While I concur that there are probably a few people who dupe in D2R I’m just going to correct you on a few things. Duped bases do have unique ID, when they’re made into a runeword that ID is rerolled. Duped runes also have a unique ID, but when socketed they lose that ID and are perm. This is based off how it worked in LOD, I’m not sure if any changed were made in D2R.
Now for your example someone was using perf 15ed mage plates at one point and was selling enigmas all the time. You could if you were a good trader be very active, but I doubt it. Regardless if an armor rolls an ED modifier in D2R it automatically gets a max roll on defense then applies the modifier. Every 12% ed AP has the same defense, Every 13% ed AP has the same defense, and they’re all 1% higher than the 12%. Now as for someone using a perfect base while duping that just makes sense. People want the best, so thats what the duper was using as the base.
And tbh I do think it happened. Early last ladder I checked a traders post history. A lot of the same bases were getting recycled very often and made into the very TOP tier of items over and over again.
Buy hey, let’s trust Activision to install an AH onto their remade game that they coudln’t even fix duping on.
Kep in mind Microsoft will own all of the Activision/Blizzard games as early as June 30, 2023 and they will ask for changes to be made as they do not allow 3rd party trading sites to make money off the games that they own for the most part
While I hope that Microsoft will change Blizzard back to how it used to be, so they can start producing good games once agian. I don’t think the change will be that quick it will take years to get rid of Activisions influence.
Microsoft doesn’t make or control any game similar to D2. I don’t think they’ve dealt with a situation like this. Nor do I think they have any more ability to do so. JSP breaks no laws, so Microsoft can’t stop them. They could modify the game to make JSP unable to be used, but that would take a lot of work for a game that they’re not going to be making an more money off of.
Edit: I’m not sure why you think Blizzard can’t do what Microsoft can. I get that Microsoft is bigger, but they both are worth a ton of money.
i know about ids
but about base duping in d2r? thats something new to me
i have to be honest, this can be a sign of hoarding/marketing manipulation, dupping or botting and if we take jsp history into consideration, i would guess is the third one
+1
p8 and early ladder is a paradox
your mistake is to compare a p8 cow run agains a p1 meph run with no mf
you will never get a trustful number this way
i compared both in p1, i didnt even put any mf for meph
you compared meph p1 vs cow p8
o think the max cows is about 400 and the average is 350 but no one serious doing cows kill all of them
p1 meph has 1/961 for shako with 150mf, 1 min runs
60x961=16,1h for a shako
p1 cow has 1/360000 for ohm, 3-4 min runs (3:30[210sec] average)
killing an average of 350 cows per run
360000/350=1028 runs
1028*210= about 60h for an ohm
proclaming has no use here
you forgot to mention bots
“it wont work bc you dont know how to” is indeed a really deep analysis
I’m not saying that people are for sure base duping in D2R. But early ladder not super early there was a guy who was continuously selling 15ed MP enigmas. 15ed MP is not the hardest base to find for sure, but he was selling a TON of them and this was very early on. I’ve sold or resold maybe 6 15ed MP armors (not enigmas) since ladder started. This guy probably sold 50 enigmas. He could have been working with a botter/RM website or a duper, I have no clue. I only leaned towards duper because it was the same item, not necessarily impossible, but at that time 15ED mage plates were harder to find than jah/ber.
P8 early ladder is easy. You can easily join pub games and farm cows. Baal runs are super slow so you can actually finish cows before they finish a baal run. Regardless even with your inflated number it is only 800 cow runs to find ohm. Sure they take longer, but you’ll actually find an ohm in about the same amount of time it takes to find a shako from meph.
You compared both in P1 because cows don’t make much sense in P1. You can do it, but you’d be eating all that no drop chance which meph doesn’t have except for the bonus drop on mephisto.
I saw about 6 posts saying cows is 450-500. You can keep skewing it however you want sure maybe a shako is a bit sooner but they’re similar enough. P1 cows is certainly doable, but there is zero reason for a java to stick to P1. I farmed P8 pit/AT/Chaos in games all early ladder no problem, so P8 cows is just as doable. I actually did P8 mephisto too for a while, but that is besides the point.
proclaiming facts is what I did there. I do know more about trading than you. Hands down no doubt. It doesn’t change anything about our conversation, because even with my vast wealth of knowledge I couldn’t tell you if an AH works in D2. But you certainly don’t know if one would work.
