We’re in gold shire doing the things others won’t do.
Hey now, I can’t help that my cute lil red drae bae is good at DPS.
Also totally not my fault red drainos are cute AND deadly. 
2 Likes
You become a demon when you no longer venture to the shadowlands upon death and instead is reformed in the twisting nether. This require a lot of fel to get to that point though.
Some demon hunters but not all have reached the point of acquiring a “demon soul” that will reform, Illidan comments on the player having one like him.
Yes they did, but I’d argue there’s a difference here, the orcs were more like goons and ground troops while the Man’ari are elite forces and mainly the literal commanders and leaders of the legion. They’re in charge of using the legions forces on it’s crusade against all life. For many thousands of years.
The leader of these Man’ari even recognized this and how their hands are soaked in blood.
Comparably the inflicted pain and deaths are several times over the amount the orcs did in their few years under legion control. No other member race of the factions even come close to the man’ari, you could even put all the other races of both factions together and it would not amount to the bloodshed the man’ari has caused.
3 Likes
To be fair I don’t think he’s appeared since before the dreadlord Shadowlands retcon existed. I’m sure they will have him be secretly evil but I wouldn’t hold him not telling us about that against him, it wasn’t a thing yet.
Though it would be far more interesting if he was actually good instead of yet another “muahahah YOU FELL FOR IT!” “”“twist”“” but I don’t think that will happen. Maybe he started as an infiltrator but grew to genuinely believe in the cause. I don’t know. I just would like something more than the millionth telegraphed “surprise” bad guy from Blizzard.
2 Likes
Well, you could try pushing the wrong buttons…
2 Likes
Pfft, buttons are for amatures
“Hello, we are the Grimkillslaughter Tribe, gentle herbalists of the Murderfist Highlands. We will definitely not be the guys who turn on you this expansion. Our Supreme Commander Chief Tyrannos Heartcrusher would never do that.”
6 Likes
As I remember, the quests about the Manari, they knew what they were doing. They weren’t drugged.
That said, I believe in redemption. The acknowledge what they did was wrong and are willing to atone for it.
2 Likes
It was also mentioned I believed that Kil’jaedan could read the minds of every man’ari and sense any treachery within. Keeping most from even thinking about rebelling
3 Likes
So we’ve agreed on standard principle and are just quibbling over numbers?
“Oh, the Orcs only commit genocide against a handful of races and destroyed only a single planet. The Manari did that thousands of times, obviously they’re worse.”
One time or a thousand, it’s amounts to the same level of evil.
1 Like
Because blizzard wanted them to exist and made a justification to fit the mechanical presence of the skin rather than just say it’s not strictly canon, which at the very least was a little more thought out by the time they tried to cover it in the heritage story than undead elves lmao. It’s ‘modern’ warcraft being modern warcraft.
1 Like
The manari chose it every time.
The orcs were thrice duped.
2 Likes
Huh this is kinda interesting it explains some old undeath lore. Like how the Necromancers and Death Knights retained their humanity in service while it says ghouls are “true undead”.
I didn’t know the original liches were all orcs following Ner’zhul. Ner’zhul is the “king lich” because he is leading his former orc followers as liches I guess. The armor seems like his phylactery.
- He tries to break away on Draenor to do his own thing, his group is captured and become liches.
- Makes use of the magical armor he is stuck in and the powers he has gained
- Eventually gets his own chosen death knight wearing the armor he is bound to
Basically the Warcraft RTS series is Ner’zhul as the main character. He is playing game of thrones and 3d chess, first with orcs and humans where he lost and then with the undead and the demons where he won the game.
probably retconned sadly, nerzhul really got cucked as time went on.
1 Like
Why does the alliance tolerate the presence of the manari draenei?
because “lol why not”?
It’s simply bad writing for fan service customizations. Don’t overthink it.
a) It’s a break in character and an inconsistency for the entire Alliance
b) Even if they wanted to, Man’ari would be unable to regain a good alignment because fel magic corrupts and permanently kills all positive inclinations.
4 Likes
You’re just posting dialogue directly from the Bloodtotem quests in Highmountain
5 Likes
Of course that material had not been written before Shadowlands.
I’ve been attacked and I’m not even in the conversation!
Player death knights were canonically under Scourge enthrallment before joining their respective factions, and demon hunters aren’t willingly evil, they’re just edgy. Player warlocks are overtly about dominating the demons they use, and have always ultimately been in service of their respective faction. By virtue of being the player characters, they were never willingly evil either.
I have no idea about void elves, I’ve never played one nor looked at their lore.
It doesn’t really matter if the Manari are “guilty”. The story is about redemption and the blameless don’t need redemption. In the end, you either believe in redemption or you don’t.
4 Likes
People also need to realize that it’s an extreme minority of man’ari who are seeking redemption.
5 Likes