lost… just confirming you played bad and it happens to the best of us. Unfortunately, it always happens to the worst of us. Tell me it doesn’t always happen Thrasher. I’d hate to give you this diagnosis, that I’ve had to give to all of my other Terran opponents. I’m sorry son, but… you’re a bad player. The truth that every nerd needs to hear uttered but isn’t man enough to hear it.
You’re better than that, though. Prob just messed up your hotkeys. You know them things always getting overwritten on accident or not registering and what not. Tragic stuff.
I’ve yet to try making ghosts vs Zerg. I need the run down on when to make them and to hear about just how awesome they are. Tell me their feats of strength and their shortcomings.
Even, though, I’m not playing ranked, I can still deduce my MMR. It’s 3900/4k’ish. Apparently that’s masters on EU atm, at least for the baddies.
A few games ago, I floated my rax into the Terran’s base to scout. It hit me. Omg… I’m playing BW T vs Z. That’s what’s up. I feel at home. Feels great. I’m in your base, hovering, scouting yo shiz. I don’t understand why that’s not a thing. I get that it was a thing in BW cause it was mech vs mech, and no bio going on. But… it’s 150 minerals. Saves a scan, no? And… you don’t even necessarily lose the rax, anyways.
Proxy rax/reaper (taking the route they would take to proxy me, thus scouting for proxies), bunker at their natural, and then factory into expand at home. Feels good. The other guy is all like wtf is going on and totally over defending. You see, this is the kinda stuff maxfraud would be doing with Terran if he weren’t lame. But, such is life. 100% lame diagnosis.
T vs Z… I’m not feeling the late game. I feel like there’s a million ways to win via harassing Zerg, and Blizzard has rewarded them for being godly enough to make it to the late game by giving them a free win! Don’t quote me on that. I’m just trying to be an edgelord here, but when you’ve only played Terran for 2 days… it can feel like dat.
Champ, you have no idea. This guy was an absolute G O D. 23k games with 3.7k MMR on EU. Must have been the map (romanticide) SMH when is blizzard going to put in the new terran favoured maps? I need Blackburn and Beckett 2.0…
Imagine if all your units were HT. That’s ghosts verse Zerg.
Master 3 is 4.4k. You are the high diamond/low master meme.
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When you play players around my MMR on EU, you’re literally playing with nerds who have trained with the best to ever do it. So, by simply having played me… they’re now on steroids and have reached a level of SC 2 enlightenment that is only possible via playing me. It was simply fresher on their mind than it was for you. You gotta get that vs Playa fix every so often.
Listen. I’ve seen ghosts kill broodlords and what not. Instantly, too. I’ve never seen high templars kill anything, outside of Neeb vs Elazer (or Nerchio) on Daybreak, when the Zerg stood his broodlords in 50 storms in a row, just because he was curious if it were possible for storm to win a game.
I feel like by simply comparing a unit to HT, you know I would never make it, if that were truthful. Thus… the conspiracy is born. The ghost is clearly the secret of Terran being OP as all the expletive words in the universe, combined, and you’re trying to lead me from the path of OP discovery. You fear that if I utilize ghosts that I will even surpass my Toss MMR within days…
That’s how conspiracies are born and confirmed. Facts. A reasonable person wouldn’t even compare road kill to the usefulness of the HT. The HT wish it could be that useful.
I guess I have to explain further.
Playa never makes HT because ghosts exist
Playing Zerg against ghosts is like having all your units be HT…
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makes sense. With upgrade Lurker have the same range as Bl and move faster. But what is the Infestor replacement?
i play zerg… and do not feel the late game. By Tanks/ Ghost/ PF/lib even if T has only 20-40 workers… the game goes 20min longer …
Plus the 1 million ways that kill me in the early…
but you’ll manage that, too.
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Omg. I must have misread. How does one ever lose if they’re facing HT? Best matchup ever. No wonder Ruff opens ghosts. Why wait to win, when you can start the game with the victory screen? I underestimated Mr. Ruff. Genius, indeed.
That’s what I most noted. In P vs Z, if you don’t have a lot of workers… you’re just dead. It can easily become a lose/lose situation. Like the Zerg’s army can reach such a high army value that you just can’t ever win any fights vs them. If you somehow matched their army strength and supply, you’d lose because of not having enough eco.
However, with Terran… your eco always seems good enough, even with a few workers… thus you have the army supply to crush. Best of both worlds. Getting to bully the map, while also having a relatively okay eco if not better. At least in theory, once I use the best comp. Gotta see what these ghosts are about.
I just know I love mine/viking. But, do I really want to be on that late game? Ay yi, yi.
Kind of like this h ttps://imgur.com/a/o3LQAzx
XXXDDDDD
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Rofl. You think you’re playing in private with no way for anyone to stalk you, and then you experience Thrasher. Look at him stalking me. Creepy. Just don’t act like you’re a changed man when all them W’s start rolling in. Stalker turned my number 1 journalist and source of favorable propaganda then. Best be.
911, I’d like to report a nerd stalked me and it felt good. Go to his house and encourage him to do it some more.
I am your guardian angel… Ensuring that you are held accountable to this threads completion. It’s a matter of buffs and nerfs for the rest of SC2. Took me like 2 minutes. Sc2 replay stats----> league----> found lambo----> playa #65.
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So, you still need to answer my question… How did you lose against a zerg with double the army value? Did all your tanks go blind?
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I can’t recall the specific game (I know I probably just played it lol). I know there was a game where the guy had corruptors out, but I was still recalling BCs to bases, even knowing the corruptors had to be right there. I just didn’t care, if that was the game.
But, I have found Zerg to be incredibly cost efficient… Like the entire map is creep when I play. It’s really easy to get a surround or catch me before I’m properly sieged and what not. I have to put a lot more thought into comp and numbers and what not. For all I know I could have had 30 vikings and was supposed to lose.
That’s vikings for you… Expensive and bad. Don’t know why anyone makes them tbh.
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If you need AA than Viper-Hydra.
Ling-banes if you don’t.
At this stage their purpose is to make it harder to get to Lurkers, as if it wasn’t already very difficult to engage them (same range as Ghost’s snipe, large AoE and can cancel Ghost’s snipe by itself). Lurkers kill anything by themselves.
My point was though that once Lurkers are out in large enough numbers (more than 3-4) than gg is almost certain, unless you are much, much higher skilled than your Zerg opponent.
If you use meme compostions like this or mass cyclones in TvP you will win against low skilled opponents because of your superior micro and macro, but you won’t learn the optimal way to play and will loose every game once (if?) you climb to your real mmr (on your main).
I can beat people 2K MMR below me with pretty much anything, I guess…
Welcome to TvZ.
You can’t fight or move on creep. Zerg sees you and will make a perfect surround, or harass your bases. Your army can’t be everywhere at once.
Creep denying is where you spend majority of your CCs energy.
Why would you want to waste a scan for scouting in the first place? you can see all what you need with a reaper.
Speaking of mech vs mech, thor-tank are kind of OP combo in TvT now. At least I have no idea how this can be killed if you let it to snowball