What do you mean bots? Bots have nothing to do with if an AH would work in game? Not that Activision or Blizzard ever could stop botters or make an AH that works well. My analysis doesn’t need to be that deep to be honest does it? They completely failed with the D3 auction house. Those are devs that supposedly know what they’re doing. But somehow you think they’re going to be smart enough to get it to work in this game? A game without a common currency? And it isn’t even just about getting it to work properly where people don’t abuse glitches in their AH system. You think that the runes and trades will flow well? What you’ll have is a dead AH, people only using it when it is absolutely necessary because runes are scarce, and the smart users will horde them, driving down the price of everything because people will be selling tyreals mights for ists runes to try and cube up to jah/ber because none are ever on the market. Nobody will list their tal armor for fear of getting a ZOD they can’t do anything with, because nobody is listing things because of that exact fear, when someone could post an actually usefull rune like ohm, zod is a free win.
and each run takes 3x more time to farm than a meph run
This lists rune drops for The Secret Cow Level, 1 player, Hell Difficulty, Normal cows. (350 per game)
Not counting unique packs or champions. (They make the chances slightly better)
so about 400 per game counting boss packs
so my math with 350 average cows killed/run stands correct as no one serious kill all the cows
if you wanna be taken serious, its cows p8 vs meph p5
p8 cows
1/157000 for ohm
157000/350=448
448x210s=94080s=26h
for shako
different calculators returned different probabilities
maxroll is the only one showing 1/950 p5 mephs with 150% mf for a shako
the german drop calculator, atma and silospen returned 1 in 767, 766 and 778 respectively
so we can ignore maxroll bc its clearly something is off with their math
p5 meph
772/1 for shako p5 with 150% mf
772x60s=46320s=13h
conclusion
even at the best scenario for cows, an ohm still 2x more rarer than a shako
d3 dev team is not the same as d2r dev team
i mentioned that the code is there to be used which means thats half work is already done
what you think about yourself or others is everything but a fact
you can keep trying to push this but this only works with those who bought a shako from you for their ohm
i doubt that
people are so eager for an oficial trading platform that they gonna use whatever is given to them
anyway
this is getting repetitive
everything else i already adressed in previous posts
Items sell for what they are worth. If a seller overprices the item, people won’t buy it. Another seller will come along with a lower price, or the original seller will have to lower the price until someone decides it is worth it.
How are you manipulating P5 on ladder at a steady rate where 4 people will follow you to the next game every 60 seconds. Not even sure if a 60second run would be average, but you’re definitely not getting P5 games. If you bump it up to P8 which you can get into, you’re not completing your run in anywhere near 1 minute early ladder.
As for cows you’re drastically under selling how easy groups of cows are killed together. You don’t miss 50, you’re not calculating for the increased drop chance from cow king and other champ cows. You’re inflating the time per run as well.
You’re right they’re not the same team. D3 had a real team and failed, but you expect the D2R team to do better who can’t even recreate a game properly.
I’m not pushing a narrative and the ohm vs shako topic was just two random points of interest, I don’t think I’ve ever done that trade. Regardless I do know more about trading than you because I’ve done more trades than you many times over.
Nobody is eager for an official trading platform you’re eager for one because you don’t like JSP. There aren’t threads daily about when is an AH coming to D2 with 1000’s of people talking about it here because they’re fine with traderie/discord/jsp.
But alas this is the end. They will never make an AH. An AH would never work in the first place, but they won’t even create one so what is there even to discuss. Just like they’ll never stop JSP because they have no legal ability to do so. Thankfully JSP finished creating what D2 should have in the first place. I’m really glad that Blizzard fully supports JSP and it’s users.
He won’t drop that one no matter how much logic you throw at him. I cannot why he thinks this, but I think it is perhaps because he is broke in game and has awful characters and doesn’t know how to MF well.
the drops for bosses doesnt change after p5
if all you can get is p8, p8 it is
the same way 3:30min cow run is humanly impossible at ladder start, at p8 but i used this time anyway to make it easy for you
if you dont, the time your run takes longer is not worth those cows
as i said, if youre serious, you aim for density not full clears
i think d2r is a much better version of d2 than lod ever dreamed of being
speak for yourself
this is the only logical conclusion after countless threads asking for this
this is not true in the case of jsp
available wealth is a big factor on value
a “crap” apartment is expensive if it is in manhattan
the same apartment wont be as expensive if it was in another place
that said, like the apartment, jsp prices are driven by an acumulated inflation of many years and they feel right for jsp only
You’re right the drops don’t change after P5 on the bosses.
