🥏 Reaper and Sym should be Lurkers not Flankers (don't make them Beyblade Heroes)

General Discussion
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Making them faster would just make them too overpowered at lower ranks and just not “really” at higher ranks. (If it does it’s because it’s Overtuned, think Old Overpowered Roadhog or D. Va.) discussed it more here 💔 Likely going the wrong direction again with Sym and Reaper.

Guess I am saying they shouldn’t be Beyblade heroes… which we seem to be going.

-👓 Sym and Reaper "Proper" changes (3rd Person Placement) (Non Beyblade) (How I would change Reaper’s Shadow Step and Sym’s Teleporter)

Basically making 3rd person placement happen with Reaper’s Shadow Step and Sym’s Teleporter. (Think Doomfist’s Ult)

(Unlike Doomfist 's Ult) There would be some important differences.

Placement effect would basically happen same as 1st person placement happens, though 3rd Person would give them more range and ease to place the placement.

They would be vulnerable while using the ability. (think of Junkrat during his ult, remember to hide.)

(Optional) Whatever they are using for the 3rd person placement, either Black cloud (Reaper) or Camera made of Light (Sym). It can be destroyed. (Optional)

They would be able to see the enemy from a safe distance and relay it to their team like current Sombra

They can place the placement anywhere within a 50 meter radius. (Even if it’s behind walls, on roofs, etc…)

Everything else still happens the same.

(3/8/19 Edit: Limit Sym’s to 3 people cause Geoff seems to have a problem with the whole team going though Sym’s Teleporter.)

Bonus for Sym: Instead of her summoning Flying Turrets.

Have her Summon Flying Barriers again

and when the Barriers hit a wall or a surface have then turn into Turrets.

Basically the return of Proton Barrier (or a lesser version of it, Or greater depending on the situation) but doesn’t let her lose anything else.

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Lurkers don’t work in OW. Even if it did Reaper and Sym still wouldn’t be able to keep up with McCree and Hog, and they’re not even doing that well.

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I’m guessing this is some foreign terminology from some other game? Cause they don’t look like zerg nor zombies to me.

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I have discussed how they can work in the past. Making Sym and Reaper Faster would be like letting Genji fly.

We don’t need them like Tracer.

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They’re not flankers anyway and being a lurker has no strategic value, its not a niche; its a tactic employed by the desperate, optionless, and also Junkrat.

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I think it means they should be support bodyguards or something? Genji dives backline and get face full of Symmetra and cries from spawn for nerfs. Like good old days. I think…

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You can blame Shadestep and Teleporter for that no value, if it worked better (and I don’t mean faster)… that would be a different story.

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Ah kk, thanks for the clarification!

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She already got a baseball bate to the skull sending her concussed in the wrong direction so wouldn’t surprise me if they focus on the wrong aspects again. Tho faster tp would help her out alot.

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Movie starting, but I left enough info. Going afk

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Flight doesn’t really add anything to Genji’s kit. We could add that right in and nothing would really change.

And they do need to be like Tracer. For most of the roster, lurking in OW is better described as feeding on yolo flanks.

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See this for more on how it can work as Old Sym 🧞‍♀ 344 Days Since The Start of this post about Sym (4/10/18)(3/20/19)

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You know that Reaper was originally going to be a flanker, right? And then the devs were like, "what were we thinking? "He’s just gonna teleport to the backline for free, kill supports without effort because they can’t fight back against Reaper, Wraith Form away for free, and rinse and repeat. That’s why Shadow Step stays absolutely garbage whle Reaper gets buffed into a tankbuster.

Sym wouldn’t work as a flanker, utility flanking is Sombra’s thing. Symmetra would have to use her teleporters more selfishly instead getting multiple teammates including herself into good positions. Every part of her kit also has a wind up to it, so good luck striking from the shadows.

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Look it’s not the shadows… it’s just behind you… like Sombra, Pharah and Junkrat currently can do.

I get they don’t want to teleport an entire team… so maybe reduce that to 3…

But this was Sym 2.0 as I remember it. Slip though the choke, plant Teleporter, coordinate with team, Ambush.

By not going this direction, they are literally killing what’s tiny bit that’s left of old Sym.

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Yeah, I don’t know how they flubbed these skills so badly. Teleport requiring a key you never hit and you have to spam it often to get it to register. And the mechanics of shadow step aside, the skill itself is broken. If you hit teleport then quickly click to place it, you shoot instead. There is a slight delay before the left mouse click becomes “place”.

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I mean…there’s a reason I run them more on defense than I do offense. There’s a few cases where you can push with them, but not super often. Heroes with short range are naturally more defensive since the enemy needs to come to you.

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If you have it work in 3rd person that would not be a issue, think DF Ult

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Yeah, and a practical version of shadow step would make flanking a point and click ability for Reaper. This would make it easy to negate Reaper’s range weakness by simply teleporting and wraith forming back and forth. He’d be an extremely safe and in many ranks oppressive flanker.

I didn’t like that strat, it was such an all or nothing move but instead of even truely setting up and engagement they were just trying to set up a “surprise attack.”

I think TP is better as a utility meant to enable a wider variety of strategies, especially with the reduction in turrets.

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Agreed, and you could pick a spot that isn’t clearly visible to every single player on the enemy team.

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You might not like the Strat but literally half the Heroes have ways around choke points.

D. Va is literally a surprise attack with how her entire kit works

Even the new hero can make chokes pointless