If it replaces Steed from the Ret tree and Cavalier is still a talent option, that means we can get 2 charges of it. Compared to heroic leap this would be miles better having the ability to routinely use it twice despite it being 10 yards shorter.
Also still better then any “charge” type ability because this would allow for use on Z-axis maps where traditionally charges struggle.
From wheelchair to members of the toon squad
I’m not saying it’s not a cool idea, but you have to remember Heroic Leap doesn’t just work in singularity. It works as part of a mobility profile that involves gap closers and Intervene.
Many people may want it because it’s cool, but that doesn’t necessarily mean they thought about the applicability of it.
I’m the opposite, I think about how the ability interacts with the game, and frankly it as the version shown on the ptr it would just flat out be worse than horse for all PvE interactions.
Sure it arguably has some use in PvP, but in PvE it just takes the problems we already have with Divine Steed and magnifies them.
That’s an issue if something like this is the “solution” to our problems.
2 charges changes nothing. If we have to use both charges to do a mechanic now we have to wait 1.5 mins before we have both charges again, that is eternity in PvE where mechanics require you to have a mobility tool more than once every 40s.
And as per Warrior, it makes little difference to them as they can Leap then Charge, or Leap then Intervene, or Intervene then Leap, or Intervene then charge. Each on their own unique cooldown (unlike charges which build up one at a time)
So either we use 1 charge and we are in the same situation as Divine Steed (but without the flexibility of duration) or we use both (to accommodate for requiring mobility over a longer duration) and are worse off.
It being instant only helps with something like uptime, but even then it’s super situational as it relies us to not requiring a mobility tool for any other mechanic in the fight.
It’s ok for PvP, and it definitely has it’s niche there, but for PvE is just a solid downgrade in most situations. Especially as I believe there is mention on the ptr that Divine Steed is now base 4s upto 5s.
PvE will always be considered first. This is why I can’t see it going live…
Would need this + steed, I don’t see that happening as they tried to temper our expectations before the PTR went live. Could be 100% wrong, maybe it will be a choice node?
I’m highly skeptical.
I saw that too, but the name Wings of Liberty got me to thinking it might be some type of leap, or just another way put down Consecration.
Absolutely yes, I would prefer it be the teleport like leap of Falling Sword type animation. Here’s hoping it makes it in.
I also had this suspicion upon see the Cooldown beging 45 seconds. But if it were to be a choice node between it and Cavalier, then it would be still worth it.
Possibly, though then the obvious criticisms (such as a preference for free targeting instead of to-ally only) there would be equally worth crediting.
Either way, this looks promising, so long as it doesn’t cost us too much by way of Steed buffs. Would maybe have rather seen this as usable only once per Wings, with this replacing the Wings button once it’s on cooldown, leaving a bit more for oGCD Steed.
I’ve been asking for this type of gap closer since Wrath(the original, not classic). But its not out of the realm of possibility that such threads as the OPs have an influence. I’ve had things I’ve suggestion implemented before. Usually years later or slightly different but relatively the same. Ive also seen the same for idea from the forums too(Unbound Freedom speed increase to Hand of Freedom and Divine Steed being examples). Though it being mere coincidence is also possible and probably more probable. Though I like to think that I had a direct influence in the creation of the BFA talent Divine Judgement. As I got to directly message the Ret designer(I don’t know how exactly that happen) the basic idea of that ability during BFAs beta. Those my concept worked off damage done, and not on how many targets hit. Though it ended up being a dead talent. But that was largely due to it being on the same choice row as Wake of Ashes, so course no one was going to take it. In hindsight that was probably for the best.
I’ve also suggested this same concept but for Inquisition back during late MoP too, similar to what Execution Sentence became later on in SL. Or come to think of it?, like Legions Jugdement and mastery. Oof that’s not good, to think I may have influenced that abomination of Ret. A careful what you wish for, you might just get it.
How stupid, more buttons, so much for fixing button bloat, we don’t need a leap, DUMB.
You best be joking.
Oh, without a doubt those were good criticisms about Avenging Leap. My goal was just to think up the most implementable way we could ever hope to see a gap closer on Paladin. Maybe even boost up Retribution’s consecration focus and Holy’s mastery playstyles. It definitely made sense to choose a leap as the animation because we have seen it referenced more than once.
I would have much preferred the ability to have a free casting effect or also not the potential cast time we discussed earlier on in the thread. I just didn’t believe we could see it this way.
I am pumped this is the way the tooltip at least describes it now. My expectations were blown!
Maik’dʒordan?
Need that particular means of mobility? Perhaps not.
It seems about as handy a form as it can come in, though.
Why would I be joking, 2 datamined movement talents, this leap and then a version of Long Arm of the Law, no way we get those and Steed, so what goes? Don’t know yet but the history shows it won’t be good.
Definitely don’t want another on use movement button when we are supposed to be reducing the number of buttons we have.
we managed to have a logn convo about leap and ret mobility. after deep extensive communication it would probably fix all if not most of rets mobility issues if we keep steed.
most likely in a perfect world, leap will share a node with laotl. which is something we can all get behind ttbh
i mean people who bought the “reducing button bloat” crud were on heavy cope. consecration got a longer cd and sanctify nerfed which implies consecration will get buffed. es replaced seraphim. there is no button bloat reduction happening. but thats okay
Long arm isn’t a button though and for all we know wings might be a choice between it and steed.
that would be the worst possible situation btw
Yeah I don’t think steed and wings should share a node
Wings should be baseline imo.
Yeah Warrior has Charge+Intervene+Leap for example so it’s not out there for Pally to have Horsey+Leap
I would argue that you are in the disinct minority on this subject.
Assuming equal total bonus distance thus traversed per second of cooldown… Repeated knockbacks, traversing AoE scatter, kill corners (if the damage can’t be leapt over), and any of various fights with pathing bugs for ground-targeted instant movement…
But I really doubt this would end up on a choice-node with Steed, so that matter is largely irrelevant. It’s more a matter of just how much power we want to move between the two.
Personally, I’d slightly prefer a less frequently available Wings of Liberty and an oGCD Steed, for instance.
But, Paladin Leap would at least be a damn sight better than PoJ (still too little to chase anything down) or LAotL (rotationally fettered, GCD-based). Hopefully either of those are all it’d ever be a choice node with, not Steed.
Horse and Leap would actually be pretty busted though (unless they also removed Cavalier), so it’s unlikely especially considering the identical cds.
People seem to misunderstand the issue with Steed when it comes to mobility tools. It’s not that the ability is bad, it’s actually probably the best mobility tool in the game if you simply view it in a vacuum.
The game isn’t experienced through a vacuum though so there are other factors which interfere with that outcome.
But I will put it in this way, no other mobility tool can get a class as far in a single use as Divine Steed can.
It’s approximately worth 3+ uses of Fel Rush, and the only thing that I believe could come close or beat it is Heroic Leap talented with both the leap and the 3s of movespeed increase.
That doesn’t make them wrong though.
I’d prefer Steed gone completely, but in the case that it doesn’t I would prefer more frequent WoL with a significantly reduced distance. (2 charge 20s cd, 20yrd range)
It would be much more flexible.
Post-MoP PoJ would actually be pretty nice.