Mercenaries renown IS TRASH!

No, we don’t want anything like that.
‘American’ colloquially refers to anyone from the two continents in South America, I believe, and the use of the word meaning US persons exclusively would be either confusing or even imperialistic, as far as I know.

These are international forums, and I’d prefer to be as sensitive as I can with this kind of language. I think we’ve found a goold alternative in this particular example.

A small correction: was. :grinning: The MS has been removed for good.

Maybe because you claimed:

but you can never offer an unqualified criticism of it, and the mere thought of doing so seems to puzzle you to a high degree.

Even your denouncement of the workplace harassment situation has a massive deflection:

Holy Light, I lobbed you an easy one, and you STILL couldn’t just say without waffling it was 100% on the company without shifting blame. This is 100% the sign of someone who can’t denounce their corporate overlords.

you try shifting this back on me, since I didn’t create the illegal lootbox situation that required multiple countries to pass laws banning the practice (well, I do know why, and that’s because the thought of holding the company responsible is somehow difficult for you). Because, like tobacco, companies like actiblizz were marketing this to kids and people with gambling addictions to circumvent the whole gambling license and related laws.

Not so lost that you couldn’t write a blog post in defense of the company and mercstone, as usual.

From the author of:

the scummy laughing about someone burning themselves and requiring medical treatment:

Some of course spammed, and almost always with the emjoi for extra trolling.

I’m not sure if you realize this, but that’s not me posting that.

So because I won’t make a blanket statement I’m a corporate shill? This is preposterous.

So by denouncing American corporate culture, I’m incapable of denouncing corporate overlords? Like that’s not a zero sum statement of “everywhere is like this so it’s okay”. It’s a statement that the entire industry is rotten and something should be done that impacts the entire industry.

Like this whole conversation seems to be more about you wanting blanket statements from me, or for me to prove myself as ideologically pure, and I just really do not care to do that. I don’t need to “prove myself” to a stranger on the internet.

Like this whole point was a complete non-sequitur. The government is already suing Blizzard over this. It’s a warning to the entire industry that this kind of behaviour isn’t going to be tolerated anymore.

I’m “defending” (if you can call it that – it’s a video game) the F2P experience in Mercenaries. Not the ethics of selling loot boxes to children or gambling addicts, or the pricing model they’re using. But I really don’t see those things as related honestly. They shouldn’t market “loot boxes”, they should find ways to distribute in-game currency and product that don’t involve rolling dice when opening digital card packs. They shouldn’t charge so much for digital products that have no real, finite value and depreciate so harshly, yes.

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Formatting issue, that’s on me. But this IS you (among others:

an unqualified criticism of the company. It’s not hard…I gave you an easy one, nd you still deflected for them.

actually denouncing one specific company, instead making it a larger issue when we were talking about one instance. It’s a nice trick, to try and dilute the issue, but people paying attention know it’s a bad faith tactic.

…and it was settled for less than half of what weinstein paid for the same offenses, right about the time microsoft stepped in for the buy.

at least you finally admitted it. Progress at last!

you guys are all crazy . who would open a company if not to make money, f2p game always got this spending garbage. but all company are going that direction. why ? we the consumer support it by buying . might not be you buying but some one is because they want to be on the top. and yes the people that spend get the stuff faster.

and as far as American … being and expat and traveling to many places … the only people that call them selves American are from the U.SA. ask other people From the American Contintnents refer them selve as Canadian , Brazilian , Mexican …etc.

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I called him a jackass after he was mocking me. “This is the nonsense.” is not really that rude, I thought what they said was nonsense. “You tool” was in response to you calling me a shill.

Well I wasn’t aware of that, but that’s really nothing I have any control over.

THAT’S a bad faith tactic? Then what is even bringing up the sexual assault allegations in response to us talking about the monetary practices of the mode in the first place?

I’m very against sexual assault and companies not punishing their executives over it.

So uh, you took that quote completely out of context I guess.

You talking about bad faith is ridiculous.

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I’m new to mercenaries. I just recently got into it and I’ve been having a lot of fun farming the tasks for the characters I like. I agree and disagree with a few of the points made here. As a new player:

  • The task system is great, and it keeps me playing more and trying out new mercenaries instead of endlessly farming the same level.
  • It is annoying to get new mercs; we need some sort of bad luck protection.
  • The renown system (I only have 2 mercs maxed out after 1 week playing) is not horrible, but needs improvement.

The biggest fix mercenaries could get at the moment is:

  • Renown coins can be used as any coins for any mercenary, at any time, without the need to wait for a conversion quest taking space in the campfire.

