ESO, SWTOR, The entire Fallout Franchise (before that hot mess that was 76), The entire Dragon Age Franchise, the entire Mass Effect franchise…
I’m not talking about raiding and mythics. I’m talking about BASIC GAME STORY elements. I would never expect to jump into a mythic or a raid with no preparation. Those are expected to be a different style of play. I’m talking about basic friggin dungeons.
You added the word “optimal” to argue a point I was not making. I’m talking about PUGs for non-mythic, normal, mundane dungeons and basic world event PVE. Expecting a person to leave the game to learn a dungeon, and thus experiencing story spoilers in the process that break the story and emersion, is bad design. Any cut-rate editor will tell you, if you expect the reader to go do research outside the novel to get information that should be presented IN the novel, you screwed up.
Would also like to add EQ had no addons telling you what to do and no voice chat.
Yes. This. The truly ‘elite’ players don’t waste time trashing people, nor do they have a reason to do so. They generally understand it takes all sorts to make the game world go round.
It’s kinda the same with the economic spread irl: Wealth whispers, money talks. It’s always the middling rich, or the middling talented who talk the most trash. The truly wealthy, and truly talented are too busy making money or practicing their skill.
The game is designed for the most casual player. They went out of their way to make difficulties easier for people who aren’t that good. Just because some people cant do things higher than a +10 doesn’t mean the game is for only good players, it means those casuals aren’t good enough to even do those simple of things.
Making hardcore content easy enough for casual players is never going to be as much fun as making actual casual content for casual players. Trying to make one thing that can satisfy everyone at the same time has always been a fools errand.
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I have been a casual player since LK and I find SL to be the most casual friendly expansion. I was able to do my covenant storyline quests and I do my “callings” which allow me to explore and pick up quests in each of the zones. With that being said, I do find the attitude of some guilds to be more elitist than in any other time in the game’s history.
My name is Chase and I’m the biggest flexxer in the game, don’t even @ me unless you’ve got a Swift Spoc, Gladiator, top 100 IO US and multiple CEs of a high ranking.
Not knocking you here, but if your skill level is all that high, you can play with a Steve Kerr in the lineup for a few minutes.
If you’re too young to know who Steve Kerr is, he’s the guy that sucked on the Chicago Bulls Jordan teams but could knock down a three at the end. If you go into a dungeon with everyone at your ilvl, maxed, then I don’t know how good you are. I just know you picked a Miami Heat type Lebron James overloaded team with five all-stars and no pickup guys.
I wouldn’t worry too much about it. Most people who have that mentality are kinda bad but try real hard.
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2011 Dallas mavs whipped dat booty!! The German Moses Dirk Nowitzki… not 1 not 2 not 3 not 4 not 5 not… ummm wat come after dat?
This is the reason I quit doing “end game” its all simulations and addons. I was in an elite raiding guild long before addons became required and that was fun. I don’t find world of addons fun, when they became required I dropped out of raiding. I was always anti addon I knew it would lead to the game being tuned toward their use and just remove a lot of what I found fun. So now I am one of those hated casuals. The only addons I use are the ones that track things I haven’t yet collected.
The only people I see as elitist are forum-posters in GD.
Elites don’t hate casuals. They don’t care about them. They don’t even interact with them. They have discord communities that are completely removed from the normal in game experience.
Even elites who try to engage with casuals are regularly surprised to learn what people do in the game other than raid and high end mythic plus etc.
They don’t hate you. They don’t even know who you are or what you do.
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The correct post would be “WoW is a fake elitist mess”. Because the actually elites are not the problem.
Its the guy running a +11 who thinks everyone should be doing 7k dps and has no idea what route to take and does not interupt then calls out the two fire mages with 24 sec cd’s and wonder why the group falls apart. Yes, I just ran into that guy.
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So just because someone tries not to be a failure, they are elitist? Lol.
What is wrong with people.
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Right, the add-ons and simulations and rotation tellers and just everything is overwhelming. I find myself spending more time on Raidbots, YouTube, CurseForge, and WOW Reddit than actually playing the game. My feeling is if it can’t be successfully done for 70%+ players without 20 add-ons, it’s not worth doing. DBM and maybe GTFO should be enough. In BFA, I found those two add-ons were enough to pay attention and really do the mythic+ and raids. I got up to +15 mythic dungeons. I completed the full N’Zoth raid on heroic. In Shadowlands, I stepped into the first raid and people are hiding behind pillars on the first boss. Annnd I was out. Not even bothering.
In this one, there’s no way, like it’s not going to happen. I’m 201 right now and have a piece of legendary gear, and I still can’t reliably do a +7. There’s massive amounts of trash mechanics that drag the dungeons out, and I still can’t tell one dungeon from another by name. I can’t tell you the difference between Plaguefall or Theater of Pain, they all look alike to me, just very flat and dead worlds.
And I can tear up Torghast, but what good does that do me when I don’t even need soul ash? I can only have one legendary and I’ve got the one I want.
I really, really want to like this game. I got the 79.99 game so I could get the little extras with it, but this is definitely not doable on an end game level, at least for me. And I don’t think Blizzard’s goal is to scare away all but professional youtubers and twitchers, but it seems like it.
It looks to me like they’ve already scared away a lot of people. I can’t reliably find tanks for almost any of my keys and then it looks thinner than the BFA dungeons at all but peak times of day. On BFA, I could find a group at 4 AM for almost any mythic+ and that was 2 years into the game. So something has gone really wrong here. I’d almost recommend they do some kind of difficulty setting to bring back players who definitely want “hard” but not “suicidal.”
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from reading your post - it sounds like you’re giving up too easily.
we all start somewhere - i was even where you were at one point. if you don’t have the drive for something - it’s not the game’s fault though…
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I get what you’re saying. And obviously I’m frustrated, but I haven’t given up completely.
I was super geared in BFA, and that might be where some of the running in place is coming from. It feels like I’m just nuked. So I know it’s not all their fault, and I’m ranting, but I don’t think I’ll give up. I think I’m going to have to just take it slower.
Another problem is I have no idea where I should be at right now. I’m 201 ilvl right now but the ilvls don’t seem to have a big impact on how powerful I feel in mythic+. From what I read I should be about +7 level right now on mythic+? Or even as high as a +9 I think.
The raids I’m just not going to be able to do them, but I do want to keep trying mythic+. I’m thinking about asking just four guild mates who are also struggling to go through my keys with me and just give it a go for practice.
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That’s basically all it comes down to. The game is significantly better when you play it with a core group of friends.
Playing exclusively through pugging is a miserable experience I wouldn’t wish on anyone.
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