Salt Mines - Deposit all your anger here!

General Discussion
5899

I have a long history of…

  • have a good game
  • accept friend request
  • later team up
  • lose all games
  • lose “friend”

The game expects you to coordinate. If you are persistent, you can figure out what’s your optimal setup and then stick to it. When summing up MMR for matching, parties get a bonus. This enables randoms to win against five mans, but it’s somewhere in the middle: well coordinated teams will still stomp, while randoms will now certainly lose.

Plus if your ranks are far, it will get difficult for the weaker players. I played a few with Harbinger last week and it was horrible for me. The MMR average was roughly two ranks above my best matches (2900 instead of 2600), so it doesn’t matter whether I’m bullied by 5 high plats or 2 high masters, the result is the same.

My bottom line was to never party, as I cannot compensate for the penalty. Of course, AI or ARAM is fine.

2 Likes
5900

Thankfully for me, these are real life friends. I’m not insinuating that yours are/aren’t.

We do have really tough games, and some stretch for really long because we always try smart than hard if we can. Sometimes we lose, sometimes we win. It’s been pretty even if I take a large sample size.

Our case is Novas. We’re tired of those and those with the cheese build/s. We would rather get a less mechanically skilled player play anything (even that murky was a relief) instead of another Nova. We’ve encountered 1~3 good Novas in 30 days, with those specific talents. We do sometimes win with them, but it’s not often fun.

Perhaps our grouping enhances the chances of getting players who only play Nova to balance out as you stated? Maybe :thinking:

If you’re on NA you can send me a FR. We’re very chill.

5901

This reminds me of why I haven’t play ranked for 2 weeks. My draft so often looks like that, I will have the tank/healer role picked and the rest of the team is showing 4 assassins. At least you have one player willing to play a bruiser, but it’s cold comfort. Oh and yeah, I mostly have lost with Azmodan players too.

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5902

Azmo is always instant lose no matter what unless enemy team is worse then you.

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5903

Azmodan is a fairly good complement to teams which have good early PvP game but then don’t scale too well. He delivers as long as he can stack and deliver structures.

I’m seeing Azmodan winrates dropping from earlier seasons, maybe the fire-and-forget ult isn’t as good as it’s meme. But it’s still around 48%, 4pp below my average.

Had a rather annoying Azmodan player consciously ignoring our teamplay a few days ago, we were getting borderline annoyed, but realised he is actually scaling like crazy. Look at these stats:
https://www.heroesprofile.com/Match/Single/?replayID=36309216
Sure, high diamond / low master, but still.

In any event, this is why I played 7/7 non-assassin yesterday. Fortunately after two upsetting games (and a break) I got the other endof the stick, including a region smurf duo from the Far East.

There is a fallacy in that healers and tanks have to become assassins and risky to be fun and more popular. While that’s one way to do it, it can get too complicated or volatile.

For example Li Li, everyone’s favorite easy hero, is performing better at higher ranks, showing about 46% from in-game mid-Gold and below.

Lucio or Brightwing are also fairly bad if you just heal.

Complicated heroes are fine, sort of (sometimes the reward is too high, those Tracer / Genji players with 15-25 kills per match aren’t really fun for anyone involved), but at least with assassins there are so many, there is something for everyone.

I think the community needs a solid set (5-8) of fairly easy tanks. Anub is good, Johanna needs tiny buffs (trait is crap) but good, but that’s where it ends. Diablo possibly, but most people run away with aggression. Muradin has potential but he isn’t outstanding either, mostly due to high Q requirements. Mal’ganis could work but not popular enough.

Same about healers.

2 Likes
5904

Sometimes he afk pushes and the enemy ignores him. But my enemies haven’t ignored mine so far :slight_smile:

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5905

My team. KTZ LI-MIng, KT (me), Gaz and Samuro vs Wannebie W build Falstad, Nova, Sonya, DW and Leo

Matchmaker: Balanced game have fun getting stomped. And we did.
Zero objects won and Gaz has zero chance as only frontliner againts that.
Matchmaker is not even trying now.

1 Like
5906

Grouped up with a friend. I was just telling him how I kept getting afks, and we get an afk Sylvanas.

Then the next game.

