D2R Change Poll results ordered by popularity

Rhazas actually put the survey up on d2jsp quite a while ago:
https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=84739953

And the results are just data. People shouldn’t fear data. The more data you have, the more informed your decision.

So far, the D2R devs haven’t committed to any changes I disagree with - unless they actually state they are doing a change that I disagree with I’m behind them.

Also with D3 - as I posted in another thread, the fact that D2R exists and that D4’s theme is A Return to Darkness clearly means, that as far as look and feel, the direction of the franchise is to embrace D2’s darker/grittier approach rather than D3’s glib cartoonier approach. This is significant and D2 players should be happy about that.

This. I trust the D2R devs to make the right choices that won’t hurt the games core. Especially after watching the blizzcon deep dive and seeing how passionate they all were about keeping D2 exactly the same even down to the many bugs. I don’t see the dev team that left in dozens of bugs and said “we were very hesitant to add auto-gold. so we added a toggle.” will suddenly start churning out massive loot and inventory changes because of some inconclusive survey data.

You know what the D2R devs will see? They will see the massive backlash already going on in these forums from the hardcore fans being very against changes and they won’t do anything to upset the core fanbase, considering they literally said thats exactly who this game is for. Not the new people, not the people who want change, just the hardcore fans. Everyone else is lucky they get to enjoy it as it is.

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But theyre entirely separate from each other - practically in different worlds. That could be fine for ploot and original looters, but that’s not what youve suggested…

About that… and some wonder why I repeat myself…

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Yet you continue to repeat this - and this is what I was responding to - and I keep repeating to you I agree with the totally separate idea. Not going to quote blitz, though. So that’s good, agreement. The thing I was responding to was the thing you continue to suggest that doesnt compare with HC/SC and ladder/non…

So do you no longer think game mode selection is a good way to choose ploot and original looting systems? Because that’s been a refrain of yours for a while. If so, agreement! I agree as long as the communities are separate. …Like HC/SC and ladder/non, as you mentioned earlier, which was the comparison I was questioning…

Edit: I just actually read your quotes, how are they rebutting me? You continue to say game mode creation. I originally contrasted your suggestion for game mode ploot with your mention of HC/SC - theyre not relatable, as HC/SC are totally separate and players choosing which games to play in are not. So… did you not understand what I was contrasting in my previous post? Wtf bbq?

or at character creation. I say either way could be chosen about how to implement by Blizzard.

I have from early on listed both possibilities. I can make a compelling argument that selection at game creation works, unless the personal loot people do not want characters that previously saw 8X the total drops in FFA-only games in comparison to a similar character in personal loot mode who less frequently sees drops.

Yeah M, the contrast I was making originally was responding to your game mode suggestion, aka the thing that doesnt compare with HC. Another basic communication misunderstanding laboriously resolved! high five

No, they “literally” did not say this, the devs said “literally” the exact opposite. Do better.

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The devs literally said D2R is for casual nonfans? New people and the people who want change?Double wtf bbq?!

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The devs said they are looking to appeal to both new and returning players alike.

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wow… 23/23 for how i would vote… i mean i had first thought this was going to be some BS post but wow…

color me impressed, i mean some of the “yes” one i was “neutral” but see no downside on… but… damn.

good work…

while i agree on literally everything posted with how they are posted

what i want MOST are

14 "ladder only " restrictions removed and single player and NL
1 ( cows always open
10. loot filter
15 charm inventory
21 longer seasons

and easily MOST important out of literally anything… something and the that would literally make me refund

is that 23 remains no… i will not TOUCH this game if they add “personal” loot

no changes, not even ALL of the ones i want combined + the new graphics" would make me not demand a refund if they made “personal loot” happen.

i can not currently think of something that would kill the game more completely and utterly than “personal loot”.

i would rather them delete my fav class… druid… than have “personal loot” forced upon me…

(although thats also a moot point because i wouldn’t by the game then either)

but the point still stands

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You do know 49% preferred personal loot options and only 39% favored keeping it FFA only.

You would refund if they add an option for personal loot, or force it upon you? in your post you say force upon, am I to understand that it would be okay for it to be optional for others to choose this game mode, given it would have zero effect on you or your characters?

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A delicate task, especially considering the particular balance of elements in D2 vital to its unique fun.

