WOTLK doesn't need RDF

[Zipzo-atiesh]

@Dreamsphere-westfall

In another thread, just yesterday, you said yourself that you align yourself with almost every decision blizzard

???

I’m aligned with their removal of DF.

I am not aligned with a very notable handful of changes they made to Classic Era and TBCC.

This has never been in question.

@Dreamsphere-westfall

These are your exact words.

You misinterpret the text.

I’m saying that I clearly have a better handle on where Blizzard’s head is at with why they are making certain changes and thus can probably provide better context in forum responses as to their methodology.

It doesn’t mean that I agree with all those changes, because I most certainly haven’t. These are mutually exclusive concepts. Agreeing and understanding are not one and the same.

Ziryus, however, gave up his card and really almost anything he says should be taken with a grain of salt.

If there was a scorecard on the forums for “what you got right” and “what you got wrong” his slip would be an ocean of red X marks.

[Deunan-atiesh]

“I’m saying that I clearly have a better handle on where Blizzard’s head is at with why they are making certain changes and thus can probably provide better context in forum responses as to their methodology.”

This comes off as big ego flexing. it may not be your intent but its a really rough sell to claim no ego and then claim to have have the inside line to what blizz thinks.
Not meant as an attack, I don’t know you and only disagree with your opinions.

[Dumbcake-westfall]

My goodness. Our friend has awoken and is here to educate us why we’re all wrong point by point.

[Jukeellingto-tichondrius]

@Zipzo-atiesh

It’s not about the talking during dungeons…why do people keep insinuating this…

It’s about the organizational skills required to form a promising group, prior to entering the dungeon. That which is completely eliminated by RDF, and exactly what they cited in the broadcast as something they want to preserve.

Ah yes, the very engaging “open LFGBB, click name, type ‘inv’”. Such a core social experience.

[Onikaroshi-mankrik]

Hell my wife does hers through the IN GAME lfg tool.

List yourself, go quest, get an invite.

[Aurumai-grobbulus]

@Dreamsphere-westfall

@Aurumai-grobbulus

automated cross-realm group forming for dungeons

Battlegrounds and arena? Hello?

You only quoted seven words and you missed the most important one among them.

@Ziryus-pagle

The reason why blizzard has been going with the last patch of the expansion in terms of balance/features(neither of which are content) is because that’s the point where they’d addressed as many problems as they could.

WoW devs themselves have publicly stated that Classic is built based on the last stable patch for balance, not for features and content. It might not agree with your ideas, but that’s the actual purpose of final-patch builds.

@Ziryus-pagle

And while yes a lot of the balancing and features do get added up front in the expansion

Right. The expansion itself turns WoW into a different game than what came before it. So the major expansion features (the ones announced at BlizzCon) are implemented at pre-patch.

@Ziryus-pagle

there’s also a significant amount of changes and additions are made over the course of an expansion to address problems as they come up, or as time allows.

Right. Balance tuning, as well as other things like guild banks and Dungeon Finder.

@Ziryus-pagle

And in the case of LFD it addressed very real issues

A feature that addresses issues is still a feature, not “tuning”. Not balance. And don’t all features address some very real issue? Even stuff like achievements and transmog were made to address important things.

@Ziryus-pagle

And just like how LFD was added in 3.3 there were also significant class balance changes there are well. Why? Because they were addressing existing in game issues.

Class balance is literally being tuned at all stages of the game when it’s live. Just because work on class balance occurred at the same time that another team was creating Dungeon Finder, that doesn’t mean you can equate the two.

If 3.3.0 was the only time in Wrath’s history where they did balance tuning, I’d agree with you. But you’re reaching extremely far to equate things that are related because one happened to be implemented during the existence of another (which had been there since WoW’s beta and is still there today).

@Ziryus-pagle

Now don’t get me wrong I’m not super invested in LFD itself, rather that the issues it addresses get addressed. And so far blizzard hasn’t announced any plans to do so, as such LFD is the answer.

At the end of the day, why not just ask for those issues to be dealt with directly rather than asking for something that many of us see as a major damper on the experience? I think we both care about faction imbalance, population distribution, people sitting AFK in dungeon carries rather than forming groups, gatekeeping, etc.

Is it that you think it’s just unrealistic that they’ll address the issues?

@Dreamsphere-westfall

Most players are in fact pro RDF and the majority of us just assumed it was again, going to be base line in wrath.

