I Said this before, and i will say it again, Torb does not need a rework

General Discussion
1

He just doesnt,

If you feel like torbs current state is horrible and theres nothing salvageable about this kit, you have not played the character,

While i understand that torbjorn isnt played that much at the big ranks, it just just because he is slightly underpowered, a large part of his kit is salvageable and can be fixed with a few buffs, which i will say

First of all, I belive it could be a good proposition to change a portion of his health to armor, atleast 50, so he has some sort of defense when he spawns,

A reduction of his critbox is also a necesity, this makes him really hard to play, his critbox is the size of the multiverse,

And now with the controversial part of this thread, Im going to throw on a few ideas to make torbjorn better and explain why i thought about them,

First of all, Starting with the elephant in the room, His turret,

Torbjorn isnt extremely reliant on his turret as some people make it seem, in fact, a good torb can even play him without a shield,

Therefore, i will only propose the following buffs to his turret,

  • During level 1, the turret will have 75 shields and 75 armor,

  • During level 2, The turret will have 150 shields, and 150 armor,

  • During level 3, It will be 400/400 (this one can change as im not sur what value to give it exactly, maybe 600Shield/200Armor)

Before everyone panics, i will explain the reasoning to why i make this change

The main problem with torbjorns turret is that it cant last a second without him at this side, constantly babysitting it, repairing it when it takes damage, and it will fall apart in 2 seconds after beeing focus fired,

Therefore, the shields and armor come to play

  • The shields will act as a self-regen hp, making torb not have to be on a constant rush to repair his turret from high ground to low ground and the turret will have some sort of self-heal that can make it last slightly more,

  • The armor will focus as a direct defense, to make the turret last a little more against focus fire, It is a stationary object and most DPS can out-damage it even if they were directly standing within line of fire, i belive this change will make the turret slightly harder to destroy, especially by flankers like tracer who can just run dump a whole clip in the thing and instantly kill it with no problem,

Now, While this might sound like the worst thing in existance for lower ranks, i have thought of the following,

The turrets cooldown will be reduced to 6, and it will only start after the turret was destroyed, This will act to prevent torbjorn from turret spamming, like he can currently do, and to give a downtime window of play to lower ranks to dive him after his turret is dead,

Another change i want to say is the ability for torbjorn to pick up his turret and drop it somewhere else, as a way to carry it arround, This can help in multiple ways, Torb could

  • Setup a turret behind a wall and prepare it and drop it behind a wall,

  • prevent histurret from dying, by picking it up and putting it behind a wall for repairs,

  • Make him more viable in attack, in bunker-esc comps, as a slow pushing kill dozer, build aturret in spawn, pick it up, and carry it to the payload, therefore torb can start at a reasonable strenght

also, some kind of ability, maybe bound to the interact key, To let him throw a focus orb, to make his turret focus a specific target, working similar to discord orb that fades after not beeing in His LOS for a few secs

Regarding his gun, it may be in order for a SLIGHT icnrease in projectile speed, to make it SLIGHTLY more relaible, but not too much, it should still be kept unreliable and hard to master, as this balances out with his turret,

For his armor pack and scrap mechanic, i belive this is fine, maybe make him get more when the target is killed by torb himself

His ult is fine, leave that be, this is the last thing you need to remove of him,

Anyways this is my opinion

9 Likes
2

I think the worst part about Torbjorn is that he has the exact same weakness that Symmetra had prior to her most recent rework. His turret takes too much time to set-up.

In order to set-up it up on high ground he has to waste time walking to that location. He has to wait a very long time to put turret up by hammering on it. Even more if under fire. Any time the turret is dislodged he has to waste time getting back up to full DPS potential.

Yes, you can play Torbjorn with just the rivet gun, but its still lackluster without hardly any other effects or DPS to call on. All the time he wastes trying to put up turret is wasted time not being a DPS for the team or being an extra thing to be shot at.

Tes, torbjorn can start to snowball on things like the payload, but once dislodged he is very ineffective at setting back up again. Heā€™s playing at half-steam basically. This was the exact issue with Symmetra. Her turrets and teleporter took too long to set-up and once a spot was lost you could not rely upon her to set-up as it took too long.

What Torbjorn really needs which the team hinted at was something like a self deployable turret that will auto upgrade. Possibly something you can toss and deploy at range. Tossing the turret up onto some ledge to build itself means you just saved like 10 seconds walking to the second story and another 5-6 pounding away at the thing. Thatā€™s another 15 seconds he could start shooting at the enemy right away.

Even so I think builders in this game are at a weakness. They have stuff that can be destroyed and with it ineffective DPS potential that can be stuffed compared to other DPS options that are not reliant upon destroyable things other than killing the player. The game is very fast paced.

1 Like
3

The problem with self upgrade is that, without any power to manipulate your turrets hp(increase it( you will only be able to setup a useful turret at the start of a team fight

4

I do not follow this at all. I am thinking of something that might go from lv 1 to lv 2 in the same time Torbjorn would have been hammering on it, but without him being present. It might self heal at lv1 or something with the ability to toss it like a land mine or something with an arc.

You might try to come back to heal it or something. Not sure. Either way, anything to remove Torbjorn having to waste time in the game trying to set-up. This game is just too fast paced to waste time trying to run around with no mobility trying to set-up in places and having your team fight a 5v6 for awhile without you.

