I see so many threads. Do this from d2. Do that from d2. There is an annoying vocal minority constantly spouting this nonsense.
While Diablo 3 isn’t perfect, it’s a massive improvement over most aspects of Diablo 2 (which is hilariously overrated becaue muh nostalgia!1!!). There are so many improvements over d2.
No requirement to haul around scrolls
You don’t have to identify every freaking item you find.
Town portal on demand
No resource potions (improves balance so much)
Respec at will
Actual competition with other players.
Skills system is fantastic (SO MUCH BETTER than the disaster known as d2)
Yet they will deny all these and insist their game is perfect and try to turn d4 into some beautified clunky outdated piece of garbage like PoE.
The ARPG elitists could seriously destroy d4 if it’s not made clear that players like all the quality of life features from d3, and think it’s a massive step forward for the most part. While some concerns about sets and endgame progression are valid, THESE should be the focal points of what we want improved in d4. Not ignoring all the steps forward Diablo 3 took and reverting back to d2 just to please the boomers who played it when it was new
What D2 players really want is PKing back. They really want to run around a diablo game and kill other players. I think most people who think D2 is better have not played D2 in a very long time and forget how clunky that game is compared to D3.
I generally dont like the “D4 needs to be exactly like D2” either. But
Terrible, terrible mistake in D3 tbh.
That is certainly arguable. I think both systems are really flawed.
D3s system just isn’t deep enough compared to other A-RPGs (and neither was D2s system).
No, it needs to be more like Diablo 2 and less like Diablo 3.
It’s not nostalgia. I have played D2 off and on since 2003 and I play RIGHT NOW along with 30k other people at any given time on my server. Probably more active players than this one since I can’t even find a multi game on D3.
D2 is not more clunky or worse than I remember. If 60 fps + smoothness, more speed and less skill cooldowns is your idea of clunky then maybe so. It is still the best arpg out right now.
Actually, what most D2 players want is D3’s fluid combat system, D2’s itemization system, and something in between D3 vanilla’s and PoE’s current crafting system in terms of complexity. Only an infinitessimally tiny sliver of players truly care about PKing.
I mean, I want pvp to be in there but I don’t pvp often in D2. Since I only play hc, I don’t pvp (too likely that my opponent would be cheating via maphack, chicken, twinked, etc). PVP does make my games more interesting when players come in and hostile the party to try to track one down or bait a player into a fight.
When I played SC I used to fool around and have fun with pvp. People would hang by the fire near the stash in Act1 and shoot the breeze or watch people pvp, it’s fun.
This was what most Diablo 2 players would refer to as “dueling”; where players would gather in act 1 blood moore and pvped with each other only after all parties involved had given their consent to do so; usually with each player saying, “go” or “g”. That’s the type of pvp that I would like to see brought back.
Pking, and/or player hunting were the types of pvp that made use of the hostile feature to harass either low level players and/or pvers and, that’s the pvp that I don’t want to see returned.
That said; the implementation of pvp zones seems interesting. I only hope that:
Each region would have one pvp zone, so a total of five zones.
Each pvp zone is of a decent size, approximately the size of Diablo 2 act 1 Blood Moore area
Each pvp zone is located in an area that pve players would never need to go to or through.
As in pvp zones aren’t located near key pve areas (such as dungeon’s entrances, efficient pve farming spots, etc.) nor would key pve areas be located inside a pvp zone.
Each pvp zone shouldn’t overlap with routes that lead to key pve areas unless there are additional routes that players can take to avoid the pvp zone.
In short, the only players who should be in the pvp zone should be those who want to pvp or who don’t mind being attacked by other players. Players, who want to avoid pvp at all cost, should never need to venture through or to a pvp zone for whatever reason.
Being on the low level harassed side of pvp, I kind of enjoy it sometimes. You can always leave the game or harass the harasser. In D2, they put a cool down on how long you have to wait to use a wp which stalls the hostiler and gives everyone a chance to go back to town.
The issue though is that even if you were fine with it; most folks weren’t and that’s honestly what gave Diablo 2 pvp a bad reputation. It’s why most people automatically assume that people who liked pvp in Diablo 2, must have liked to pk non-pvp players as well; even though that’s false.
