You cut me deep with that one.
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Are they used by bots?
Again. Do bots use them?
Since they banned the software, but not the act itself, it makes sense that the target was not MBers. Why would they target someone who uses DBM in raid?
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Iâm wondering when this will impact on AH prices. I still havenât noticed any significant changes in my realm so far.
No. Because as soon as one fails to look at things at face value, as it were, thatâs when you get caught.
Not quite true. Macros are allowed by Blizzard until said macros become inconvienent. Why do you think spells, by and large, now share the same GCD? Itâs thanks, in part, to the emergent popularity of one shot macros.
But in this case, Blizz did the relatively smart thing: they took an alternate route rather than banning macros. Had they taken the approach theyâve taken with multi-boxing, they wouldâve outright banned macros.
And just because Blizz allows one thing on Monday, does not mean they cannot and will not disallow it on Tuesday. This is the unforseen consequences I warn of, the forward thinging of possible ramifications of this change.
Blizzard has,.contractually speaking via the EULA/TOS to alter the game in any way, shape, or form as they see fit. And if macros, using this as an example, that allow actions that reduce the amount of player input become an issue, donât think they wonât outright ban them.
And is not allowed in BGs. Blizzard has already half-broken the command.
Honestly, I support neither. However, I am keenly aware of how such software and multi-boxing work. Thus, by banning software that minimizes player directed input while maximizing playet directed output, I get concerned about what could be waiting downstream.
Again, this is about the precedent being set and the justification for that precedent and how it may affect the game and players moving forward should Blizzard, at a relative vocal minorityâs urging, be pressured into making a decision.
You will notice they didnât explicitly allow hardware based key cloning. They didnât mention it at all.
They did strongly suggest why they implemented these changes though. To make it easier to ban bots, who look a lot like multiboxing.
Do you really think theyâre going to just go âoh, they might be using hardware key duplicationâ? No, they, and the players reporting then are going to just see key duplication. From there, they either carve out an explicit exception, or your appeal fails.
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Over thinking the thread.
Manual inputs are not banned. Cloning a manual input via software across numerous clients is banned.
Stop looking into what isnât there.
B-B-BUT I CANT 1 KEY AND HAVE IT ACROSS 9 CHARACTERS THE ACT OF A MANUAL KEY PRESS IS GOING TO BE BANNED
W-W-Whats next? I canât use keybinds?
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At itâs core, it boils down to one thing:
Minimizing player input resulting in maximizing player output. The difference being, is thay botting is an automated process. Multi-boxing requires, when done legitimately, manual input.
The two (botting and multi-boxing) arenât always mutually exclusive, but they often are.
And to that end, if macros then become the go-to tool for botting, you think Blizzard wonât act? And more importantly, this possibly points to an even larger issue: Blizzardâs inability to reliably detect botting via Warden.
Granted, Warden has been notoriously iffy and botters are notriously crafty so there will always be a tug-of-war but this plants Blizzard firmly in a reactionary camp of bot detection and eradication and shows whatever efforts they may take, it will be the path of least resistance.
If Blizzard via Warden, cannot reliably detect bots from manual input, then something is broken. And furthermore, strengthens the case for banning QOL macros, addons, and God knows how many more features we use on a daily basis to make things in game more convienent.
Elaborate on "multiboxing requires, when done legitimately, manual input "
I see this as when done âlegitimatelyâ having to tab between every wow client or move between multiple monitors to manual input every action on every character separately which will still be allowed.
As for the âwell what if botters have macros as the go toâ
Well what if they use a certain spell? What if they use a certain item? What if they make their bots a certain race? Its all what ifs. Blizzard might as well ban druids with this logic since theyâre suited to farm via flight form.
What ifs
Multi boxing isnât much an issue as thereâs someone there playing them. The bots need more priority as they affect the economy more then multi boxers since noone is playing them and running all hours of the day.
