Would you mind giving your opinion as to why moving Sentry to Bastion’s ultimate would ruin him?
Also, what other changes might you suggest such that Recon and Tank are more consistent?
I have a simpler solution to make him less dependant on bunker play while also avoiding buffing bunker.
- When leaving Sentry mode Bastion gets a temporary movement speed boost. IE: transforms into recon OR tank mode from sentry mode.
This would enable Bastion to more quickly peel and re position himself. Not to mention chase down people when he is in tank mode.
- Allow him to heal AND shoot while in Recon mode.
Currently when in recon mode he can only do one or the other. If he is under direct diress from an enemy he either delays the inevitable in hopes that a teammate will save him or risk flat out dying by firing back and hoping to chase them off or kill them before they get him.
Allowing him to heal while shooting in recon will enable him to sustain AND fight off attackers. Giving him some more independence from others.
I very much agree with the sentiment that Bastion’s ultimate is a button that says ‘Stop fearing me for 8 seconds’. His Sentry mode is far more difficult to handle while his Tank mode only demands respect against teams in very specific circumstances.
I think Sentry bastion is pretty core to his identity and role but that his kit outside of Sentry suffers from many issues including a lack of flexibility for a transforming robot.
I really like the idea of putting his tank mode on a basic ability because then he can do a rocketjump to get some height or fire a rocket at someone hiding behind that tiny shred of cover for a splash kill.
Sure. Bastion’s kit is meant to revolve around Sentry mode. If he were focused on Recon mode, then he would just be a Soldier 76 clone (bu worse than Soldier), and if he were focused on Tank, then he would just be a Pharah that can’t fly. Sentry offers something unique to the game, something that no one else has, which is what makes Bastion unique. If you take that away, or just limit it so that he rarely gets to use it, then he loses what makes him unique, and he just becomes a clone of a couple other heroes.
Recon is pretty consistent. The spread feels good, the spread control us usable, and the damage is pretty decent for what it is. I don’t think Recon needs any changes at all (besides possibly being given Ironclad if Ironclad changes, which I think should happen).
That might have been slightly poor wording for Tank. Tank itself is pretty good, but it’s hard to be consistent with it just by the nature of projectiles. The only change I would make to Tank is to either bump it’s Ironclad back to 35% (for Tank only) and give it to him as soon as he starts to transform, keep Ironclad where it is but give him 75 armor as well, or remove Ironclad from Tank all together, and give him his 150 armor back. All of those are roughly the same health, but since they apply the health earlier in the transformation, it makes using his ultimate much easier. Right now, you have to hide to use it, or else you’ll just die.
Please no. If you really want tank in his kit just put it on E, he has no ability there yet.
That is a huge assumption there. You’re assuming he isn’t played because people don’t like him for what he is, not because he’s underpowered.
I admire the fact that you’re trying to preserve the current way Bastion operates, but the thing is the way Bastion works now is also his most glaring weakness, and the reason why he’s considered a refuse-tier pick.
The point about Bastion’s kit isn’t one mode or the other, but the fact that he can switch modes on the fly to deal with different circumstances. Sentry is still a core part of his kit, but when the difference between his two primary modes is, as I said, just sitting down and shooting faster without being able to headshot, we’ve got a problem.
Moving Tank to Bastion’s Shift ability at least gives some diversity to Bastion’s basic kit, and gives him more flexibility when the situation calls for it. Sentry as a primary ability simply doesn’t offer that.
It’s because people complain when they die after doing the same thing that killed them every time they’ve done it before (walking right at Bastion. He’s “camping” if he kills you in the same way more than once and apparently some people think he takes no aim.
I would argue that his most glaring weakness is Ironclad. Sentry was great before it was added. Since a passive damage resistance is so strong, a lot of power had to be taken out of Sentry to accommodate for it (I think there was too much accommodation, but whatever). If Ironclad was a more active ability, for example if the user had to use self-heal to get it’s benefits, then it would allow a lot of Sentry’s power back in, which would fix him pretty well.
Yes, switching to match the current situation is important, but if he “loses” Sentry mode (by putting it on his ultimate), then he loses a massive way to deal with a lot of problems.
