You dont if mage ever gets anywhere near helthy again the likes of Mahlerone Toblerone Triblerone will come out talking about how mage isnt in the top played class once again like he did in the last 3 years of hs every time mage got touched…and yet still didnt lose its popularity soooooo…
And this may sound like overblown nonesense to some but a lot of ppl know this already mage keeps being popular cuz of the constans printing of casino and mana cheating cards.
And no im not shting on mage this time i know it sounds like that but there wasnt a time when he who hates me saiyng his name all the time when its about mage but it kept beig a popular class no matter what nerf/ changes came to it and he came out too every time to tell everyone how mage isnt viable anymore…godamn every time.
There is no point realy im just saying if mage is healty than a lot less ppl will play it cuz it will be healthy its get beaten to hell and back by aggro decks cuz she and warlock pushed out every control from the game…
Mage is consistently played across most iterations. Healthy here is being used as a word for “engaging” for the opponent, because playing against Quest Mage and Quest Warlock is a drag.
When mage is healthy it gets played to oblivion (see Cyclone Mage). Mage isn’t being played right now because it’s op or anything. The sole times mages get in line is when they are bottom tier (which is very rare). Mage usually comprises 15% or so of most metas.
Yes. Not having top decks does not put mage in bottom tier. Mage frequently is middle pack, very rarely bottom three, and I can’t remember a specific time it was the actual worse.
It’s just not dominating for long, because it keeps getting nerfed. Aegaeon tables are “Weeks in X spots” tables.
Ah yes those dominating tier 4 decks with 40% win rate getting nerfed are the reason .
Mage and Priest dont get nerfed over win rates ,source the freaking lead dev Iksar just ask him he gladly shouts to the whole world where they stand with those classes.
Also when RSW just recently got nerfed Mage jumped from n5 to botton 2 only above Shaman that was a disaster at the time.
Its not my fault some have selective memory when it comes to Mage …
Those aren 't the only times dude. Remember highlander mage? Luna’s pocket galaxy was the kind of “I played this, i win because the game got to turn 7 and now i shall play kalegcos, antonidas and 3 other 8 cost cards back to back”.
The original highlander mage was degenerate, and a top contender. The original CC deck? Deal with a giant on 4 or gtfo. Mage has had plenty of good decks. Plenty of unhealthy ones too, and i say that as a guy who played Khadgar and CC well into 2 years after the CC nerfs.
Of course, the last years have seen a particularly… trigger happy pattern against mage, but really. If the devs just stopped giving mage “i win” silver bullets and letting actual balanced, interactive archetypes incomplete, the game would be plenty different. I mean, frost, fire, and HP mage? Three for three in archetypes? really?
Now about bottom tier classes: Those are usually Shaman and Priest.
[Aegaeon] was kind enouth to actualy do the proper research on this things, this is where Mage stands .
Raw data that doesnt lie with 0 bias against or for any class.
Dude, you’re just extrapolating wrong.
The literal first comment in the thread is mine, and I used those tables and surmised the usual classes not in the top spots.
But not being in the top spots does not mean you’re bottom tier. Tier 3 decks are playable!
Mages also have at least a tier 2 dedck on half the reports.
I don’t believe that they can. That is; they can’t without making mage very similar to other classes.
When they created DH, they sucked up design space that Mage (and others)
used to enjoy.
Now in order to maintain classes seemingly having a different feel, they are forced to make Mage into the
magic 8Ball class.
First: Talk about yourself, lmao, everyone.
Second: Please read what i said, instead of going through arcane thought exercises to extract something.
Also: I play exclusively mage. As far as i know, i’m in the exact same situation as Mallenroh, in that i dusted most other classes to play Mage, except that i’ve even less cards because i’m a standard only player. Why would i want mage to have tier three decks tops, god in heaven.
I just played a lot of Mage through good times, and see little of that right now. That’s behind most of my complaints about mage, usually.