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I actually think it’s not a delicate task at all. Many of us in this forum have been asking for a best of both worlds compromise, where the release of D2R is super crisp, clean, with minimal changes, and a forked patch later, where many more options could open up. Those options are varied, and can’t keep everyone happy, but a survey like those posted would certainly give an idea of direction for the devs. I think there’s a good chance D2R will have over 95% approval, from both casual and experienced players, provided they make this one simple choice.

3 Likes

If players are able to remain in a community of either original or modified rules, then agreed!

no its not “ok”. i don’t need to explain something for the millionth time.
changing how loot drops will affect EVERYTHING
it will affect the the types of games that are made, it will affect the price and rarity of certain items, it will affect how player communicate, it would utterly destroy any and all need for any player to “contribute” to the party…
it would UTTERLY DESTROY the game.

this isnt “path of exile” paths game was build around being able to turn it on and off…

the entire core aspect of item balance completely in the game and the game is fundamentally played as a party. that is based around less total loot dropping in multiplayer and getting more exp instead.

all the games all the services the rushing, the trading… Everything revolves around how loot drops.

if u change that u break the game and what makes diablo 2 that game that it is on a fundamental level.

even the deleting sorceress outright would be less of a fundamental change to the game … because in some multiplayer games u may not have a sorc on your team… in some games u may not be playing sorc.

by changing how loot drops will on a fundamentally change how diablo 2 is played on a core level… and there is no amount of band-aid fixing or tweaking you could possibly do to fix that.

I’m not saying person loot cant exist in any game or that it cant work in some game… but the game has to be designed FROM THE GROUND UP WITH personal loot in mind.

this isn’t something you can “add”… even giving player the option to turn it off and on would fundamentally ruin the game. because it would still change how public games are made ., along with the and rarity of value of all items. etc

you think that “adding personal loot” would be a small change… when there isn’t a bigger change you could possibly make that would utterly change the game on every aspect as much as this.

you don’t understand the consequences of it and even my VERY FIRST first post in response to the idea, before i actually thought about it… i thought " well it wouldn’t be too bad"

when u loot into it however, and consider the effects it would actually have on chaos runs, on baal, how exp framing works, why certain game types are set up, why certain items cost a certain amount, basically how it would affect everything around it, it would completely and utterly break every single aspect of how the game is designed and balanced. especially of how games runs are set up, public chaos, and how loot is farms

it may “sound” like a small change.
but its not… and u couldn’t find a bigger one. and even i missed that at first.

its not the “personal loot shouldn’t be a thing in any game ever” it that personal loot in diablo 2 would LITERALLY be a completely different game.I cant think of a single aspect in the game that wouldn’t be affected in some way that would then somehow need some perfectly though out fix in attempt to undo some of the damage that adding personal loot would call…

its not compatible in any way shape or form… its a core balance aspect that everything in the past 20 years was built upon…

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This is super hyperbolic, and much of it is untrue.

I’ll pick apart the last sentences first, as they seem to sum up your point.

Stating “you couldn’t find” a bigger change than optional personal loot, is very hyperbolic, of course I can. Here are some.

-Getting rid of Ebugging
-Changing how Qbugging works
-Changing/balancing any skills
-Changing any drop rate in the game

These are just to start. Personal loot is not as big a change as any of these. It is also not without its problems, which is why I’m against it being changed for launch.

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see this is what u don’t understand, you are looking at it the same way i did when i first considered it.

you need to look at what game system rely on currently system of loot drops to function.

cause and effect.

you are looking at what u want the intended effect to be, not the unintended side effects it would cause… you are getting tunnel vision.
adding personal loot isn’t bad because " personal loot it bad"… its BAD because the side effect it causes that you DONT intend and you are cnot currently considering because u arn’t familiar enough with how the current system works

to those of us who know the ins and out of the systems work together. sure u may have made one thing a little better in 1 area that affects some people…

you basically are trying to keep yourself warm by running the car in a closed garage… yeah it WILL keep you warm… but YOU aren’t considering the carbon monoxide because you are feel like freezing to death and u cant think straight.

you cant just consider that it fixes the problem you are trying to fix… you need to make it it doesn’t break other stuff

AND BOY DOES THIS BREAK OTHER STUFF

sure having each player get their own loot wouldn’t be an issue when making a brand new game because you could balance around it… but the ENTIRE game is balanced around NOT having personal loot… the community as a whole sets up runs based on having shared loot the trade system and the values of runes and items is based on shared loot… the entire party aspect… if doing the work of killing a monster yourself… and not being able to get loot unless you are in there doing work… that’s a MASSIVE part of the d2 experience.

