You have to take LOL and DOTA2 with the historical context. Majority of players grew up with LOL and DOTA2 and those were the main type of this game genre. So of course in terms of familiarity and fanbase buildup, those 2 have a huge advantage over HOTS.
Think of it similar to the current phenomenon of Apex legends vs Fortnite. As it is, there’s some suggestion that people are returning to Fortnite for a variety of reasons. Clearly Apex has some work to do if they want to overcome the Fortnite competition.
In that same vein, HOTS had a chance but blew it and now it’s done, gutted, and being thrown away by the company.
Not really. There were a lot of players in the Alpha stage and most of them don’t stick to the game long enough. I wonder why? Maybe it is because the core gameplay is just not appealing to the mass.
Items, Runes, etc are just artificial “depth”. There will always be an “optimal build” that you are just a noob if you do not adhere to and items end-up having cookie cutter builds.
Talents actually change the way a hero plays rather than simply enhancing stats or adding effects to already existing abilities.
Talents are so much better than items and runes, I actually think HotS has MORE depth than LoL and DotA2, it has multiple maps, many heroes with many talents and having a choice between 2 ultimates per hero is a game changer.
So I disagree, your idea of a “layer” of complexity adds nothing exciting or innovative to the game, rather it only adds “fluff” for the sake of having “fluff”.
I love HotS as it is, even after the things I didn’t like after 2.0 hit.
Please stop with the tired illusion of “complexity” that LoL/DotA2 is more than willing to give you. Those games are there ALREADY just waiting for you to grind away and flame your team mates for having a life or not having a PhD in MOBA mechanics. I always thought MOBAs were dumb because of the mechanics involved and how ridiculous the people who played it acted. It wasn’t until I received an invite to the HotS Alpha that I fell in love with it since it wasn’t a typical MOBA.
I like going into a game where your only excuses are player performance and MAYBE your team comp. We DO NOT need a silly item system to buffer [lack of] knowledge of game mechanics and the design of each individual hero. Picking talents live, during the match is much more interesting than the alternative.
You don’t even know what macro means, but judging how you still continue spread your misinformation I guess you are just defending yourself.
New info: There are camps with timer on lol and dota too.
Not like it would matter. A game, which is so shallow that you literately need to mention every useless small thing on the map is straight out garbage.
If you do the things that are _ REQUIRED _ by design, you ain’t going to become a good player… you ain’t going to beocme skilled either… you will be only at 0, zero. You only proved that you have like 60iq and can follow simple things.
But that’s still nothing. Defending a game with the ability to do the objective is like defending yourself that you are smart cause you can read.
LMAO, that’s still nothing…
This, nah, this is G - O - L - D.
It exactly shows:
-the level of a average hots player
-and why this game died
When in a e-sport game - which should be all about from the players skill - pushing a button in a map is more important than the actual game play, then you should not be surprised, that every player with measurable IQ avoids that said game like plague…
items, runes = talents
Congratulations, you just disapproved yourself…
Your first part ain’t even correct.
If you exactly know the situation, then what you said is true.
However in reality, you not going to know how your opponent will build, so there ain’t a cookie cutter build either.
Yeah also just to mention, that only the average/thrash tier plebs use cookie clutter builds. Every decent player can create their own builds.
But that’s what separates the garbage from the rest. The garbage just copies what the pros doing, and then pretending to be a good player.
While the actual good players actually have brain…
(btw: just as they copy the pro players build in lol, they copy it in hots too.)
It has multiple maps… and there are their own cookie cutter heroes for every map, so much depth :))))))))))))
It’s so pathetic seeing the not so smart players defending their game with the exactly same thing that they mentioned as negative in a another game
Also yeah, hawing two ultimate is sure game changer… usually there is a viable one, and a “we lose” one… #justhotsballancethings
I assume you are a self-proclaimed “smart” player? Nice to know, btw I’m the queen of England
They are cookie-cutter builds because they are effective in most scenarios, sure I will grant you that you can gain an advantage by itemizing properly vs the enemy and depending on variable circumstances, but is that actually what makes a game better or again, add an artificial layer of #complexity that is not actually needed?
This must be the “smartness” you were referring to… How can I possibly think that an item that gives you +45 damage or extra movement speed or lifesteal is different than a talent that adds an ability like… say Zeratul’s Seeker in the dark which lets him teleport to his W target…
You must be right because you are so intelligent and we are just low IQ fools.
You heard it here folks, from the High IQ, super smart God tier player himself items and runes = Talents
So much truth to this. Just like in HOTS you have people copy / pasting builds of talents, instead of adapting to the situation / comp. Same concept. The people with brains squeeze every little bonus out of any system they have available. The noob dont think and just copy. That cant be avoided. Lets not punish those with brains just because some people can not comprehend the when / why / how.