Imgur

Then the next game after that, our draft was so horrible that for the first time ever , I just left a draft. I can’t take it anymore.

1 Like
5907

5 man or bust. Too strong

5908

What does “Fairly easy” entail? With the current community of players would be one that can forcefully teleport the tank into specific positions on the map:

1 - [Q] Get vision in a bush between 2 lanes. After 2 seconds, teleport to it.The next enemy hero who passes by gets damaged and dismounted
2 - [W] Mobility tool, but you always go in the best possible direction
3 - [E] Hammer of Justice
4 - [R] Press to let the system decide: Hard engage if you’re up in talents tiers/number advantage/ults available [or] Disengage pushing the enemy away
5 - [D] Some defensive one button instant goodie

Part of the reason why Mei is also good for people who don’t know how to tank is because she’s still effective in those “bad decision environments”.

I see you, you see me, honorable fight of tanks FTL.

5909

Genuinely, I don’t know. There are a few lines of thinking.

a) Skill disparity. This is my issue. I’m relatively better on mages. So when I’m forced to tank, I’m automatically worse, by a rank or two. My anti-tilt mindset is to say in chat, I’ll tank, but you have to carry me. I also autoplay like a mage a little, finishing waves to not lose XP, or starting that camp nobody cared about for 4 minutes straight.

b) QM - Great environment to learn safe, self sufficient heroes. When it comes to tanking (without a healer), it’s a struggle, not having fun. During draft, I have this memory, I’m bad, will struggle and won’t be fun. Also, it promotes the habit of never engaging. You’ll just blow up, why suicide?

c) Fun - I guess people enjoy finishing stuff. Clearing waves, clearing camps, scoring takedowns. A well progressed Q build Muradin is fun.

Bottom line would be, a hero that doesn’t have fantastic winning moves, but has reliable small wins. Observe Silvers and don’t try to teach them, but adapt some heroes to their playstyles. Yes, you can teach me, but you won’t teach the other million and even if you do, what about followup, macro… Silver is silver for a reason. And that’s where most people are. HP stats are flawed because high ranks are proportionally few while overrepresented in match uploads. Filtering to Bronze-Silver-Gold there and comparing it to global (or the complement) is a good start.

(I may have described the bruiser class. There are indeed several heroes that kinda match, especially the overtuned ones. Except for the durability component.)

5910

Just went into an ARAM where my team stomped 28-0 in an 8 Minute game.

Via replay i found out two of them quit at the 4 minute mark. They were bad before and we would probably won anyways, but it still takes from the joy :frowning:

2 Likes
5911

Nomal day in Hots on a weekend. Que up as tank and you get 4 players that ignore help pings and force you as tank to defend lanes and take merc camps alone while they keep boosting thier hero dmg in some corner of the map and then dies.

Alarak i could care less about your 110k hero dmg. In the end you did nothing but boost your stats while lanes got overrun

LILI i dont care you got 190k healing when you run around together with Alarak and ignore lanes too. You even pinged to defend top lane but did not even walk up and defended it yourself lol. Way to throw the problem away from you and your friend and just let the tank do everything.

Good you guys lost, you deserved it. I could just afk in base and let the 9 catapults that was on thier way to our core kill our core while both you and your friend afk fights bot lane.

2 Likes
5912

People report for literally everything. It’s such an abused system.

5913

Were those two grouped together? I often find when you get 2 or 3 stacks they only help each other and just spend the game brawling, not clearing/defending lanes or getting camps, etc…

As much as I love playing Healer and Tank, I will only queue up for them in QM if they have call of the nexus up! :slight_smile:

2 Likes
5914

Yea they were together.

1 Like
5915

Called it. It’s not every time of course, but so often being grouped with a 2/3 or worse 4, is a terrible experience for me. You would think a group of randoms would be worse, but not in my experience.

*Froggy, the Stitches Avatar has to be as far away as you can get from Brightwing. I can’t recall a forum regular who even uses Stitches as an avatar…

2 Likes
5917

Another interesting SL comp.

Imgur

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5918

At least double bruiser is strong right now. I hope you win? You have tons of aoe wombo combo in every single hero

Uh oh. On second view you have no healer. Rip

5919

You mean the combo of having Misha spread Cassia’s Ball lightning? lol.

1 Like