Strongest hero lore-wised?

Well that’s easy, just divide by zero :slight_smile:

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Yup. Literally the single most powerful non-Xel’naga being in the entire SCU.

The Protoss glass planets on a regular basis. It’s literally one of their go-to tricks for dealing with Zerg infestations.

And yes, their fleets and Motherships are able to melt through a significant portion of the crust of most planets. They don’t actually destroy the planet entirely, but scouring one of all life is actually fairly common, so common in fact that they have significant portions of the Golden Armada dedicated and outfitted specifically for this task.

Hell, the Spear of Adun alone has enough firepower to render a planet uninhabitable.

The planets exist inside the realms.

What, do you subscribe to the “Flat Sanctuary” hypothesis?

No, these are separate small little universes inside a larger, grander one.

Okay, it’s becoming pretty clear that you are a massive Warcraft fanboy with little to no understanding of the other Blizzard franchise universes.

Let’s compare Arthas’ Scourge to Kerrigan’s Swarm.
#1 - Control
They are roughly equal in their control over their respective hordes.

Just as the Scourge act as an extension of Arthas’ will, with some lieutenants micromanaging the undead when Arthas is busy elsewhere, the Zerg are also an extension of Kerrigan’s will, with lieutenants who handle the micromanaging while Kerrigan is busy elsewhere.

#2 - Population
Lol, this isn’t even close.

The Scourge probably number in the tens or hundreds of thousands. If they overran all of Azeroth and converted every member of the intelligent races to undead, they might break 100 million, which is the most reasonable estimate for the total population of Azeroth I’ve found.

Now take that entire population of Azeroth, cube it, and you have a reasonable estimate for the number of Zerg in the Koprulu sector. Of course, that population is spread out over hundreds of systems and worlds, but there can easily be tens or hundreds of billions of Zerg on a single planet.

#3 - Reproduction/Expansion
This also goes massively in favor of the Zerg.

The Scourge need corpses to expand their numbers. Considering that there is a limit to the population of Azeroth, there is a hard and (comparatively) low limit to how large their armies can become.

Zerg, on the other hand, can get everything they need from even the most destitute environments. They are able to break down any organic material into its component substances and then use those substances as resources for reproduction and growth. They can do the same with most non-organic materials, so long as it has the correct chemical components. In other words, the Zerg can also increase their numbers by using enemy corpses, but unlike the Scourge they are not limited to that method. They can also just “eat” the plants, or even just rich enough soil and rocks.
As a result there is no hard cap on how large the Zerg population can grow.

If you’re going to call either of these hordes “infinite,” it definitely shouldn’t be the far less populous and pervasive Scourge.

Yes she can. She can literally generate Zerg parasites from her body tissue that can develop into Broodmothers by feeding on organic tissue and biomass.

Nevermind, you clearly don’t know much about Warcraft either.

The Scourge existed well before Arthas. He didn’t create the Scourge, he was actually dragged into it before eventually rising to the top, just like Kerrigan was with the Zerg.

Definitely a fanboy with little to no understanding of what he’s talking about.

We’ve covered this all in another thread on whether the Scourge would stand a chance against the Zerg.

I wrote probably 20+ word document pages worth of text on that subject in that thread.
To put it simply, the Scourge could only win if they started off with significant advantages over the Zerg, such as a well-established foothold while the Zerg are setting theirs up, knowledge of where the Zerg are setting up, and the ability to reach the Zerg hive cluster within a week or two of the Zerg first establishing it.

In other words, they’d need to catch the Zerg before the Zerg can fight back. If they can’t catch and eradicate them fast enough, the Scourge stand literally no chance against the Zerg Swarm. The Zerg would simply end up overwhelming them with numbers and lethality.

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Maximus, we don’t agree on everything but you are a massive database :smiley:

a single leviathan could single handedly run all of northrend raids and win. a SINGLE, leviathan. that’s not kerrigan, who can likely run all raids, dungeons, and kill about 50% of the scourge ALONE. and that’s being INCREDIBLY generous. she can just anhilliate ICC at the edge of northrend. Yes, the lich king’s consciousness and control expanded from ner’zhul ten thousand fold, but he cannot communicate to another planet. the scourge are useless on 2 or more planets. kerrigan can communicate to all, ALL her zerg.

this is a massive mismatch honestly.

