I bet if Bliz changed survival back to pre Legion all of you would still raid/m+ as BM anyways. Complaining to complain.
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Itâs not just a matter of what Ion said. Itâs a matter of common sense. Survival was already a popular spec, barring tuning issues specific to one patch. There wasnât any magic quality to melee Hunters that were going to make them popular with existing Hunters, nor appealing to melee-preferring players already playing other melee⌠ESPECIALLY with Demon Hunter, an infinitely-more engaging, interesting, anticipated, and unique melee class starting at a high level in the same expansion.
There was no outcome where Survival was going to be anything other than an extremely niche spec. Therefore ANY statement that it was done for mass appeal is laughably out-of-line. All that represents is you projecting your own hyper-specific interests onto anything else which is not surprising because you come across as an extremely self-centred person.
Sorry for talking about an issue I care about. Iâll try harder in the future to earn the favour of random no-names on the forums with less than 5 posts.
Based on what?
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blah blah blahâŚits melee now. Deal with it.
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This is my way of dealing with it and I will continue.
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Itâs simple, if some melee memers got our spec changed because of a few stupid requests then weâre free to request it to be changed back.
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Why yes. It is completely reasonable to complain about one of your favorite specs in the game being completely deleted. It is unreasonable to mock people for trying to bring back said deleted spec.
If Bliz changed MM and BM back to pre-Legion, and gave us back ranged SV as a fourth spec, then who knows? But hereâs the thing: I donât care. I want ranged SV back because it shouldnât have been deleted, and I want to have the choice to play it, rather than that choice being taken away for literally zero reason. This is not an unreasonable request.
Why are you harassing people just for giving their opinion? They are allowed to state their opinions you know.
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I didnât play survival at all pre-legion. I played it in Legion long enough to get the artifact, didnât like it. Have no intention of ever playing it. Iâve been MM since Vanilla and thatâs not going to change whether they bring RSV back or not.
Also please stop pretending like lots of people in every class donât play their fotm spec just because itâs current fotm. Thatâs not something exclusive to hunters.
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I like survival =) was my main through a good bit of Legion due to the uniqueness of the spec. Topped meters, was good stuff. Super fun in pvp. Considering it to be my main into SL. I understand why so many people are upset, Blizz took a spec they liked and changed it but unfortunately it is what it is. Iâm assuming Blizz saw a spec identity with MM and BM, but wasnât sold on Survival when it was ranged.
News to me that Blizzard is the primary sales target of Blizzard.
Lots and lots of players have been sold on ranged Survival for years. That what should matter. There is absolutely, under no circumstances, ever any reason to just completely delete a spec. Ranged SV needs to be returned as a fourth spec. Everybody wins then.
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I think itâs safe to say that at this point nobody is going to change their mind.
Although the people who enjoy MSV are clearly wrong and need to reevaluate their lives.
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Let them enjoy it. Itâs not that big a deal. Though if they do enjoy it, I would love those that donât want to let RSV come back as a 4th spec actually explain why RSV canât come back at a 4th spec. We already broke the ground of a class with 4 specs when they gave druid 4 specs.
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Multiple reason were shown and said, Druid is not a great counter argument on this⌠in fact they are two separate cases.
Youâve just been ignoring them and not acknowledging it.
Well I must have missed it, so why donât you say it again.
Just say you like it and donât want it to go away. Any comparisons are pointless and opinion.
Thereâs plenty reason as to why its not a viable / possible thing to have a 4th spec with hunters using an older version of one spec. I do have some personal experience with gaming business, and all business have pretty much the same âwork planâ. Iâm in no way saying it wouldnât be great to have 4th spec, could certainly be interesting⌠Iâd probably give it a try but still play MM / SV. So hereâs some big reasons, although there are more than just that.
Drama
Itâs not secret adding a 4th spec to the hunter would create issue in the community, not with hunters itself but with other classes. Everyone have amazing ideas for a 4th spec for their class. Then you have Demon Hunter, still stuck with two specs⌠no second dps spec to fall back to if theirs get nerfed hard. To add a 4th spec, youâll need something all around to be added. Certainly ainât going to happen with Shadowlands.
Cost vs Income
Blizzard is a business. Modifications, new features, resources must be approved. Just because it sounds cool, doesnât mean it would get added. Bringing back an old version of a spec as a 4th spec could be big for a group of Hunter players, but the cost of it vs what itâd bring them is too much. This isnât simply copy pasta thing (To be explained in next point). Why work on something that would only please a small portion of the game community? Would it make them spend more money? Stay subbed? A little perhaps, but hardly any noticeable change since most of the hunters asking for it are already subbed, already a hunter. Money, resources are a finite thing⌠while every devs would love to add it and bring all cool stuff to make more happy players⌠those higher wants results at minimal cost. Those people arenât gamers, they are business people.
More work, more issues.