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To preform an action, one must manually press a key. This action, via key cloning software, is then repeated over multiple clients. There is a physical action being made by a player sitting at a keyboard.
Botting, by definition, is a fully automated process on which actions are preformed without direct player interaction with the client via keystroke.
This is why multi-boxing has always been tolerated as a âgray areaâ. While one may he able to argue key cloning is automating a process across multiple clients, there is, more often than not, a player at a keyboard pressing a key to initiate that action. Itâs very much like a macro: one key allows a single player to physically minimize input and simultaneously maximize output.
So if Warden is now unable to detect whether an action taken by a multi-boxer is the result of automated process or direct player interaction, Warden is clearly now outdated and broken.
And if Warden is unable to discern between player action or bot, how long before Blizzard takes action against similar tools such as macros which, for the record, can be automated by botd as well?
Furthermore, if Blizzard really is doing this in the interest of stabilizing the ingame economy, gold generation, and player experience, I have to ask why they instituted warmode which, while it has made playing across servers much more convienent for legitimate players, has provided protection for bots. This wasnât always the case.
Back in Wrath, as an example, players on PvE servers would keep alts parked in Wintergrasp solely for the purpose of hunting and killing farming bots. I knew players on PvP servers who would form bot hunting armies.
I would, similarly, disrupt hack bots who would use multiple lvl 1 toons to create âadvertising signsâ in SW.
I would also make bots âoutâ themselves to GMs by demanding they get to my house lickety split because they were already running late with my food; making a bot report you for racism, only to get banned for botting is an amazing experience.
I wonât go Alex Jones with a tin foil hat, but the removal of PvP servers and the advent of Warmode has had the unintended consequence of protecting actual bots who are no longer at risk of being hunted down by legitimate players.
But Iâm going off on a tanget now.
Auto loot is an option created by Blizzard, they allow it, why would they care about that?
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I mean by your logic of key cloning not being automation because it required 1 manual key press then botting isnt automation because it requires the botter to manually login and start his routine.
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It makes botting more convienent. If a player has to manually click each individual item to loot, theoretically, it would cut down on multi-boxing bots or even single bots.
Flying makes it more convenient, auto run makes it more convenient. Get rid of those while weâre at it.
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Incorrect. And it shows how little you know about botting or multi-boxing and the legitimate difference between the two.
Botting is a fully automated process that plays the game and, FYI, also automatically log a person into the client. There is NO ONE at the keyboard.
By contrast multi-boxing, when legitimately done, has a player at a keyboard pressing a key or keys.
The difference is player presence at a keyboard.
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Welcome to the slippery slope. This rabbit hole goes crazy deep and thatâs my concern. If we donât fill it in, that rabbit hole risks becoming a sink hole that swallows us whole. ALL of us.
Right right. So when rhe bot gets stuck it requires no one? When it starts getting ganked the botter ignores it? They donât.
Youâre entitled to your opinion but your âslippery slopeâ argument doesnât work.
Theyre removing the primary tool people use to multibox to a high degree of advantage and thatâs all there is to it.
Iâve been listening to slippery slopes from my grandparents all my life. Primarily if same sex couples can get married apparently marriage was going to go away and not be supported for opposing sex couples and people would be having sex with animals in the streets.
Donât think thatâs happened yet.
Also if schools require we vaccinate our kids theyâre going to require they have microchips and blah blah blah the slippery slope that doesnât exist in reality.
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Again, this shows how little you know. Bots get stuck all the time. Theyâre also notoriously easy to kill because PvP happens at a pace and skill level a script canât anticipate.
Example: you can sap a bot and it will continue on its merry way after the sap runs out because the actual script isnât written to retaliate against another player. Itâs designed to travel along a set path using co-ordinates on a grid that links known resource spawning points.
When the bot detects a spawn at one of these points, the script tells it to gather that resource.
And I have camped a bot to the point of getting messages from the botter and a equal level character coming to fight back. I guess it was all automated as well.
You seem to think being grounded in reality is ignorance.
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