Ppl going “my fav multiverse is stronger no matter what” really makes me not want to participate in these threads :confused:

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I mean this is literally fanboisim in a nutshell.

b-b-but shadow the hedgehog is stronger than sonic for being the uLtImAtE LiFeFoRm, no sonic is strong cuz he’s cooler!!! Uwu

There’s no winning.

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I think there is only one person who has that stance in the recent posts… But, regardless, this thread should leave the discussion regarding two specific parties especially one they aren’t talking about Kerrigan/Arthas specifically.

I personally think there has only been one CLEAR fanboy in the recent discussion on the swarm/scourge in this thread.

Either way, discussing it here is again silly.
let us get back on topic.

Also

I think it might be more interesting if you note exactly what area someone is the strongest in.

“Who lore wise would beat everyone or win the most 1v1 death matches?”
or
“Who lore wise could destroy a massive army the fastest?”

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Shadow is obviously stronger because he’s so edgy his opponents get cut to pieces just by looking at him.

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Kerrigan, Deathwing, Arthas, and Malthael or Diablo.

Deathwing, Ragnaros, Kerrigan, and Malthael. Maybe Baal, but I don’t know enough about him to be sure.
Honorable mention to Tassadar and Nova for their insane clear speeds via their AoE one-shots. Tass would have to kill himself to do it though, and Nova would probably only be able to do it once before passing out.

Note the order I listed them in is not important, and does not indicate rank or anything. It was literally just the order they came to mind in.

I have no idea if or where Medivh would fit on either of these.

debatable if she could do it. Not sure how much stronger she was after training versus before.

But it would need to be multiple magnitudes stronger to take on what for me would be a baseline “massive army” (low 100Ks).

iirc, she did a few hundred and passed out before any training.

Finally I can unleash my OC, Zero The Artificial Hedgehog made by Dr. Robotnik in his super secret underwater volcano lab in space.

He’s so cool guys he’s powerful, haha funny.

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WHAT! SO COOL!

Why isn’t he in HotS yet? He space travel time speed run into game right?

Although no exact size is given (that I can find anyway, there are definitely people who know more about Diablo than me that might be able to find something though) , it can likely be argued that the pocket dimension is intended to be basically its own universe, complete with an earth-like planet (Sanctuary itself), celestial bodies like the moon and the sun, stars, etc. Heaven and the Burning Hells appear to occupy different points of the same massive universe as they are basically the end result of the remnants of Anu and Tathamet’s bodies “rotting” and creating the Burning Hells/Heavens.

That’s a… strange conclusion to come to. Just because the worldstone was used to create Sanctuary doesn’t mean Sanctuary’s existence was tied to the stone’s existence. Many worlds were created with the worldstone beforehand and they died despite the fact the stone still existed. As far as we know, if used properly, the worldstone can create many worlds without exhausting its power or anything and its destruction doesn’t mean that worlds created using its power suddenly die as well.

Malthael wasn’t interested in destroying sanctuary, he was interested in altering the black soulstone to collect and contain demonic essence in general, a side affect of which meant that humans (who have some demonic essence due to basically being depowered nephalem) would be largely killed as a result. That being said, Inarius feared that Nephalem would far surpass any demon or angel period and Uldyssian (who probably isn’t as strong as current Nephalem) managed to defeat Inarius even when the latter was empowered by the Worldstone itself.

Diablo 3 and Reaper of Souls already implies that the Nephalem are growing so strong that they are encroaching on the level of Anu and Tathamet ( Prime Evil Diablo would technically contain a HUGE portion of Tathamet’s power anyway as the Prime Evils/Lesser Evils are what the bulk of his power became after his death) so the Nephalem having more powerful than even the world stone isn’t that outlandish.

tl;dr: if you believe that the worlds created by the worldstone (which likely contains a significant amount of power from one of the two Gods of the entire Diabloverse) can be as big as a universe then the Nephalem are likely a multiversal threat at their peak as even weaker Nephalem were capable of beating people empowered by the world stone, current Nephalem dunked on Prime Evil Diablo and super buffed Malthael+Black Soulstone,etc.

