So your guild sucked and you did a bad job recruiting. Why are you pretending every guild was like yours lmao. Attitude reflects leadership, friend.
Itâs still absolutely baffling to me that people are arguing over this raid loot vs M+ loot thing.
Almost every single raider is wearing about 50%+ Mythic+ pieces, whether it be valor or from the weekly box. There are people who pretty much exclusively do M+ and are maybe 3/10M which are the puggable bosses that have identical iLvl to me, and Iâm 9/10M about to kill Sylvanas tonight.
If you only do a few odd keys here and there and donât do anything else that offers max iLvl loot, of course you will be a lower item level than someone that raids and does weekly M+, but thatâs because youâre putting in significantly less time and effort into gearing than that person.
The 10 man guild I lead in Wrath was awesome. We had one server first and got all the achieves. Then Blizz hamstrung 10 man raid guilds like mine. My guild in Legion was pretty good but definitely some whiners there. Had to take a break from that to study for my professional boards. Not sure the game has been worth the trouble after Legion.
But if you are somehow suggesting this game is not filled with a bunch of manchildren with ego issues then you are not a very good judge of character in my opinion.
The OVERWHELMING amount of âmanchildren with ego issuesâ I see are on these forums. Very rarely do I have any negative encounters in game but especially not in raid. When I do, itâs usually in something like LFR or some queueable content. It is 100% within the guilds control to determine who is and isnât allowed in the guild, and if you allow people who are bad personality fits (like the people you are talking about) to enter that guild, itâs your own fault.
Iâve been raiding for 10+ years and can count the bad encounters Iâve had with individuals on one hand. Simply put, guilds like that just donât survive. They die.
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The irony.
This is not even remotely believable. You canât do this in any sphere of life, let alone in a game like WoW, which is well known for its toxic game community.
Do you really expect anyone to believe you?
You already have a 252 Weapon. There is absolutely no shot getting the 252 weapon from the raid would be a noticeable upgrade.
I also ran a little sim for you
If you were to have all 3 of the DPS domination sockets, youâd only gain +42 DPS, which is about 0.5% of an upgrade. However, you could also farm out your sockets sockets and put regular crit gems in for a gain of +126, or 1.6%. Remember the domination bonus is only active in raid, so donât worry about what it does if you arenât gonna raid.
So donât feel too bad about not having them 
Iâm talking about in the raiding guilds Iâve joined, and it really doesnât matter to me if you do? If youâre careful about what guilds you join, it is pretty easy to avoid toxicity. If you just join the first guild that will take you, then what do you expect?
I have an overwhelmingly positive experience with raiding in organized raiding guilds. In 10 years Iâve raided in about 5 different guilds, and none of them had anything close to the vitriol this forum specifically spews about raiders.
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Because you still have your head in raider land. Take a second, stop, breath, and look at this from the view of literally any other player.
Imagine someone wants to play just M+ for instance. Okay? Got that? So they play M+, and they do the content, they get their 252 Vault pieces and their 246 Valor pieces and theyâre moderately happy. But then as they start climbing up in keys, 19, 20, 21, whatever, they start seeing people running these Domination Socket pieces. This is a form of power they donât have access to currently. Now they have some options here - they can start grinding out heroic PUG raids for gems and embers and 239 socket pieces, which is totally doable, they can applying to guilds and force themselves through Mythic raids for 252 dom socket pieces as well as the mentioned gems and sockets and embers to upgrade those gems (and maybe they do end up having fun, but maybe not)⌠or they can just accept theyâre perpetually behind which may alienate them from the game.
Itâs just another annoying chore added to the game for everyone else. Itâs not âthe literal end of the worldâ, but itâs another chore to do. Itâs exactly what I predicted before this patch came out - it would simply be another chore you have to do. Do your heroic raid every week for those embers, even if you donât care to raid.
All this contributes to the patch being alt-unfriendly as well. So youâve got these chores, and you may not even have the time to keep on top of this ember grind on all your alts⌠so maybe you just stop playing your alts altogether. And that sucks. If this system didnât exist, you could happily play alts much in the way you did in 9.0, but now you canât without accepting a perpetual handicap that you can never overcome from strictly playing M+ for the next 6 months.
All this will probably be water off the ducks back though. You donât actually care to understand. You want everyone to think the way you do and see it from your point of view, even if theyâd sooner quit than do that.
Just saying things that are obviously stupid and then trying to walk them back with âwhat I really meant wasâŚâ is not a winning formula.
But I am glad you never experienced guild drama. You must be the only one.
Youâre conflating so many things. Youâre going on these tangents about alts as if raiders donât also want to play alts. Raiders want alts more than key pushers do lmao. Thatâs completely irrelevant to what Iâve said and is just more word vomit coming from you.
Imagine someone wants to play just M+ for instance. Okay? Got that? So they play M+, and they do the content, they get their 252 Vault pieces and their 246 Valor pieces and theyâre moderately happy. But then as they start climbing up in keys, 19, 20, 21, whatever, they start seeing people running these Domination Socket pieces.
Domination gems are not going to prevent anybody from doing keys at that level. You are obsessing over it because you feel entitled to have what everyone else has even though you donât want to do the content to get it. It has nothing to do about the efficacy of the gems. Iâll show you the gem I just shared with that other guy;
thatâs the difference between farming out normal sockets and him getting the 3 DPS gems. regular sockets are a bigger upgrade than the domination gems without the set bonus that only activates in raid
You are arguing a non-issue. Gear acquisition for M+ players is pretty much on par with raiders up until the raid has been fully farmed out for months.