I’d like to see some unbiased statistics on this.

@Dreamsphere-westfall

Their reasons are wrong and is a lie. They gaslighted the community because they knew there’d be egomaniacs who would white knight them, like Zipzo is.

Honestly, this perspective is just sad. You are so unwilling to come to terms with the fact that there’s a side that disagrees with you that you’re willing to conjure up this idea that you’re being lied to and that we the players were somehow all in on it. xD If your only way to cope with not getting what you want is to look at those who disagree with you as being cronies to some cartoonish “evil final boss” in the dev team, I can’t stop you, I’m not your therapist. Just don’t think that it’s likely anyone in Blizzard’s offices are going to take your fever dream conspiracy theory seriously.

[Aurumai-grobbulus]

Holy crap, some of my posts are long.

[Deunan-atiesh]

better then the people who come in just to say “cope” and “retail is that way”

[Ziryus-pagle]

@Aurumai-grobbulus

WoW devs themselves have publicly stated that Classic is built based on the last stable patch for balance, not for features and content. It might not agree with your ideas, but that’s the actual purpose of final-patch builds.

Except they typically have been using the last patch features as well, see CRBG’s. The reason is pretty simple, most of those features were added for a reason not just on a whim.

@Aurumai-grobbulus

Class balance is literally being tuned at all stages of the game when it’s live. Just because work on class balance occurred at the same time that another team was creating Dungeon Finder, that doesn’t mean you can equate the two.

If 3.3.0 was the only time in Wrath’s history where they did balance tuning, I’d agree with you. But you’re reaching extremely far to equate things that are related because one happened to be implemented during the existence of another (which had been there since WoW’s beta and is still there today).

So they also add and tweak systems over the course of an expansion as well. The whole point of going with the last patch has always been to have the culmination of all the lessons learned over the course of an expansion. Be that balance or other systems.

@Aurumai-grobbulus

At the end of the day, why not just ask for those issues to be dealt with directly rather than asking for something that many of us see as a major damper on the experience? I think we both care about faction imbalance, population distribution, people sitting AFK in dungeon carries rather than forming groups, gatekeeping, etc.

Is it that you think it’s just unrealistic that they’ll address the issues?

What did you not understand about what I said? I’m fine with blizzard going with another solution, barring that though LFD is fine as it does address very real issues.

[Dreamsphere-westfall]

@Aurumai-grobbulus

Holy crap, some of my posts are long.

Don’t forget pointless.

[Zipzo-atiesh]

Check the mirror.

Between the the two of you only one is attempting to be constructive, while the other just posts pointless, insulting tripe over and over.

[Dreamsphere-westfall]

Awfully ripe coming from someone who is keeping their entire pointless thread alive to feed their massive ego.

[Zipzo-atiesh]

Yeah, perish the thought that some seek insightful debate over the standard forum harpy shrieking that goes on here all day about who knows what.

[Corpseknife-mankrik]

Thats what you get Zipzo for indulging in wrongthink. If you dont immediately validate my thoughts and feelings I get angry and obviously that means youre wrong. Dead wrong.

To prove it, me and my consensus buddies will dogpile you with nonsense.

[Deunan-atiesh]

honestly I’m not so involved in wanting RDF that id actually throw a toddler fit or riot but this idea of both camps just meeting up and throwing hands is comical.

[Adgannid-aggramar]

People don’t understand that RDF wasn’t added until ICC was released which the end of the expansion. Either way for most of Wrath Classic people will still have to sit in chat looking for groups.

[Onikaroshi-mankrik]

@Adgannid-aggramar

People don’t understand that RDF wasn’t added until ICC

Most people I’ve seen understand that very well and would more than accept RDF during ICC, it would just be nice to get it sooner.

@Adgannid-aggramar

will still have to sit in chat looking for groups.

Who actually sits in chat?

[Pyfeus-azuresong]

Since Blizzard will eliminate LFD, please give us at least 2 years or more of WOTLK before the next Classic release. Why so long? Well, without the help of LFD, it’s going to take much longer for players with lots of alts and late starting players to maximize their content progression. This includes players who aren’t in guilds and prefer to play by themselves and depend on strangers to progress through the content.

[Dumbcake-westfall]

@Onikaroshi-mankrik

Who actually sits in chat?

Zippy. He bought a basement apartment here in TBC Gen chat.

[Onikaroshi-mankrik]

lol, that’s a pleasant thought.