That works two fold: it makes the Renown coins actually useful for all players at all times, and it makes it so that if you use your renown to rush a new merc you’d lose total coins in the long run. That leaves the player with agency, choosing whether to wait to finish tasks and use coins only to top off a mercenary, or rush one particular mercenary to max at the cost of value.

A second fix I’d love for mercenaries is allowing us to target specific portraits somehow; just like how we can target specific coins.

  • Add a small chance to get a portrait instead of coins from bounties, maybe as low as 1%, but hopefully something reasonable, like 5%-10%. That will further encourage doing bounties other than spamming the easy ones.
  • Sell portraits in the shop. have at least 5 available portraits for sale each day.

These changes would greatly help with the monetization of the mode, as buying packs for coins is just horrible. The only reason to buy packs is to get the beginning of a collection running, but it has massive diminishing returns after the first 150 packs (which is nothing compared to vanilla HS, which needs thousands of packs to have a full collection, and encourages buying 100 packs every couple months).

thats what he does
he pretty much creates a new context for any quote

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Welcome outside your own personal bubble! See, for instance, more or less the first link on the subject from the search engine:
You could do your own research if you wished.

On the other hand, weren’t you the one considering the likes of Facebook, YouTube and Twitter the bulwarks of ‘free press’? I suppose that explains the… narrow perspective.

You’d be surprised how much more complicated the world is.

Anyway, back to the topic.

Are you referring to the legendaries?

One week, and two mercs already maxed? Have you thought what happens when most of them are? :wink:

By the way, the renown system is more about that stage of the game — I don’t think you, as a new player, should bother with it much yet (you decide, of course, but that’s just my suggestion, based on my experience).

Do you mean with the same exchange rate as we’ve got now?

You know, I’ve got plenty of excess coins, yet I’ve declined all the trade offers I’ve got so far. One of the mercs, Neeru, levelled up naturally shortly thereafter… There’s Tyrael, but he’s slowly getting there, and Rattlegore, but that’s another story — the rest of my mercs are maxed already. The point is, I see no rush to exchange more coins.

I’d advise strongly against it. Not only is the exchange rate horrible (right now people could use all the renown accumulated from playing the game for about a year actively to max a few legendaries, perhaps… which is not much), but also there’s no rush, I’d say — and more effective ways to level up your mercs, especially for PvE.

At this point, I’m hoarding renown for possible future updates.

Extra portraits are probably how the game should be monetised — after all, they are cosmetic only, do not affect balance, but could be desirable for many. In this light, the second suggestion — yes! I’ve written about it already. Unfortunately, right now you tend to get random occasional offers from the shop — and often not the ones you want anyway.



It’s called the bozo worldview, black-and-white, as stated previously — the same one when they cannot possibly comprehend how a bad person could have written a good musical piece, for instance, and if the former was bad, the latter should be burned, discarded and so on (‘cancelled’, if you will), although that’s probably more complicated for them than even to see behind the aforementioned ‘If you’re not with us, you’re against us’ attitude.

Mercs for newcomers is pretty darn ftp in all aspects. 4 day one players and very casually and after getting all there’s nothing much to do, unless you pvp. But there’s an end game coming soon… Anyhow, last pve content provided with 7 packs , 2 golden legendaries portraits + all the coins in between contracts. It took me abt 10hrs to do the latest content and as you mentioned after an initial 10/15k gold or money to start the collection then there’s no point in buying packs at all. But you can still start fm scratch and get everything, never can you do this in HS.
Double shady coin conversion what was the thread abt before it was derail and the points to fix them(doubt that they will, but one can hope) , specific merc conversion without the offering should have been enough considering the abysmal coin conversion 4 the longtime player. Getting portraits should have been in tables as well, but I guess that’s how they make their $$ as people are tempted with the bundles just 4 the portraits and to get the diamond ones they need to acquire the golden ones(I’ve seen proof of the possibility though remote as pity timer for a legendary are non existent let along portraits)

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Ugh… Sometimes it’s a bit hard to grasp what you’re trying to say, but still…

What do you mean? From the support article (haven’t I linked this already?):

Whenever you obtain a Mercenary Portrait from a pack or product that includes a random Portrait*, the Portrait you receive will be based on the following baseline percentages:

  • For Legendary Mercenaries: 30% chance to get each of the 3 Golden Portraits and 10% chance to get the Diamond Portrait
  • For Rare and Epic Mercenaries: 33.3% chance to get each of the 3 Golden Portraits

So yes, diamond portraits are more rare.

all of them, but yes, especially legendaries. At least we can buy them with 500 coins, but it takes forever and it sets that character back by a lot (500 coins is basically the cost of an entire skill maxed).

