I mean you’re talking to a guy in a guild named absolute. Surprise 
Except they add much, much more collectible stuff that takes little to no challenge.
Your beef is with single items out of a hundred?
My guild is built on welcoming new and returning players especially. We are raiding normal Nathria (or at least trying to). We need more people who like to chill and do stuff on occasion! I work very hard to keep my guild from any sort of elitism or toxicity. You want to be a Necrolord Mage? Go for it. Want to run with us at 150 ilvl? Come on down.
If we’re having fun then our goal is met. Sure maybe someday we’ll get more progression, but only if it evolves from our fun. There are good people out there and good guilds.
If those items are going to be removed from the game forever, hell yes.
Mount collectors do not like missing out on mounts they can never get again.
Hence, paid heroic carries.
See, I hate playing with like superturbo casuals, so I generally don’t because they don’t really deserve some annoying boi yelling at them to JUST GO.
But I love that they play the game, because it keeps the game funded and running.
As someone who is pretty hardcore i can tell you for me personally its casual players with big egos that are an issue. Especially when they undermine all the hardwork and research i put into various aspects of the game. Its a two way street if the casual players want respect then understand for us this is more than just a game.
The vast majority of the things brought on the forums speaks volumes to the two different worlds that exist within wow. That being said like a poster said above i for the most part play with like minded players and respect and give the casual players their space.
My guess is most of the elitism you speak of is players who think they are good but are not.
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Absolutely everything the OP said. This is why I will be going to another game tbh, you can actually do the content and not wade through a sea of run sellers or people who want you to have cleared mythic CN before trying a +8.
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Absolutely nothing you said is true. Wow from day had far more complicated raid mechanics than EQ. EQ just like to waste a lot of your time, it wasn’t complicated. You’re totally blowing smoke hoping I’m not old enough to have played EQ and wouldn’t call you on your BS.
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That’s inherently the case. If you’re being matched up against players of equal skill and your teammates are being matched up against those same opponents under the same criteria, your skill levels will naturally match. They don’t need to even make an effort for that to happen. You’re confusing matching opponents with matching teammates. There is no cooperative game that I know of where you’re matched up on the basis of skill. Even WoW won’t go there. That’s why they removed Mythic dungeons from the queue and why players had to create and utilize third party services to facilitate matchmaking on the basis of perceived skill.
Yes, yes, yes, but…antlers!
The game is designed for the elite. Everything else seems to be an afterthought.
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Of the several mmorpgs I’ve played, WoW has the hardest content, by far.
I was following you a bit untill you got here. As long as multiple difficulties of the same content exist raider.io will exist. It is an experience meter. It shows people, at a glance, how much experience in the content you have. People doing harder content don’t want to teach random people how to do the harder content, they want to successfully complete it. You can’t really blame anyone for that.
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The problem is that WoW has long been designed specifically for the elitists, and content for everyone else has slowly vanished over the years. It was a huge mistake to put hardcore elitists like Ion in charge of development. I used to play in one of the best guilds way back, and the people in that community are so far up their own a** they can’t even recognize the validity of anyone who doesn’t play the game the same way they do. Instead of recognizing that the vast majority of players don’t even want to play the game the way they do, they’re convinced that the only reason everyone isn’t clearing mythic raids every tier is because they aren’t good enough. So they focus all their effort on making easier versions of hardcore content to the exclusion of everything else, because obviously everyone else must want to be like us, they’re just not good enough.
It makes me sick, and it makes me feel ashamed for ever having been a part of that culture.
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I often wonder if slowing the game down a bunch would help.
Not like, making things easier - but removing the FOMO aspects, 4 raid difficulties, and going back to a progression curve that pretty much ensured that people of all skill levels had content to do, but it usually wasn’t the exact same content.
The game itself recently has shifted to a mindset of “do this hard content this patch or lose out on x” and it… doesn’t feel right for an RPG. MoBA/FPS seasons make sense, but a literal RPG?
It’s just a symptom of us moving away from the true design of an MMORPG.
Challenging content is good. It’s needed, the top players deserve such and it’s their work that gives us our guides and entertainment through still like progression races.
Like, I’m not gonna care if my friends aren’t that great at the game if playing with them means I’m not going to miss out on stuff like key stone master, elite sets, gladiator, AoTC, ect ect. But people do care about these things, and a lot of the true elitism comes from that mid-tier (minus glad) bracket where there is pressure to race the timers.