Part 1 : Inside work
Adding that 4th spec isnât just copy past the old data from WoD or any other version. They will check old logs (if still available), make changes to adapt it to current Retail version. Create new spells / talents / Art to fit and make it stand out more. Create new pvp talents. Re-balance all spell dmg, scaling, etc. This is a lot of resource to spend on a single spec.
Part 2 : Nostalgia - Unsatisfied players.
With all those needed changes to do in order to add a 4th spec, you will have players hating it. Those that asked for the 4th spec will hate. Spec isnât what I wanted it to be like! This isnât wod SV! I wanted more MoP SV! Why did you change that skill to make it a cast!? Etc. Youâd get a 4th spec, but not really what you wanted.
But Druid had it, so why not Hunter too?!
Druid is a separate case. Back then the talent system was still a points thing, not the 3 choices per row talent system.
Old Talent chart for druid. You will see that both âGuardianâ and âFeralâ were build in the saw column.
https://rpgworld.altervista.org/talentcata/eng/?DU#.63-!-1,-1,-1,-1,-1,-1,-1,-1,-1So when the new system came with MOP , having two spec using the same talents wouldnât fit. Each talent would need to have two version build in it⌠one for bear form and one for cat form. So they created the 4th spec so that guardian and feral would have different talent choices.
Also, no secret that both dps and tanking forms of the druid weâre used/played since Vanilla.
Now Hunter doesnt have that same thing. They had a spec change / evolve with new mechanics and people want an âolderâ version of it. This is clearly a different story.
But they did it in Legion, why not now?
Legion class change was a planned thing, resource and effort was reserved for an overall change around all classes. Some more than others. It was a focus. It isnât just some random thoughts. So again, in SL you wonât see anything. Next one after that one might bring class changes all around. If there would be a slight chance of seeing something new, itâd be there.
You would be pissed too if your spec was deleted, legion destroyed a ton of fun in regards to class design. I donât like the new versions at all, and blizz is still very ignorant and refuse to reverse bad changes like shadow, ret, subtlety, survival, and I am sure many more.
It still blows my mind that blizzard thought it was actually ok to completely delete a spec from the game.
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- No specs was deleted
- While âyouâ and âsomeâ other players hate the new variation of these specs, thereâs also those that love it. People that hates it are move vocal⌠but thatâs because of how humans are.
- It wasnât bad changes, to you it would be, for them it wasnât. Those changes are needed to keep an interest with class or to bring in new ones. Yes, those dislike it could leave, but really while some left thereâs still a lot that still plays⌠either same spec/class or a new one.
I donât think youâve changed any minds in your thousand posts.
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No, youâve only given one real reason. You claim that it would cost resources and development time, which is a ridiculous argument since literally all changes cost resources and development time. Itâs just that every time we tell you and Darkeforge that, you drop out of the thread and come back later telling us âMultiple reason were shown and saidâ when you havenât backed up anything that youâve said at all.
Irrelevant. Druids already got their fourth spec and this wasnât a huge issue. Players understood that it was better to break the rules and give Druids four specs rather than deleting one half of Feral.
We have an identical situation now. It would be better to give Hunters four specs rather than just deleting ranged SV.
Furthermore, deleting ranged SV has already caused issues in the community.
Except Ion already confirmed that that was exactly what they were doing with melee SV. They knew it would be niche and that most people that already play Hunters wouldnât want it because they play Hunter to be ranged.
Furthermore, as Iâve already explained in my other post, the number of players the reintroduction of ranged SV would satisfy would be far larger than the introduction of melee SV satisfied. So unless you want to admit that the deletion of ranged SV and the addition of melee SV was a failure, then you cannot argue that the reintroduction of ranged SV would be a failure.
Prove it.
Again, already tackled all of this in my post about the profitability of bringing back ranged SV. If deleting ranged SV and introducing melee SV was profitable, then ranged SV is essentially guaranteed to be profitable.
And they did way more when they added melee SV. So again, if melee SV was profitable and worth it, then the relatively simpler reintroduction of ranged SV would be even more profitable.
It didnât merely âchangeâ. They slapped the same name on it and changed everything else. The only thing you could argue wasnât completely removed was better traps, and current melee SV doesnât even have that anymore. You canât just remove everything, starting over from square one, and then just call it a âchangeâ.
Yes, ranged Survival was deleted.
If you want to claim that it wasnât deleted, then show me your argument right now for how Frost Death Knight is just a âchangedâ version of Frost Mage, and that they are actually the same spec. If you canât, then stop falsely claiming that ranged SV wasnât deleted.
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How do you know this? Can you for see in the future?
So you must work for Blizzard or another game company then? You seem to give so much insight of their inner working that you must work for one and know how a Game Company functions?
Then if it just time they need then after Shadowlands they could bring back RSV as a fourth spec or as a alternative to MSV as year or more would be enough. But what about money? Well if they were willing to spend money on a change that was known would cause drama with some players then they could be will to spend some more to make those upset player happy again, and maybe bring back some players which would increase earnings?
1 Like