I don’t think it is sustainable for me to play at the rate I played last week for a long time. I had a break, and was playing over 10h a day… If I had to play at normal 1-2h a day, it would take me months to finish a single low rarity merc.

Yes. Essentially, without needing “trade offers.” That would make it more useful. The current system is mathematically idiotic; for people who have thousands of coins, they’d never get to use them.

It’s better than just doing nothing with that renown.

Your suggestion is condescending. I need to know exactly what I’m jumping into before I do so, especially if it could be a long grind or a large financial decision. Part of the reason I was able to finish two mercs quickly is because I heavily researched the mode before I did anything in it. Regardless, I appreciate your perspective.

I have no rush, nor interest in having a full collection. I picked the characters I liked the most, and have been working on those, and plan to work on others a little bit at a time.

Exactly! If it’s going to have a bad conversion rate, it should at least let you use the coins whenever. Renown coins should act as “dust” that you can use for whatever you want.

Imagine if in vanilla HS, you needed to get a card offer before you could use dust to craft it? That would be ridiculous.

My thoughts exactly. I was tempted to buy a Jaina pack, but when I googled the small chance to get the diamond portrait (considering I have no Jaina portraits) I thought it was a dumb choice so I didn’t buy it. I would have gladly bought it if I at least knew what portrait I was getting.

Not really all — Rares are guaranteed from nearly every pack until you’ve got them all, as I’ve written, but that’s more or less pedantism.

I don’t see why one necessarily should, either. Especially putting aside PvP, I think there’s no reason to not take your time, play it for fun at a comfortable rate — the PvE content is not running away anywhere, apart from occasional time-limited events.

There’s reason to suspect it might be better spent in the future.

By no means. The point was the renown system is a beginning of what should be the endgame for PvE — not the primary way for newer players to jump-start their mercs, at least the way I see the game design.

Besides, some of us have been there — raring to finally max that merc (for PvP in particular, where it matters), only to find a couple thousand excess coins for them a bit later. It might seem urgent, but there’s actually no rush.

You might have seen my point already: the game is excellent from a F2P perspective, although there’s a bit of grindiness with tasks and the like — especially if you’re in no rush, as you say. As for financial investments — ironically, there aren’t many good options for that at the moment, if any.

If anything, managing with limited resources when playing ‘on a budget’ actually adds more challenge and thus more fun. There are some heroic bounties that are hard to do that way, but many of these problems can be solved, for instance, with only rare mercs!

So, if you’re looking for something to play casually for fun at your leisure and you like the gameplay — this’ll probably work for you. I’d advise against investing in packs at all, let alone coins, but if you want some portrait bundle or whatnot — you decide.

Oh, one more thing: some people actually dislike diamond portraits for their propensity to emote and don’t use them even when given for free (from the events, for instance) — just something to be aware of.


Which ones, let me ask?

For more difficult bounties, you’d generally want a party that works well together. If you wish, I could make suggestions how your favourites can be used best and for what kinds of bounties.

Jaina, for instance, fits excellently in a Frost party, which is very strong, too — so you might want to work on her ‘friends’ (well, teammates) if you wanna play with her.

The ‘ideal’ end-game party could look something like this:

Jaina's Frost Party
### Frost
# Jaina Proudmoore
# 	 - Ice Block Talisman 4
# Khadgar
# 	 - Bitter Chill 4
# Balinda Stonehearth
# 	 - Lesser Water Elemental 4
# Varden Dawngrasp
# 	 - Band of Frost 4
# Lokholar the Ice Lord
# 	 - Frigid Winds 4
# Cookie, the Cook
# 	 - Appetizers 4
# To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone

Some of these can be hard to get (Balinda and her equipment in particular), but not strictly necessary: Jaina, Varden Dawngrasp (you can use the Potion of Ice instead, especially if you don’t have Balinda’s Lesser Water Elemental) and Lokholar can carry you a long way.

I completed the entire campaign with a 6 naga team, and did all their tasks. I already maxed the F2P nagas, and can farm Sunken Temple to get finish the other 3. However, I’m currently trying out other teams, like a frost team, etc. I did farm a lot to get the 500 coins for Belinda… but now that I finally have her, I’m burnt and started playing murlocs instead.

I’m just getting the tasks done slowly for fun. My main goal was to play nagas anyway, as you can play a naga in WoW or HotS, so, HS is my only outlet for that fantasy.