if u add “personal loot” not only would you need to completely rework the loot drops balance from the ground up, you wold cause an absolute mess of certain items that might be extremely valuable to a certain build but are rare drops, dropping for a person who has absolutely clue of why that item is important… and who would never consider picking it up… even if the person next to them needed that specific item.

ones mans trash is another mans treasure.
yopu may think some random white is a peice of trash and some person in your party is looking for a specific rune-word base for a niche build. and guess what… that person now knows that chances are he wont find that item for sale anywhere. because most people wont pick it up. that player can effectively GET 6x drops when in apblic player games because he KNOWS that that item has a 95% chance that if it dropped it won’t be picked up by another person.

one of my builds is EXTREMELY good at clearing chaos i love to play it there
and as it happens to be it can do it just as easily and almost as quickly in an 8 player game… now i make public chaos runs becuase people want to go to choas to level as u can lvl from 1-80 in hell chaos very similar to how u could in uber lvling

not most people charge for this… i just say " if an item in on the ground for more than 5 second it means i don’t want it" and yeahj by the time i am doing these runs changes ar i will not be picking up a damn thing other than full rejuvs in 9/10 of these games

and if i see somsone who needs a specific item and i dont also need that specxific item… im a nice person and i let them have it… or if its worth a LOT and i dont need it… i may trade it to them at a reduced price

THIS is just ONE example the community aspect of “shared loot”

but your “simple change” to give person loot.

what does that change

lets look at this scenario again
i was helping people out, they could get hell quality items and very likely tons of items they need for thier build and get levels… for free with the sole expection that if i need 1 specific item… they arnt going to get that one
for me… i get a 6x higher chance of finding that one items i need, i get to help other people, i get to give build tips and advise and i get to make new freinds.
i may even toss some people some gear i had sitting on a mule because they need it for their build

now you take this away
but with “personal loot” id ont make a “public choas game” because the extremely rare item i want.,. chances are… everyone wants.

i make a private game… because in a public game i’ll only get 80% of the drops i would in a public game… becuase drops rate for an 8 player game drops around 600% loot, NOT 800%.

no one runs chaos

people need chaos runs

what am i supposed to do? ask people to "plz give me x items if it drops for them? no one is going to do that

amd i supposed to join every game and ask " if anyone sees any of these items… can u pick them up for me… and them list 5+ items

that is just ONE aspect of ONE thing it could change.

there is a reason i said u people need to think about the consequences of changing something

personal loot would completely destroy how diablo 2 is played.

thats not even discussing the fact that every game would be filled so low level chars following around higher lvl players taking items

and yeah maybe that donest sound like much… but early on you may barely be able to kill something… if u have a party of 4 people in your group doing hell choas and then suddenly 4 other random people lvl 20 join… your enemies just go that much harder… you you get a bunch of people not contributing., now you better hope your party can still clear… but even if it can… it just got that much slower.

if you add “personal loot” high level games will be completely infested with low lvl players trying to leech exp and items from an area they cant do a damn thing in.

right now if they try to do that… those play gave no chance at getting ANY loot… because if they get close enough to grab it… they get killed

only the player who contribute and deal damage are close enough to pick up the loot.

thats the incentive telling people, you get nothing from this area “you are too weak” keep trying and you going to keep losing more exp and u still wont get anything

thats a 2nd thing… and sure i can go on and on and name a 3rd 4th 5th 6th… thing that it would completely break… but this reply is long enough as it is.

the point is its some something u can just “add” to a finished game that has been out for 20 years when entire game is balanced around it not being a thing.

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I don’t think it’s very good discourse to start a comment with “this is what you don’t understand”

Of course I understand small things like this will change for you, but my 8p chaos runner clears diablo in baalruns, then gets to throne before Baal, this is what most we’ll geared CS runners do, not hang with lvl 20s.

This way you get all the loot from chaos, and get to hit Baal for EXTRA loot, should be a win-win for you, no?

Also, forcing players into a game mode that benefits cheaters just so you can get 8p drops, when those players want to be given an option for games without cheats, seems super selfish.

I really disagree that a personal loot option would ruin the game. This game is way too good to be ruined by that.

I’m okay that we disagree on this, but it’s not something I don’t understand.

Let me ask you just 1 more question, if that’s okay-

Are you okay if they implement personal loot in a separate realm, so those players that want it can have it? If you can have your classic gameplay, no one on your realm would ever have a ploot option, but anyone who wanted to could make a character with ploot, or would that bother you?