Well in sht tier it sure ain’t needed, but on high level that’s pretty much the basic.
Your “smartness” comes into paly, when there are talents in hots which literately only adds life steal, ms or AD.
Yeah not ALL does only that, but the two has the same purpose in the end.
But why I even bother, your incompetence was already visible in your past posts, and every additional post just confirms it even more.
But I put a side note here which have no relation to your comment:
In lol/dota, items are a generic power ups, which are available to everyone, boosting generic things. It helps covering the weakness of your champion, which heavily affects counter play.
In hots, the game already decided in the picking screen, as there’s close to zero option to modify your hero’s strength in game. If you has a weakness, you will have it in whole game, and there’s nothing that you can do again it.
In lol if you lack in mobility, you can buy a fcking boot, and suck a little less. In hots you simply going to get rped again and again, and there’s nothing that you can do again it.
This makes hots stale. There’s no fun, if the outcome is already decided just by the compositions.
Ofc it COULD be solved by talents, and in the past there was very few hero who could do it (ie: Tyrande), but the incompetent developers with their sht tier reworks made the already shallow game design even worse by removing half of the talent trees for no reason, and putting talents affecting the same ability into the same tier, so making specializing impossible.
except what I listed is exactly what Macro Play is. LITERALLY:
Team Dignitas article about micro vs macro
Macro gameplay in League of Legends is the way in which you use micro in conjunction with the information you receive about the game during the game (including during Champ Select) to press your win conditions over others by gaining and utilizing your advantages on a map-wide scale. While micro is more closely linked to the individual, macro is more about the team, how well you play into it, and how well it executes in order to meet its goals. An easy way to remember this is that it has everything to do with the strategy side of League of Legends. This aspect of League places heavy emphasis on your game knowledge and awareness overall, not just mechanically, and can make or break even the best of mechanical players as far as how often you win or lose games. Just look at any of the professional League scenes if you don’t believe me.
Examples of macro-based decisions include:
A jungler camping a top laner who does not have Teleport in order to massively set him behind early
Ending the game instead of going for that Baron that’ll just stall the game out and potentially throw it
Lane swaps
Invades
Where, when, and how you set and deny vision
And the list goes on…
[quote=“MightyOwl-213475, post:126, topic:19463”]
New info: There are camps with timer on lol and dota too.
Not like it would matter. A game, which is so shallow that you literately need to mention every useless small thing on the map is straight out garbage.
[/quote] who cares?
I coached a good buddy of mine from low silver all the way to low plat in the span of about a month just by helping him improve his macro play. like I’ve said, macro is super important in HOTS and is one of the biggest reasons players struggle compared to other Mobas.
Not at all. One of the best Hanzo players in the pro scene cares more about landing constant good scatter arrows than less, “perfect” ones, His micro is way better than yours and mine but he still cares more about the macro. Micro play increases naturally over time as you become better at a game. Dota and League put a large emphasis on micro play to the point that you can play almost no macro and 1v3 purely on the basis of your stats.
the idea that micro play is a skill but macro isn’t is probably why you aren’t as good at HOTS as you think you are. Micro play is, funny enough, what gives lower skilled players a lot of joy. Landing the perfect hit and getting a kill gets people hype. Yet Macro play is what actually wins games. you’re arguing against yourself by showing you’re part of the low skill, average Moba player who swoons over micro play.
Well you’ve nailed the catch 22, Blizzard stock won’t rise delivering a bad product . . .
Blizzard was cursed, imo, with it massive success in WoW. The company thinks it knows better than their customers, and that can work to inovate and break new ground, but it certainly doesn’t work trying to compete in an already existing game type.
One who defend HotS blindly with comparison of items simply just for “adding damage, lifesteal, hp” is just people who actually have no idea how moba works.
Item work similarly with talent, only talent is hero-specific one. And you should see more items on dota, it’s just not adding stat, but activr skill that really really really gamechanging.
Unlike HotS talent which people usually copy paste for “strongest” build, items really determine your play, mean different enemy require different set of items.
Im not defending items,
But the more fanbois defend this literally sinking games, the more i know that their knowledge in moba actually so laughable. Sorry pal, but i know you’re frustated with other moba - but even the pros said this game is sinking ship.
Adding layer of complexity is one this game need, it doesn’t have to be item.
Are you speaking from experience or something? What makes you think teamplay matters more here? Have you played LOL / DOTA 2? I am not so sure you know what you are talking about.
Past the 10-15 min mark teamplay matters just as much in the other mobos, if not more. I really do not understand this logic, since it so very wrong.
![:rage:](https://d3rakab8gpdsa3.cloudfront.net/en/heroes/images/emoji/twitter/rage.png?v=6" ":rage:")