[Feedback Thread Continued Part III] Mercy Updates - Jan 30, 2018


#19558

I kind of think everyone is.

Too weak for an ultimate, 100 hp/s is something Moira and Ana go over consistently by pressing nade or orb and holding M1 afterwards. Plus without chain beams her damage boost gets 0 changes whatsoever.


#19559

What do you mean? it i–
oh, you mean this one
;_;


#19560

I have an idea for Mercy’s E ability. i have suggested a mini valk in the past but it would make Mercy less dependent of her team so i thought of this.

Mercy would have a mini valk but her beam needs to be attached to a player to maintain flight. However replace chain beams with a 75hps single target beam. This lasts either 6 or 8 seconds and the cooldown is 10 seconds. The length of her beam is extended from 15m to 20m.

OR

Mercy basically gains her super jump once she activates her E ability (the single target 75hps beam) but needs to jump twice and on the 2nd jump she gains the super jump. This does not require a teammate to have her double jump (cooldown time and activation time are the same as above).
Tell me what yall think!!


#19561

Yeah. She feels so stale to play right now. :confused:


#19562

Blizzard: we have 10 different ways to fix Mercy
14 needs later: more nerfs


#19563

I’m just going to quote Titanium’s thesis, since it covers any and all Mercy-related feeback. I’d urge any devs who might be reading this to visit the thread itself, because it has a lot of constructive conversation in it.


#19564

I think you have a very interesting situation here. Where History has repeated itself. Which is similar to your Flagship game “World of Warcraft”. I poured HOURS into that game with a deep passion for it and do miss my old guild members, in a guild that I ran.

In those days It was a Clash between the Dungeon/Raiders vs the Pvper’s then the sub groups broke down to “Battleground players” vs “arena players”. The Arena players which were in comparison to " Comp/ Overwatch League" players. To your BG players (in comparison to your “Quick play” users).

The issue is, you have a game within a game. Thats the shorthand response.

The long response:
For instance the raiders complained that you took away certain healing aspects that they needed for those big boss fights in Ice Crown citadel, Ulduar and Trial of Champions. While the Battlegrounds players complained that those healing mechanics didn’t work so well in fair fights such as Druids popping innervate and healing through mass amounts of damage, thus becoming unstoppable. Then the Arena players had their own 2 cents on that as well. Where it needed to be there, because during some of those long fights, Paladins just were too much at that point in time. So druids had to be able to heal through this.

Honestly you are going to have to consider Handicap’ing at this point. otherwise you will have the continuation, of the “Wheel of Missfortune” that WoW faced. Which was; certain class-players being mad at one another. After each “fix”. Because it wasn’t working for their style of gameplay.

  • Overwatch League + Comp players are their own thing. Respect.

  • Quick Play brawlers (myself) have a different view on this too. Respect.

So let’s put this out there. I’ve been purchasing your content for over 10+ years. You have groups that are mad and leave after every patch. Balancing this game May never even happen. at all. Scientifically speaking infact. Because the skill types are different for each class, at different hours of gameplay and experience in each mode. I’d say A handi-cap system is looking reasonable at this point. I know another game having this problem too. It’s dead by daylight. Ranking system need a new outlook.

Cheers. Keep em coming!


#19565

Mercy needs to be reverted, so she can be fun again


#19566

I made my own thread on how i would make Mercy’s E ability please tell me what you think!


#19567

While Mercy 1.0 had her own problems, I’m suprised that the devs didn’t try to fix them before jumping straight into deleting stuff.

Mercy’s problems extended past a lack of proactive counterplay for mass rez. The biggest problem was primarily one of perception - one that could have been fixed by giving Mercy an E that interacted with the enemy in some way.

Yes, you heard me: Mercy 1.0’s biggest problem was a lack of E ability.

Hear me out:

Classic Mercy’s lack of presence on the battlefield (aka interacting with the enemy) made rez feel like a “dues ex machina” to her enemies.