But you’re also not doing P8 meph nearly that quickly.
You can do even quicker cow runs early ladder with a java which is probably the only char that should attempt P8 or cows early ladder. Infinity and even the basic white javas you start with clear cows. The only struggle would be cow king with basic white 5dmg javas.
If you’re running P8 cows you keep up with the baal run, you don’t worry about full clears sure, but early ladder you typically don’t have to worry about that you have enough time to kill almost every cow because baal runs keep pace. Obviously you take advantage of the bonus no drop and try to full clear as much as possible.
D2R graphically is much better. They have made some adjustments that are nice, but all of them could have been done in the original game. But D2R hasn’t done anything creative that couldn’t have been done in LOD. And D2R’s game list is a joke, chat channels is a joke, communication also a joke when compared to a 20 year old game.
Nobody is eager. There isn’t countless threads there are 4 people circle jerking about getting rid of JSP because they’re made they aren’t as good as them. Not only that but they just try to find ways to get rid of JSP’s immense value to LOD and D2R because of that salt. There aren’t many AH desired threads, there aren’t many blizzard should make their own fg threads, there are a few JSP is illegal threads mainly started by those same few people. But we know those people are wrong because Acti can’t do anything about JSP since they operate within the rules of law.
A ber rune in game is worth the same as a ber rune on JSP. JSP just makes it easier to trade that ber rune. Past wealth doesn’t increase the value of the ber rune, the ber rune has increased value early ladder because nobody has them.
no you cant
you can maybe keep the 3:30s/run on p1 early ladder
but with 4,5x more hp, 50% lighting resist, no razortail and much more loot on the ground to browser, you just cant early ladder, maybe with a twinked javs
i couldnt care less about MP itself
as brevik said, MP in diablo was a Blizzard Entertainment’s thing, they sent their devs to make it work, it was never a priority for the original team
rarity is only a factor when compared to anything outside the ladder, aka jsp, rmt or cross mode trading
inside it doesnt matter
a ber may buys a poor rolled griffs early on, the same at the end of ladder
the only variant is jsp wealth and how much people in there are willing to pay for any of these
saying that acumulated credit and inflation has no impact on economy is pure nonsense
You’re right cows take longer in P8 vs P1, but not as crazy as you think.
You can go offline and hero edit a character. Javas P8 is actually still crazy good with no gear. Sure it is easy 1shot material if you’re geared, but java doesn’t suffer that much in p8.
If you don’t care about MP for some weird reason because it wasn’t a priority of the original team, then why do you care about any of it? Lol. Like why bother worrying about the perfectly legal actions of JSP and FG?
the same way a low gear sorce wont take that much time to dispatch a p5-8 meph
i dont care about MP it self, i care about the balance betwen mp and sp
i think its cool when devs try to make any kind of player, solo or multi, not feel like missing something by not playing x or y mode
bc imo they arent legal?
the reasons i already explained, no need to repeat ourselves here
Have you farmed P8 mephisto with bad gear? It takes forever. Also even if you finish quickly, you’d be looking for a new P8 game which will cost you time OR you’d have to wait till the baal run was over for the next game. Either way you’re not doing 1 minute P8 meph runs period.
The modes are simply different, but I’m cool with both modes having their own perks. SP gets P8 command, static maps, faster loads. MP gets trading, team work, PvP.
You’re right there is no reason to repeat the concluded perfectly legal actions of JSP.
I agree even in P1 I think finding meph and securing the kill with weak gear in 1:30 is probably your best/fastest time with a lucky spawn for lvl3. I don’t think 1:30 is average. P8 killing meph alone with bad gear can take longer than that.
You cannot “do the math” on keeping pace on P8 baal runs or finding a brand new P8 game to farm meph in which if you don’t hit durance lvl 3 by the time people have left the game you’re not getting a P8 spawn of meph.
Now with really good gear I could definintly see killing meph in 1 minute with a good durance lvl 3 spawn.
I concur, an improved trading system would help. I suggest checking out how Path of Diablo has a website connected to the character inventory to allow for trade offers while out of game.
just do a sample of 100 runs including lobby time for cows and meph
add a margin of error of 3% and youre done
ofc it needs to be at early ladder bc there will be plenty of baal runs early on
all you need is p5, 4 more players
even “walk act 4 or 5” with 4 players are enough
That’s why it’s best that the Devs consider making their own in game fg. Call whatever you wish, an auction house, an official trading platform etc. An improved game trading system that allows for an exchangeable medium to trade is needed.