5

I play a lot of Torb and I too think he needs some tweaks rather than a rework - but other than shrinking the hit and critical boxes, these arenā€™t the right tweaks

6

Okay, so to preface this, I should say that I donā€™t play a ton of Torb and I only really play him to goof off in QP so I donā€™t have a lot of time on him, but I still want to talk about my thoughts on him. Plus, I love discussing balance and stuff like this.

First, put Molten Core as an ability on a 30 second cooldown and his ultimate is Armor Pack butā€¦better

So, I know that Magy addressed the whole ā€œRelying on the Turretā€ in the OP, but itā€™s still something I see. Granted, I mostly just play QP so itā€™s probably just people that either donā€™t play him seriously or just donā€™t know how to play him, but still. So I mainly just want something that would encourage play outside of his turret. Increasing the projectile speed of his gun maybe? Reducing his critbox is a must. Iā€™ve also seen someone suggest that his turret can upgrade itself if it gets enough kills. Obviously, though, someone who has more experience on him would be able to say how that would play out in the grand scheme of things better than I can. I just think itā€™d be interesting to try.

Honestly, thatā€™s the main things I can think of to change atm. Reduce the critbox and make tweaks to his gun to make it a bit more reliable at more ranges. Most Torbs I see just use the alt-fire so making his primary fire more consistent (with a faster projectile speed) may help. But as Iā€™ve said a few times in this post, I donā€™t have a ton of time on him so someone who has more time than me would have a better say in what he needs. Just thought Iā€™d give my opinions!

7

I always had the idea of Torb throwing an armor pack at his level 1 turret will immediately upgrade it to level 2

ĀÆ_(惄)_/ĀÆ

Other than that maybe has his gun reload when he ults.

1 Like
8

I agree! he dont need it! i cant imagine it without the molten core!

2 Likes
9

I would rather just see the turret given more power instead of Torbjorn.

10

I think it is fair though

A good torb will make you feel in a 7v6

I think it balances it out

Torb can be a powerful hero that can affect the battle even while dead (armor pack + turret)

A good torb knows this, if they focus your turret your free to blast them, if they focus you,your turret will kill them

1 Like
11

I agree with you and all, but the devs donā€™t care anyway.
They donā€™t hear for the most part our feedback (the right feedback, like this, not the complain like ā€œBrigitte is OP because i canā€™t counter herā€), they Will rework Torbjorn anyway and remove a part of his identity (Molten core) like they did with Symmetra or Mercy, and donā€™t care about our opinionā€¦

12

I donā€™t want them to remove molten core :c

4 Likes
13

If 99% of players consider hero as troll pick - it is a troll pick and requires a huge rework, even if 1% of players enjoys that hero.
Just get over it, Torb will be rework and this is absolutely right. He needs a rework because his troll pick state comes not from balance side, but from design side. Torb in his current state simply does no belong to this game, just like old Sym. I hero that is rooted to one place for a long period of time simply because he needs to deploy his full arsenal, which is not even worth of effort put, canā€™t work in the game where high mobility and short TTK is a thing.
If you want Torb be viable with his current design you should balanced him as Engineer from TF2, which means that Turret costs a lot of time and effort, but results in absolute beast that destroys everything on its sight in mere seconds. But it will never happen, because OW is not TF2, it is balanced in absolutely different way.

So unless he get throwable and quick to deploy and self-upgrade (or instant full power with no need to upgrade) turret - he will be a gimmicky sitting duck for ALL other heroes. And I am glad that Devs decided to give him what he needs. And I will be fine if it will cost us a Molten Core - I am open for a new ultimate if it is a good ultimate as well as I am open to have mini Molten Core as regular ability or not have it in Torb kit at all.

14

The fact that people see him as a troll pick is because people are Blind

Simple as that

He is not even that bad in his current iteration, he is seen as a troll pick because of immature players that think anything that they dont play is usless

Syms rework wasnt sucesful either, she is STILL considered a troll pick, she also was removed from that 1% of people to like her, and given to the other 99% and they dont want her anyways so now her pickrate is lower

.also, a lot of heroes were seen as a throw pick and they were seen as better after some.buffs, not reworks

1 Like
15

I donā€™t think he needs much honestly, his kit is pretty good already, Iā€™d say allowing him to toss his turret and heal it from range at a slower rate would help keep Torbjonrns away from the baby sitting mindset and allow him to function more autonomously. AS for leveling it up Iā€™m sure you could work something out, maybe a slow gain of level up over time, or when hit with a molten bolt to heal.

I hate him constantly dropping armor on himself, but I think you could disallow that, and give him 50 armor to start with. Thatā€™d encourage him to drop more packs for everyone and prevent him fro dropping them on himself during combat lessening his effect for the team.

That alone should get him in a decent place.

16

this is my worry - that Torb will be changed by the rework into something that the 99% still hate, and now the 1 % no longer like him either.

I dont want him to be symmetraā€™ed

1 Like
17

I donā€™t think the people saying he should throw his turret have ever played Torb seriously.
Placing the turret effectively and keeping it from dying in seconds is all about angles. Gotta place it in the right spot where it can fire but be protected by the level layout. Throwing it would make it near-impossible to place it where you need it.

18

If they change our Torb, overwatch will never be the same =(

19

I think itā€™d take some gettin used to, but it could be better. I used ot play with a great torb, his trick was getting his turret in hard to reach and see spots, itā€™d be easier with a decent way to get it there without having to truck all the way over.

20

this is easy for me, I think he needs a BIG rework