It’s the old fps mindset of “if it’s not shooting at me, it’s not a threat.” Mercy doesn’t really interact with the enemy, which causes them to tune out her presence - even when she’s zooming around the battlefield like a bunny on crack.

The only time Mercy does become “visible” to the enemy, is when she used the only part of her kit that immediately imacts them: mass rez. The rest of the time, Mercy was a background prop to them.

A background prop dropping in out of the blue to throw a wrench into your plans feels really, really bad.

Mercy 1.0 could have been reworked much better than she did. In my opinion, they should have given mass rez the nerfs it needed to eliminate unhealthy playstyles, and given Mercy an E to compensate - and remind the enemy that “Hey! Don’t tune my presence out, I’m still here!”.

Fixing mass rez

Do a “carrot and stick” approach to eliminating unhealthy playstyles with mass rez. Pressure and incentivise players to use their ult for tempo rezzing.

The stick would be a LoS limitation and free-moving cast time. Flying in at the end of a fight wouldn’t work anymore, because Mercy would get killed or stunned out of rez during the cast.

The carrot would be a burst heal for living allies and Mercy at the end of the cast (around 150hp) instead of giving Mercy invulnerability. Now that she doesn’t have to wait until teammates are dead to use her ult, Mercy can focus on using her ult to keep the fight going, instead of re-starting it after it’s already over.


Putting in a new E

Mercy needs more to do than just beams and rez, but her options for an E abilty are very limited. There’s an E proposal at the bottom of this, but I’d still recommend reading the in-between to understand the reasoning behind it.

Mobility on E is already out, because of the “Mercy needs more to do in a fight” part and the concern that giving Mercy any more mobility than she already has would be overkill. This is assuming that the bunnyhop is kept, and the superjump is made official like the bunnyhop was (crouch before using GA to go vertical instead of horizontal when you bunnyhop).

Damage dealing abilites contradict Mercy’s character design, and crowd control (boops and stuns) are out; simply because we already have too much of it in the game.

There’s also the concern that an E would make Mercy op in the low elos, since she’s already so reliable down there with her consistent healing. So we need something that is weak in the low elos, but strong in the high elos.

The second part is really important, because old Mercy was actually a trash pick in the high elos - they could predict and play around mass rez pretty easily, and that was the only value Mercy has ever brought to a fight in that level of play. She needs something that would compensate for rez being weaker the higher you climb.

A straightforward answer to the question would be an ability that relies on things that low ranks don’t have, but high ranks do: aim, and team coordination.

I’d really like a skillshot for Mercy: it would give new players a transferable skill when they branch out to other heroes, and it provides an interesting skill curve.

When a new player starts out with Mercy, her value will come from her consistent healing and moblity. Hitting the skillshot won’t matter at this beginning point, because it’s effects are designed to be weak in a disorganized setting. But by the time the new player start hitting it reliably, they’ve climbed to an elo where doing so is very important.

This is what I had in mind:

Pacify
Fired like Ana’s sleep dart
4 second duration, 10 second cooldown
Reduces an enemy’s damage output by 20-30%

“Violence isn’t the answer!” Mercy pleads with the enemy to consider talking it out instead of fighting, causing them to feel conflicted and pull their punches for a short period of time.

The exact numbers are up for debate.


#19568

Mercy’s healing didn’t deserve to be nerfed.
She’s the only support that doesn’t do damage (except damage boost but you have to stop healing for that) unlike other supports who can easily heal and do damage at the same time. Now she gets out healed and out damaged by Moira and even Ana.

The problem is her ressurect and Blizzard refuses to acknowledge this.
They could have easily fixed her by just nerfing her old ult (wich was ressurect) like having a longer charge time, decreasing the radius, having a cast time or fixing LoS.
Blizzard decided to nerf her because they didn’t like the idea of Mercy hiding and not healing her team to rez.
Even though right now she still has to hide to rez because of the cast time which causes her to stop healing.
Most mercy players didn’t hide to rez. They would tempo rez to keep the fight going. Some mercy players would hide if their team was starting to lose so they could rez them all, but they would still participate in the fight.