MMORPGs are supposed to be about the world. This game’s just become an instanced ladder simulator, and it didn’t always used to be this way even when the game was actually “elitist”. (no LFR)
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I disagree. As someone who actually raided until Planes of Power I would say heroic Lich King is where the game actually started getting harder in WoW.
I never found the 3 to 4 mechanics each boss had to be more complicated than say taking an entire zone over in Drunder to take on Rallos Zek. I also found Coirnav, Xegony, Fennin Ro and especially the Rathe Council way harder than anything until Arthas.
These were also 72 man raids to coordinate.
Everquest difficulty is way underrated imo. Its raiding was also way more fun as well because WoW feels like dance dance revolution to me. I do agree that it was time consuming. The Rathe Council would take hours, one ill timed mez break could wipe everything.
But lets not pretend that every boss was tank and spank like AOW. There were less twitch mechanics I will give you that, but anyone telling you that say Heroic Sindragosa was more complicate than the Rathe council is full of it.
Keep in mind that the original reason we have 4 difficulties of everything is because a lot of people didn’t like the BC/Vanilla model where you didn’t get to see the content.
For “fixing” elitism I’m not sure replacing “you haven’t done Nathria on Mythic” with “you haven’t done Nathria at all” is an upgrade.
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A huge part of that was because the main story lines were wrapped up in raids. Finish the story in dungeons, and make raids more like MC where they’re not the entire focus of the expansion, and people won’t care nearly as much about whether or not they finish them.
Depends.
I preferred the old system because even if you didn’t’ get to see the content right away, you were probably still in some sort of content progressing through a chain. Sure, you weren’t good enough to get into Sunwell, but you were likely in Black Temple or Karazhan or what not doing content. Once you beat it, you moved onto the next.
Progression curve.
The issue here comes when they fully remove instances or stuff from the instances. Naxx 60 being one of the most controversial, but they’ve also removed some dungeons and drops.
When I first started and was extremely casual, my progression content was expansion old raids. Still needed a group to do them, and we actually did wipe on them. You even mention that to people for Legion/BFA content and they … don’t. It’s expected to be able to solo them.
LFR/multiple difficulties is here to stay so the better solution is likely to just have Timewalking be active for all old raids during their weeks, and actually make them rewarding to do for casual players. I had fun in Timewalking Firelands - but I’d never do it again even if asked because there’s literally nothing out of it for me anymore. They let us solo them for so many years, it’s a waste of time to go in.
Slap some recoloured tier and mounts in there to farm, and people would likely be in there all night farming when it’s up, thus turning the content ever-green, and fixing the “same instance for 6 months” issue we’re at now for a large chunk of people.
This’d actually be beneficial for new players because they can properly finish up the stories of the expansion they quested through and see things mostly as intended.
And ironically, not only is it (now) mis-named “WORLD of Warcraft,” its main asset is the lavish design and attention to detail that some of its developers put into the open world, only for the game’s very design to all but ignore it after a day or two of levelling to lobby status.
The problem is that Ion and his team expect all players to “graduate” to raid content (his word) and put big FOMO candy in there to make sure collectors have no choice but to get in there one way or another (like the regular “get it or miss out forever” mounts), and because it’s restricted to Heroic or higher that means, for the vast majority, finding a carry either by paying for it or getting lucky with a community group or lottery.
And now even the “feature mechanic” of the entire expansion - the Great Vault - is reserved for those who opt in to the designated content they’re supposed to “graduate” to, whether that be organised raiding or organised PvP. They even tried to make the damn MISSION TABLE into a “challenge”, which as we know hasn’t worked out too well. And they’ve locked the game’s story behind a freaking 18-floor “challenge mode” of Choreghast. It just seems like the devs are completely out of touch with the playerbase at this point.
The whole design of the game needs to be looked at, from top to bottom. With world quests in Legion and BfA they were on the right track but, as always, were constrained by “not devaluing what raiders get” and “what raiders feel forced to do” and ultimately the entire feature was gutted on behalf of raiders.
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What are you even talking about?
Ive never watched any video on anything and I’m up to +10 keys doing pugs only as a dps.
This game holds everyone’s hand and gives them scaling content with multiple tiers of everything so new players can learn. Dont understand the instance? Go read the journal and doing normals/heroics until you do, same with LFR.
The issue is with people wanting to do mythic level content without bothering to learn anything, and then they rightfully get booted and laughed at for their selfishness and arrogence.