Yeah… I’m glad to have Wild Mage to fall back on.
I can’t imagine Standard only. Standard is always
two weeks of feast, and three months of famine for Mage.
That quote is worth a more detailed answer than i could give when I was discussing so here it is.
The answer is surprisingly no. No card needs to be better on mulligan than incanters flow for that to happen.
Why?
Mulligan for a specific card is always risky and thanks the fact the deck now runs a quest it’s mulligan is riskier than ever.
If every card literally got around 0,5% Winrate it would be enough to deflate the Winrate of IF enough to not be worth the risk of hard mulligan for it in many matchups.
Make people not hard mulligan is already enough to reduce the number of non games drastically because people not gonna chase IF for something as low as 55% Winrate(for “highroll” this is a low Winrate) if the deck without getting IF get already able to win 50% of the time.
Making it happen far less by consequence.
Basically decrease the distance between highroll and lowroll to make the mulligan an actual decision.
I think that as soon as incanter’s flow deflates to around 55% Winrate people gonna day by day stop hard mulligan for it because get a bad starting hand gonna be too high of a risk for such a small increase when it goes your way.
Incanters flow Winrate is really sensitive for the deck getting better or worse so 2 small buffs on cards that are actually meaningful to the early game is for sure enough to both deflate incanters flow Winrate and incentive people to not mulligan for it in faster matchups.
This right here is exactly the point. SA was hated because it enabled so many filthy things, but it also limited design because every spell printed had to be looked at at full cost, minus 1 mana, or even minus 2 mana. Very clearly, it was rotated out of standard with the new core…
… and immediately replaced with an even more broken mana cheat that made the effect permanent. For the whole deck. Twice.
Every card still made has to be looked at through “how good is this if it cost two less every time it is played?” (which, incidentally, is exactly why the cards in the OP are 2 damage instead of three, lol.)
Why does IF impact wins so much? Because the cards are built to be discounted. It’s like already baked in to the cards.
If they stop this lunacy, they can actually make spells and stuff work at full cost instead of having to figure out what’s good in most situations being discounted but not OP when discounted twice but also not dead card without a discount.
tl;dr - remove IF from the game forever and don’t make anymore cards like it or SA again…ever.
I think that’s on purpose. Once IF rotates they’ll probably print another one.
…no? Those two cards deal 2 because they have stronger long term effects than simply freezing an enemy for the turn. They give up on tempo (3 damage) for more value later.
If mage wants a card that does more immediate tempo, well they’re gonna have to give up on that value - and ability to hit face - by running brain freeze and first flame.
I think one problem mage is facing is that they need specific spells for specific jobs. It makes mulligan/discover/draw more important and more punishing if you made the wrong choice.
On the flip side, if mage survives that early game and is allowed to draw through their deck, they can do a lot more past the early game. This could be one reason people still play mage. Everybody still has hope that they can make it to the mid-late game and start dropping bombs, which are fun in their own way.
The one you not get because runic orb can’t even kill a card of the same cost making you use atleast 2 making the generated card not give any hand size advantage?
Or maybe the ultra specific scaling on ignite that you can even ignore on most matches because devs were too afraid to even extend to all copies of ignite?
Sorry but those aren’t better than freeze a enemy. They’re more complex for sure but far worse when you understand.
Like i already said runic orb can’t even leverage it’s own effect and ignite would literally be better with 0 scaling and doing 3 damage every use(source: math).
Their effects aren’t strong in the long run and anyone that isn’t some random memer should understand why at that point.
Actually here is some breakdown on ignite:
If you use ignites generated in the same line 3 times(very dificult to happen in a normal match but only a little above the average):
6 mana
2 + 3 + 4 = 9 damage
An actual fireball
4 mana
6 damage
You telling me that to access a literal fireball damage ratio i should draw the “same card 3 times”?
Really?
Primes do their own circus show only needing to be redraw one time.
The second time you draw that type of card should already be a version above the “budget” of it’s cost.