I do agree with that part. He needs to have tighter spread and headshots back, even if that means giving up some base DPS. Sentry is meant to be his primary, but right now it’s lacking as a primary, which is why he’s struggling.
Why not just move Tank to E though? He doesn’t have an E ability, and this would make him much more versatile than simply trading abilities. If they do that, then Recon can be for ranged accuracy, Sentry for high sustained fire, and Tank for burst damage and mobility.
I would rather Ironclad get moved to Bastion’s E. Activating it grants him additional damage resistance, without the CC immunity that Orisa’s Fortify also grants. If Tank mode was moved to Bastion’s E, what would become his new ultimate? Bring back the old remote mine he had in early development versions?
As for your opinion regarding Sentry being Bastion’s primary, it’s been said a number of times (by not only myself) but that design philosophy causes problems. Sentry mode is laughably easy to counter when flanked; that’s why Ironclad was added in the first place, yet that still hasn’t solved any problems.
Regardless of how you spin it, the current state of Bastion’s design is inherently flawed. People don’t like playing a character who’s base kit requires they be stationary to get their maximum damage potential, people don’t like having to fight the “el presidente” team comp, the list goes on.
What’s usually suggested is an “Overclock” ability that affects his different modes in different ways… Here’s my post on it, but there are a lot of others too.
That’s one of the things that you have to learn when playing him, and there’s a few options to play around it. Set up in places that are hard to get flanked, anticipate the flank and point your gun in that direction at the appropriate time, or don’t set up for long enough to get flanked. Before his rework, this was one of the most enjoyable parts of his kit, learning to anticipate flankers, and surprising them when they thought they had you.
Most people don’t. Bastion is not for those people. Bastion is for the people that do like that playstyle, and he should keep it because of that. The game was meant to be accessible to all different kinds of playstyles, and Bastion’s is one of them.
Bastion mains don’t like the “el presidente” comp. That’s why we want him to become more independent and reliable. It seems kinda counter-intuitive that removing/reworking Ironclad would make him more independent, but if you allow him to deal consistent damage, then he’s able to deal with threats on his own, and doesn’t really need the pocket. Plus, with the addition of new Torb, bunker comps like that are going to be pretty easy to counter. I really just wish they’d allow his ultimate to pass through barriers. Maybe he and Mei can work well together, she freezes them all, and he melts them…
Simply adjusting Bastion such that Sentry mode is still his primary source of damage means people will still think “El Presidente” is the way you play Bastion.
I understand that there are a select few Bastion mains who have refined their gameplay such that they can work around Bastion’s counters and weaknesses, but that number is so few they might as well not exist.
Making Bastion more independent, in my opinion, involves changing him in such a way that everyone else doesn’t feel like they need to play around him. There is a very good reason why people default to Bastion requiring a “build around me” playstyle, and that’s because people like you are too few and too far between. On top of that you do nothing to try and break the stigma.
Let them think that…? Good Bastion players will let their team know that they don’t need all of the protection, and bad ones will just be countered by Torb until they learn.
That just means more people need to learn to play Bastion… working around your counters and weaknesses is just called learning a hero
If people don’t have to play around him, then they won’t. It’s not very fun running a bunker comp, so if people are given the choice, then they most likely won’t do it. You’ll have some Mercy mains protecting him occasionally, but it wouldn’t be like it is now. He was independent enough before his rework. He worked well with a team, but he also worked pretty well without them for a while (he would need to return after a sneaky setup or flank, but that’s good). If he could deal reliable damage again, then he would have that back.
Not entirely sure what you mean by that…
I mean, Look at mei, Shes a very strong hero and is still not played
and if he was beeing played, we would know because the forums would be filled with complaints
Everyone hates Hanzo but plays him.
people hate playing AGAINST hanzo
but he is fun to play
people hate playing against bastion and dont have fun playing him, because they prefer other heroes
How are you going to prove anything about that? Even Seagull says he wants to play Bastion more.
I cant prove it,
im just saying, thats probably the reason bastion is not picked
a lot of people dont value his power, and he´s kinda niche but can be played outside of it, not many people have the courage to try though
probably isn’t good enough considering there also no proof.
You could call that a rework though.