Why I'm quitting BGs as an Alliance player

I’ve been playing this game since Vanilla and even recall waiting hours just to do a Warsong Gulch as a low level Druid.

PVP has always been a big part of my end game content, but the state of BfA and its attitude towards the Alliance has caused it to not be fun for me anymore. Here are the reasons why:

  1. ILVL and win rate differences.

I have been able to consistently compare the average ILVL of my Alliance BG team to the ILVL of my opponents’ ILVL and almost always, the Horde’s on average, is higher. The reasons why have been well documented, they had access to easy gear earlier than the Alliance. Also, by getting a set amount of conquest points each week, players can get a high level piece of gear. Also, we can see that most PvE content is completed by Horde guilds/players. The mythic plus and raid scene is dying among the Alliance when compared to the activity on the Horde. Therefore they are getting higher Ilvl gear from multiple sources whereas Alliance can’t get the high ilvl gear as easily. Horde are winning more, therefore are getting better gear faster which only hastens the disparity. How do I know Horde are winning more? In my case, I’m able to look up the percentage of wins that my opponent has as well as their ILVL. I then in turn compare it to my team’s ILVL and percentage of winning. By collecting this data, I was able to confirm what I suspected. As a whole, Alliance are playing with teammates who lose MORE often with worse gear than the Horde teams. Here are two examples:

I lost both Warsong Gulch random BGs that I participated in tonight. Both times, the Horde team had the higher winrate by at least ten percent. Also interesting that both times the Horde team as a whole had a significantly higher ILVL than the Alliance did. https :// imgur. com /a/K6TQOZp

The devs already confirmed that they reward those with a higher ILVL in PVP.

So why as an Alliance player am I being punished for playing on the underrepresented faction while the Horde gets rewarded with teammates who win more and have better gear? It makes no sense that I have to work harder for my wins than the Horde does. In Legion, it was tolerable because it seems it was undoing what was done in WoD, but the pendulum never swung back to the Alliance’s side. If anything its speed went from 0 to 60 only compounding the Alliance’s problems while increasing the Horde’s benefits. Well I’m not going to play that game.

  1. Disparity in healers
    I just got out of an IoC BG where the Horde had 9 healers and the Alliance had 3 healers. Let’s say that if each team was split equally the horde would have had 3 healers at each node and the Alliance would have had 1 healer at each node. You tell me, is it easier to focus ONE healer among many DPS or is it easier to kill 3 healers all healing each other? Obviously, our team was routed. I’d like to point out tonight that I wasn’t even able to get the conquest reward for the Epic BGs whereas and I’m constantly hearing the same thing from other Alliance players. We can’t stay up all night trying to win when Blizzard won’t put effort into balancing the teams. Horde can usually one shot for their conquest then move onto other things.

  2. Faction imbalance
    This one is easy, Horde have more numbers thereby allowing for more options, thereby allowing for better teams. Alliance numbers are so low that Blizzard is scraping the bottom of the barrel to even fill a 10 man BG. I am constantly put in the same BGs as those who played the last game with me. Why? Because there are so few of us, we see each other more often. From my understanding, this makes it MUCH harder for Blizzard to make matchmaking balanced, but they’ve known there was an imbalance since Legion and didn’t do anything about it. So even now, due to so many Alliance losses/lack of PvE groups, Alliance are fleeing to the Horde where you get paired with better players against the lone stalwarts who refuse to leave.

As an Alliance player, this is a lot to overcome, barriers that Horde never even has to think about. I know they claim that they suffer due to queue differences, but I’ve tested it on my Horde toon and it isn’t even that much longer. Waiting five extra minutes for a random BG is not any sort of punishment or disadvantage when it comes to playing this game. Waiting an extra 10 minutes for an Epic BG is a pretty low motivation for queuing for Merc mode when you can expect to easily win against those who are lower geared and who lose more often. I’m not going to do it anymore. I’ve accepted that Horde gets two expacs of PVP domination after a small break during WoD. From Vanilla to Cata, Horde won the majority of BGs.

Either Blizzard needs to add more incentive for Merc mode, or lengthen the Horde queue times to give the alliance a more balanced and equal team. As I mentioned earlier, PVP was my main end game content and seeing how it isn’t geared towards me as an Alliance player, I may let my sub run out in 3 days.


Alliance players are punished as a faction since they consistently play against those with higher gear and higher win rates. They must put in more effort to win. Overall, Horde has more robust team comps because Blizzard has a larger pool to matchmake from, whereas the Alliance team comps are horrible because there are so few of us.