You literally cannot cry about being behind when youâre a single item level lower than me at 3/10M while Iâm 9/10M. To put it another way, you have 4 mythic boss kills of the first 3. I have 28 mythic boss kills of the first 9. And we are 1 iLvl apart.
Your argument has blown up in your own face multiple times already. You arenât using proper statistics to back your argument. You arenât looking at the reality of the iLvl curve between M+ players and raiders, and you arenât considering that raiders generally will have a higher item level because they do both forms of content
Youâre wrong in so many ways but you canât help see yourself type so you wonât shut up.
And whatâs crazy is is that you donât even see how much M+ raiders have to do to get the iLvl we have.
I donât have a 252 weapon without doing M+
I donât have two good trinkets without grinding Plaguefall and THOP in M+ and the valor to upgrade them.
Half of my offpieces wouldnât be 252 if I didnât do M+ every week
hell, the only pieces I have left to upgrade are from the raid that I canât select from the M+ vault options since theyâre dom sockets because raid loot isnât anywhere near as common as you think
Iâm 9/10M, well ahead of the curve of the overall raiding scene.
The concept of having to do multiple game modes is not new. Itâs also not something you âsufferâ from, because you are clearly nearly maxed out while one game mode. You are not suffering. Quit being a spoiled baby.
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Raiding normal content as a gm doesnât mean anything. And Iâm being gracious assuming you can even do normal.
Unfortunately for you I have been.
The same thing can be said about the mage tower.
End of the day it wasnât super hard content.
Maybe for you because itâs assumed youâre bad but it really wasnât.
Imagine simming the benefit of cor on a 4-minute patchwerk. Lol. Also, youâre intentionally taking out his highest ilvl high-stat pieces and replacing then with 239s.
You can play a 239 gloves and 239 bracer and still get the full benefit of Cor and Dyz with minmal stat-loss. You can run 246 chest armor and 246 shoulders from KT/Sylvanas instead of 239 to minimize the stat-loss while still getting those slots.
A 1-minute hectic add-cleave with 246 chest and shoulders and 239 gloves and bracers would do a much better job simulating the benefits, and I donât even really have to sim it to know Iâm right, itâs just common sense that bans out in practice and is validated by RIO profiles of top players.
Are you dumb?
Iâm replacing them with Heroic pieces because
thatâs what you brought up. Iâm not going to run a sim with him decked out in Mythic gear at this point in the patch cycle because that isnât realistic for somebody that doesnât want to raid. Heâs not going to go from 0 boss kills total to 10/10 on Heroic overnight. He can, however, start farming sockets whenever.
And if they arenât upgrades over the items he got from doing M+, then doesnât that answer the bloody question lmao.
I did the first 3 slots that had domination gems in them. Feel free to move the slots around however you want. The results will barely change, and certainly will not reflect some massively noticable, 10% damage difference.
The fact of the matter is is that regardless of what combination you run, it is nowhere near the dropoff you are crying about it being. There are no statistics to back that up. There is nothing but you moaning on the general forums.
Good job skipping 90% of the post though. Same thing you do every time you lose an argument lmao
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You seem to do a lot of work to avoid admitting you said something stupid.
Thatâs because I havenât said anything stupid.
Youâre the one deflecting and making terrible arguments to the point youâre embarrassing yourself.
Imagine hiding on a classic alt and thinking youâre actually good at the game 
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Because youâre just whining about nonsense. Nobody cares if it is beneficial to play two modes of content at the start of the patch. Itâs always going to be better in the short-term to play both raids and M+. Thatâs obvious. It has to be that way. If it isnât, thereâs a problem.
But what youâre not understanding here is the difference between long-term vs short-term. Nobody actually cares about a short-term disadvantage. PvPers need to raid to get the highest ilvl in the short-term but as long as their PvP gear is BIS at the end of the season theyâre happy. Nobody actually cares if a Mythic Raider goes and gets a Changeling or whatever, so long as the raid has good trinkets and weapons in the long run.
PvPers got their wish because Blizzard has nerfed the ever-living %%%% out of dom sockets in PvP. The one gem that was even somewhat good just got nerfed again. Raiders have their wish because BIS raid gear comes almost entirely from the raid. M+ is the one game pillar left in the dog-house.
Itâs simply a fact.
You know what, Iâll bite.
Lets pretend that somebody just has access to 252 Domintion sockets without any Mythic experience, so instead of replacing the 252 Mythic+ pieces they have, we just snap our fingers and those pieces magically have domination sockets on them
Its literally identical. He can grind out his Korthia sockets and have the same DPS gain as if he farmed out 252 Domination gear.
Youâre absolutely clueless. Most specs have atleast one bis trinket in mplus.
No ones full bis comes from the only avenue they play.
So youâre just making stuff up now, huh?
Raiders have their wish because BIS raid gear comes almost entirely from the raid.
the only gear this applies to is domination gear and the Mythic KT/Sylvanas gear (which very few guilds have access to) which is only BIS in the raid and nowhere else. Everything else, you have an equal or better upgrade from the weekly vault. Even valor trinkets are better in many, many cases.
I provided stats, sims, examples, datapoints, and armory references. Thatâs not whining. Those are called facts
What you are doing has no substance to it. Youâre just complaining that you donât get more gear despite being = iLvl to me. Not sure what else I can do for you.
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