Hmm… Nagas may not be the most powerful team in PvE, but could be playable, although I have not much personal experience with that. Maybe some insights by others could help you:
Karathress is not a great mercenary, in my opinion, Zar’jira is a bit situational, others are quite strong and capable of at least some tasks.

Oh, these can be fun.

yep, the male nagas are weak, and Zar’jira is straight up garbage. But the other 3 make up for it. They might not be the “strongest” but I’ve been able to do everything with them (including Heroic for equipment), so, it works.

And, BTW, the renown trade system is messing me up as a new player. I can’t trade for anything because I only have a few coins, but I get 2 trade offers daily blocking potential tasks to get actual coins. So, yes, it really pertains to new players.

It was better when I hadn’t maxed anything… I could pool more tasks.

Not Slitherspear, though! He can pack a punch or deal with enemy’s summoned minions.

Yep, it’s not only new players — I’ve got a couple of non-maxed mercs, but I prefer Visitor tasks, since they can be fun or challenge me. On the other hand, new players have got plenty of ordinary tasks to do, but only so much time, so maybe the loss of potential visitor tasks is less of an issue.

What do you mean?

I think you get trade offers regardless of how much renown you have, but I might be mistaken.

Anyway, that’s not something I would worry much about at this point — the impact of a few random coins here and there is not that great to be worth worrying about.

To the previous point about the Frost party, there’s something I should add.

Getting Balinda is not all… The hard part is unlocking her equipment, which is very important, and it requires beating a heroic boss (Drek’Thar) that can be… demanding when it comes to the collection, and it also requires a specific strategy (although there are more alternatives now with Khadgar out). At this stage, he might be too much for you to handle, but in that case I’d recommend focusing on cheaper mercs like Varden and Lokholar first — the latter is very powerful, and his important equipment is obtained from level 30. You could do so much in e.g. heroic BRM just with these three…

PS My strategy for beating Drek’Thar (Heroic) with Fire. You can see if your collection is up to the task… I haven’t tested the new Frost approaches with Khadgar, though, but they’re probably not very cheap either.

You don’t get any trade offers when you have 0 renown. Or, at least I didn’t.

And that issue is exactly why I suggested this:

But you sort of just replied “the system is fine I’m just waiting to use the coins later when they add endgame” --paraphrasing.

I’ve been able to beat all heroic bosses with nagas so far. Not really scared of doing it with one ‘off-synergy’ character. Some take a couple tries, but for the most part, it’s not that hard. I could easily replace one of the weaker nagas to put Belinda on the team just to unlock her equipment and it would probably still be doable.

I don’t have Ragnaros, so, I can’t play fire. I do have Khagdar, but not built. So, I rather just keep banking on Azshara; she’s pretty reliable.

I don’t find this game mode “hard” in the slightest. It has some difficult moments, a little RNG on the powers you get, but overall, it’s not really difficult even in heroic. As long as you choose you path well through the trash to get the most synergistic treasures, it is almost always doable. That’s actually part of what I like about the mode, the RNG happens mostly OUTSIDE of combat, and you can just predict how the fights will happen if you math it out. It makes it feel kind of like chess, but with pretty portraits.

I know HS is primarily a PvP game, but I have often had a lot more fun on the PvE side and like to do the ‘hard’ stuff. I even have the golden Prince Arthas hero, which was way harder than this.

EDIT: I did beat Drek’thar in my first try. This game mode is entertaining, but it’s not super challenging. The fact that there’s less luck than in OG Hearstone makes it a lot more predictable (and better IMO). So, Sparky… maybe it’s hard… for you, not necessarily for everyone.

I was getting trade offers every day even without having renown. I kept dismissing them because they were for mercs I didn’t care about, but new ones came every day.

Sometimes you do. I’ve got them with zero renown before converting those plentiful excess coins.

It’s a bit random, probably.

That’s not the main point: from the game-design perspective, encouraging people to do different bounties is important.

What we’ve got now with the coin exchange system is more of a quick fix to me.

Heroic Drek’Thar is not just any boss, just so you know.

:grinning: Well, sure, you could try…

Ragnaros is not used for the method I proposed, if you’ve noticed.

Having built up my collection, I actually prefer strategies that work consistently even without some lucky treasures — or any at all. Sometimes I would pick ‘bad’ treasures on purpose — to simulate going without meaningful ones in order to test how consistent my strategy for beating the bounty is.

Indeed. Some Darkmoon bounties, however, are a bit dissapointing in that regard (Babbling Book, yeah) — although you can prevent some of these effects.

Yep, or a kind of a puzzle game.

There is PvP in Mercs, but I think the PvE aspect of it is bigger — and arguably more fun.