Those PKers were fun tbh.
If they messed up your game you would revenge on them bringing a higher lvl character.
Or you could just screw that game and leave, or just create a private game.
You seem to be on a journey to recycle every topic that ever existed on the forum but I might aswell chime in with a quick FYI.
80% of what you mentioned have actually nothing to do with the difference between D3 and D2 (designwise) and neither camp would have a problem with implementing those things for D4. Either you’re just trying really hard to fish for easy likes or in general just feel depraved of attention but could you atleast try to put some efforts into the dozens of topics you create every week?
For example, when comparing the pros and cons of charms in D2, using inventory space as an arguement is trash because that can easily by solved by a seperate charm bag. Similarily using tps and identified items as arguements just straight up blows.
In general it’s the itemization, loothunt and overall mechanics that need to be looked at, where frankly D2 still reigns supreme. QoL features can always be baked in later as has been the case with D3 over the years.
There were some good aspects of D2 that were left out of D3. One was being able to carry two weapons sets and be able to switch sets at will. That’s being brought back in D4 at least in part with the arsenal system for barbs.
Multiple weapon sets should be available for all classes in D4 even if only two sets for classes other than barbs.
Oh… using that limited stash space in town for one thing and one thing only… ears. Yeah, that does bring back memories. So does creating mule characters, just to carry… more ears. Lovely times
You must not have played D3V, where we had to identify every single rare and every single legendary one at a time and it took 5 seconds to identify each one. D2 you talked to Cain, and he identified all your items instantly. It was only after months and months of the player base continually complaining that they added the book of Cain, so D3 was definitely not an improvement over D2 in this aspect.
D2 had this so no improvement, and the D2 method allowed players to cast it anywhere (even in a boss encounter), and they could go to town instantly (no 5 second stand there and hope you don’t get hit), and it wasn’t interruptible.
Again, you missed D3V, where we had to have to carry potions around, which did have the improvement of being stackable, but had the 30 second cool down added. Once again, adding them to there current spot wasn’t done until months and months of player complaints.
This is arguable as an improvement, as some players like to change their minds every 30 minutes, while others like their fireball sorc to be a fireball sorc and their blizzard sorc to be a blizzard sorc. Respec at a small cost (you know, like D2 has) is probably the best compromise between the two.
What improvement? Botters competing against botters for best GR clear? D2 did have the bot infested ladder, so this part is a push, but D2 had PVP and while it was not perfect, it is still better than the near zero PVP D3 has. Again, D3 is behind D2 in competition.
Um, no. Being locked into 6 skills is so console, and almost every build is the same. Pick a generator, spender, and split the last 4 between damage buffs, damage mitigation, crowd control, and/or movement. In D3, you are pretty much only allowed to pick the spenders that the design team has blessed with massive damage buffs through gear. Try playing high GR’s with a group with an off-meta build. You will not get an invite. Even if you want to go back to D3V, most of those skills that were available were not Inferno viable. Couple this with 2 minute cool-downs where your character got to be godly for 20 seconds, then return to town for 1:40 seconds and you realize the D3V skill system was actually terrible.
D2, you could pick whatever skills you wanted with a limit of total skill points, AND you could use them whenever you wanted (as long as you had resource). Yes, some people hated skill trees, but that is a matter of choice and not an overall improvement.
Um, no. The only people who want that back are the losers who sucked at PVP. Those are horrible, miserable people, who only get joy in life by trying to make people as miserable as they are. This is a very, very tiny fraction of people who played D2 and I seriously doubt any sane developer would listen to them.
Is D2 perfect? Hell no. Are there things it did better than D3 (Itemization, dark and forboding story line, just to list a few)? Definitely.
Is D3 perfect? Hell no. Are there things it did better than D2 (QOL improvements like stash size, auto-loot gold, smooth combat, just to name a few)? Definitely.
What true Diablo series fans want is for them to take elements that worked from D2 AND D3 while mixing in new elements that work to make D4 the best game possible. Rather than constantly squabbling about which game is the best, the diablo series fan base needs to be focused on making D4 the best game possible.