ADDENDUM: Try to keep in mind that Diablo is more of a fantasy series so we likely will never get any 100% concrete answer that we’d get from a more sci fi-oriented series like statements like “Diablo can fight at 15 times the speed of light!” or “The worldstone creates entire universes complete with life created on all of the billions and billions of planets”. I’m just debating this for funsies with that in mind.

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When she was a kid, she completely destroyed a tactical nuke-resistant building.
When she was a Ghost cadet, she destroyed an entire hive cluster, which easily covers a couple dozen square miles.

She’s been exposed to Terrazine twice since then, empowering her both times and likely bumping her up nearly an order of magnitude in psionic power in total. I’m fairly confident that if she removed her psi-screen/inhibitor, she could pull off a full-sized nuclear blast off at this point, though the strain would almost certainly knock her out like it did with the smaller blasts when she was younger.

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Like my Illidan having his laser eyes and all that edgy stuff that looks and sounds to me as someone’s OC character, but with some sensibility but no balance.

When we say planet destroying we’re talking planet buster
As in the only thing comparable would be the destruction of Shakuras which was enabled by a power source that was embedded already into the planet and required god knows how much time to power up

Much different to literally just cleaving planets in two for the lolz

The other 50% have soul attacks and one shot Kerrigan Via HAX

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Mate, are you even paying attention anymore? This isn’t 40k. Shi doesn’t even have anything comparable to a hive city.

Render it uninhabitable. Not shatter it into pieces or literally cleave it in two. The US army has enough firepower to render a planet uninhabitable. This is multiple magnitudes below what the full force of a Titan’s might or fel corruption could do to a planet.

Yes. You don’t? Every realm in the setting works on this basis. Hell is a pile of lasagna. It’s not written using a modern understanding of physics. That’s not how the narrative is structured and you repeatedly attempting to us vsbattles logic to argue the point is missing it entirely.

That is, if you continue to assume Ner’zhul and Arthas remain distinguishable individuals at this point. The Lich King is a merger of the two that primarily takes the personal attributes of Arthas and his name.

For all intents and purposes, there is no Ner’zhul. There is no Arthas. The moment the Death Knight put the helm on, there is only the Lich King.

Only as long as you assume they can’t raise Zerg. Seeing as Zerg are alive, that is hardly an easy assumption. And the Zerg are heavily limited because here’s a shocker, they need to eat. That’s why they harvest Vespene in particular, because Zerg Metabolisms are, shall we say, rather ravenous, and unlike the Scourge, they are limited by being living.

This is in comparison to the Scourge, which has no such limitations, and of especially important note, any and all raised broodmothers or other intelligent zerg retain their experience, while those killed and replaced by the swarm lose it.

Abilities the Zerg had while living are retained in the state of undeath, but the unnatural strength of the scourge and it’s frost magics can no more be imitated by the swarm than it can develop the ability to create mass ex nihilo. That’s another key factor you’re leaving out. As seen in LOTV’s trailer, Ultralisks clearly do have a pain reflex, whereas an undead one wouldn’t even flinch at being impaled.

Put bluntly, the scourge made Thaddeus from nothing more than human flesh. Imagine what they could do with so much more body parts to work with. You’re trying to put out a wildfire with napalm here.

actually, the spear of adun’s core is an entire star. they COULD destroy the planet if they REALLY wanted to but why would they do that? but in all cases yea titans>protoss.

Oh. Yeah I forgot about it. Gods are easily beaten in games.

This one. But I guess it also applies to the first one as well.

Pretty sure that it’s gonna be a D2 case again, with the Nephalim being a group of heroes, meaning that the Nephalim was a team name like “the Avengers” for a group of heroes (Valla, Li-Ming, Kharazim, Nazeebo, Johanna, the Barbarian, the followers, not sure if RotN is cannon or not). Both Li-Ming and Valla have canon short stories that say that they went after the fallen star, both of them, and all other HotS heroes, except the Barbarian, have all been all but confirmed as canon representatives. Despite Valla liking to work alone, and Li-Ming being so good that she astounds herself.