#BringBackOurHero


#19569

Mercy is so boring to play now and no longer feels good to play (how ‘impacful’ is an ultimate when a Winston’s normal fire does more damage than it?).

Moira and Ana (with decent aim) can also pump out more healing than her (despite Mercy supposedly being the hero with most raw healing power) and Mercy can hardly stop healing to use her damage boost since it’s so slow (and if she rezs someone else usually just dies in the meantime).


#19570

Please, just make Mercy fun again! Yes, she’s so close to being balanced. You could probably raise her HPS to like 52.5 and she’d probably be balanced… But she’s just a heal bot now, and her ultimate literally makes her less engaging to play


#19571

I agree that your team did a good job at balancing her to make her in line with other supports, but in doing so you completely sucked out all of the fun. I am a strong supporter of bringing back mass Rez with some tweaks (LOS, dmg reduction instead of invulnerability, SMALL cast time, etc). The “hide and rez” strat was blown WAYYY out of proportion, it was used by very inexperienced Mercy’s and they would not climb the ranks using that as tempo rezzes were much more effective.

One thing I would like to stress is that most Mercy mains are okay with her being a sorta niche pick like 1.0, we picked her then because we liked her play style, not because she was strong.

She doesn’t feel rewarding to play more, even pulling off a clutch Rez is kinda like… cool… This is because you can’t earn rezzes anymore, it’s given to you on a silver platter and it doesn’t allow good Mercy’s to shine. She feels very one dimensional and like a very beginner friendly pick. While some could argue that would be okay, I believe that heroes shouldn’t be designed to accommodate for the first few levels of the game, especially with the rather small hero roster we currently have.

Valkyrie in it’s current form feels like a dumpster version of supercharger and a marginally stronger amp it up. It’s not original and it doesn’t define her. Once you get comfortable with Mercy you realize that you don’t need Valk. You learn how to juggle your beams so the chain healing isn’t super useful, and you learn how to get the most out of your GA so the flight isn’t super useful either…

I’m very happy that this thread has been opened up again as it shows you’re starting to look back into Mercy and valuing the player reviews. I urge you to at least try some of these things being suggested (maybe expand the PTR to test balance changes, not just bugs).


#19573

I bring to this thread, some information:


#19574

Of course they’re done, there’s nothing left to nerf without sending her to D tier or lower. She is now what they wanted her to be, the ultimate moving healthpack that is no longer a threat .


#19575

Consistent healing > Inconsistent healing. Moira has resources to manage, and Ana must have good accuracy to maintain high healing. Most of the time their heals are around the 70-80 hp/sec range. Having 100 hp/sec will be more than enough to keep targets alive.

I’m trying to improve the ultimate and not make Mercy a must pick. We don’t want another moth meta but we do want Valkyrie to be a strong ultimate again, since Blizzard NEVER reverts design balance.

Finally, I said get rid of chain heal. I didn’t say get rid of chain damage boost.


#19576

¯\(ツ)/¯

I don’t want Mercy reverted, but since I’m apparently in the minority my voice doesn’t matter.

/s

Reading through the last few hours since my last post and I’m still not surprised the dev’s haven’t responded in the way that the users in this thread would like. Everyone is hostile towards them, I wouldn’t want to cooperate with individuals like that either, yeesh.


#19577

A revert would be nice, but extremely unlikely. I’ve played Blizzard games for 15 years and have not seen them go back on a design change like this. Even if it was the right decision to make. This is why I wish to modify her ultimate and not revert.


#19578

I’ve also been playing their games for a long while, and I honestly hope they don’t but never say never.

Adapt and Survive, :v: that’s my motto.