Im not punished as an alliance player? Infact mid legion i went from horde to alliance. Sure we may not win alllll the time but at least q times are short. Gear matters very little . Ive played against some 2k lower ilvl heals tonight while doing rated. I started at 1699 tonight and climbed to 1812 atm. Id say im hardly suffering as alliance .I also am up to 370 ilvl just from pvp alone as alliance . Even then most nights i win more in randoms /epics . Idk i enjoy being alliance so id say im hardly punished.

It comes down to skill >gear . Also if you want to push wins i suggest rated. Randoms are a more relaxed setting . So ofc itll be win some then lose some . Along with some 68k hp players and alts ,because randoms is how you learn stuff .

It has 0 to do with faction. I have played both sides and to me they are no diffrent.As for making horde ques even longer ? What ? They already wait 5 to 20 min as it is ? How would making it worse for them benifit us ?


No, it matters. A lot.
Remember we didn’t want templates so that gear would matter again. When I first got this Warrior to 120, I had about 92k HP. Guess who was primary in just about every fight? Guess who was farmed until they reached about 115k?

Gear makes a difference.

As for you healing… I don’t mean to be that guy, but for Odyn’s sake you’re Disc.
Don’t oversimplify things based on this narrow point of view.

As for OP, I’m maining Alliance for BfA. I mained Horde since Vanilla. I wanted a challenge and something different. By all means do as I did and switch and see if that’s right for you.


Nah azerite and stats matter more than ilvl.

So your 115k isn’t the reason.

Damage is changed back end so a low ilvl player can fight a higher ilvl player.


If it makes any difference some of the lower level brackets alliance are dominating.

Too bad the OP isn’t on this morning. 0-3 in Epic BGs as Horde with 15 min que times. Que’ing up number 4 now to get that daily win.


This is what happens when people think they understand statistics

Does anyone else’s eyes roll so far into the back of your head that you’ll think they’ll get stuck there when you read “I’ve played since vanilla?”


Hey OP, I’m 0-5 in random bgs and 1-3 in epics this morning.


I haven’t run a BG in a year or more, they’re just like everything else in WOW, static, disconnected content.


0-10 most days as alliance. Queue pop, 3/4 through loss. Queue pop, 1/2 through loss. Queue pop, scan player list… notice majority of SA servers on alliance, chalk it down as loss.

Half of them will be afk, half will wander around aimlessly. May not be pretty sounding but its factual. Next time you random bg, check which faction has more SA realms, guess at the start the outcome based on it. You may surprise yourself.


Just out of curiosity, how are you getting ilvl? Are you having google sheets pull it down from the armory, or are you getting it from inside the game? And win % is done the same way?

I noticed you are tracking healers too, I’m so curious about mercs, scoreboard stats, and objective scores. I wish that it were possible to combine this with Reflex so badly.

I really wish I could automate collecting this data, but I literally take a screenshot of the end scoreboard, search each toon on WoW’s website and enter the data manually into the spreadsheet. Seeing ilvl is pretty straightforward, but they added everyone’s win rates this expansion. To see that data, I scroll down to the very bottom of the armory page and click “View more PVP stats”.

In the first Screenshot, our team was pure alliance. In the second, the healer Bloodysgirl was a merc and there were a couple DPS who were merca this game.

I wish I could automate this more, but at this point, I don’t want to play anymore. If any other players, horde or alliance wants to track these things for real accuracy, then it would be very telling. But even from my experiences yesterday, it was enough for me to see why I should stop playing.


You aren’t winning/losing over ilvl.


HI don’t agree with you. They got rid of templates (where ILvL) doesn’t matter and that dev confirmed on twitter that it’s easier for a higher ilvl character to kill a lower ilvl character. There’s a huge difference in trying to kill someone with 130k hp vs someone with 85k hp and Since Alliance is lagging in all gear collecting activities (PvE PVP) horde in general get the better gear with more Stamina. It’s clear to see why the Horde overall has more players with better gear.

The principle is, why as an Alliance player should I tolerate participating in a game that gives an advantage to the Horde at the expense of my faction? You can look at my winrates for my bgs and see that I win more than I lose. A number that has steadily decreased almost two percentage points since BfA began. Are you being passive aggressive here and saying it’s a “git Gud” situation?

And I never said it was only about ilvl, alliance plays more with people who lose while the horde has more teammates who win more often.

I could tolerate it in Legion since it was basically countering what happened in WoD, but BfA has been the worst expansion for alliance mains. I’m not going to play anymore until Blizz either increases the incentive for alliance even more like they did with warmode, or lengthen queue times for more fair comps.


The thing is, iLvL DID matter with templates, every ~10 iLvL disparity between you and your opponent was like a 1% advantage or something, right?

0.1% not 1%


I’m seeing 0.1% per 1 which is equal to 1% per 10?

Only wrath babies get offended by stuff like this LOL!

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I was the undergeared not long ago. Was doing just fine.