If you had 5-6 mobs glued to you simultaneously, then your DPS was either single target oriented (which is fine), actively was trying to avoid peeling (which is also fine), or were just not good (which is also fine).
None of those things though, is reflective of life at 60, when people are in full pre-BiS and/or raid gear and doing their damndest to be the top slot on the meters off the rip.
To be fair, sometimes its on accident. I can wait for 5-8 seconds for the tank to get aggro but if I get a double crit chain lighting/flame shock…I know I’m running my trolly self to where the tank is standing (Talking about single target btw)
Oh, I definitely run arms/prot (I absolutely love technical play, so tactical mastery is right up my alley). I had no idea there were tanks out there that still go pure prot.
As for Skarm: I haven’t had a chance to view his content lately, so I can’t say whether he runs with guildies who wait, or DPS who go as hard as possible as soon as possible. Either way, I would agree, the dude is a phenomenal tank.
It would not surprise me if the OP and others agreeing with him are full Prot.
Oh, I’ve not watched him very closely, either. I just felt it was worth noting he is already playing the build despite “not having the gear for it.”
I see people bring up gear as a limiting factor for the build, but I don’t think that’s really true. It’s the better spec regardless of gear, I’d say.
You do realize this isn’t Bfa and threat actually takes time to build right? Gotta make your brain work because you didn’t in that comment.
except they change aggro constantly regardless of threat… we already discussed this… are you moving goal posts and disregarding already discussed material in an effort to save face after being prooved wrong?
That’s not really how it works. You don’t need to “build” threat. As long as your TPS is higher than the DPS’s, they’ll never pull aggro.
If you have to build threat to avoid losing aggro, you will eventually lose aggro, anyway as the threat they’re generating is exceeding your own.
The only thing that really needs to be done is for the tank to be the first one on the mob’s threat table. From there, it is really easy for a tank to hold aggro.
But not regardless of taunt.
If the tanks are doing their job, those mobs only ever hit tanks. If the DPS are dying to Annihilators, it’s the tanks’ fault.
Pushing buttons is fun, and not pushing buttons is not fun.
Don’t take it so personally.
Lol I use lower spells so I don’t yank off tank still do good damage.
Good Tank: Doesn’t care if aggro is pulled if no one dies or healer isn’t stressed.
Bad Tank: Cares aggro is lost and rages. Slows whole instance run down to a crawl.
Even following all the rules in this thread, I still pulled aggro a lot.
I’d rather a fast run where everyone is having a good time than the over sensitive tank that wants to cry about what is essentially nothing.
If you’re less than max level and you’re in a group that can’t handle aggro going every where occasionally I’d just join a different group. You all put together a bad group of people.
That’s exactly what I used to say on my rogue when I was 14.
Lol. It’s literally not possible to hold a mob off serious dps who wont let you hold it and you know it.
This is so totally wrong and not how threat works in Classic. Threat has to be built up in classic. There was a golden rule in tanking in Classic, the DPS always waited for a Warrior tank to have 2+ sunders on the target BEFORE you started DPS.
This is also why things like CC and priority targeting were so important in Classic as it was very easy to strip mobs off a tank if you were applying to much DPS.
DPS could only full MAX DPS a target if they, the DPS, were 100% sure the tank had well established aggro and even then, they could only do so for a limited period of time or they could easily out TPS the tank.
What you need to do is stop trying to show how big your epeen is and top the DPS meters.
TL/DR: In Classic a good DPS was not who was top DPS, but instead who was the best at knowing when to start their DPS, knew about aggro control by backing off DPS when needed, could stay out of the stupid and knew how to not break CC.
It does not need to be built up.
Threat is a quantifiable numeric value.
If you build up 100 threat, then 10 TPS thereafter, in 20 seconds, you will lose aggro to someone doing 17 TPS.
Building up threat does nothing if you cannot maintain a high enough TPS to keep aggro. The only benefit of building aggro is if you know your threat generation is lower and are creating a buffer (or for fights like Onyxia where a portion of your threat is wiped).
If you are playing properly, your threat generation will not be lower.
That was because players were bad at the game. That is no longer necessary in Classic.
I’m a tank, bud. I don’t care about topping the DPS meters. I care about holding aggro and allowing the DPS to do their job with full effectiveness.
DPS is just the vehicle through which I generate threat because of the way my class works.
This right here. You know you have a bad tank when they whine about not keeping aggro on 100% of the mobs all the time. If the dungeon is getting cleared smoothly who cares about your fragile little tank ego?
This. Unless a mob peels off to attack the healer or a clothie dps then just let whoever aggroed off tank it. Unless there’s 3 or less mobs you shouldn’t expect to hold aggro on everything.
I would imagine a good number of tanks dont mark for fear a DPS is going to pull the next group because he had to wait two more seconds. Personally, I try to at least mark skull and x, but i also tell my groups from the get go that im not a “speed run” tank.
As with much that you have said, you continue to take an overly simplistic approach to things. What you say here would be true if TPS was a linear metric. It is generally not. Different abilities generate different amounts of threat. While I can’t speak for druid tanking (maybe it really is just swipe, swipe, swipe, thus linear threat, which would certainly suit your simplistic vision for playing), for warrior we really do need to “build” agro. For example, consider a pull on a pack of 4 mobs. I charge, thunder clap @ 180 threat, shift to Def stance, Demo shout @ 43 threat per mob, and battle shout @ 70 threat per party member buffed. Only then do I hit the skull for a sunder @ 260 threat. As you can see, my opening to grab the agro on all mobs is not high threat on each mob. That only occurs with my first sunder. So TPS is not linear, and is low on a per mob bases at the opening. Now generally, as long as peeps aren’t full ham nuking at the start, DPS can open up at my battle shout, or about 2 seconds in.
So that is what everyone is trying to tell you about “building agro”. It’s not a mechanism to get a lead that we struggle to hold. It’s about getting the aoe/low threat agro going to grab the pack before we go into high threat/single target moves that short of big crits the dps generally won’t pull off us.
And this isn’t even getting into the fact that threat isn’t even for all dps. Some damage abilities generate more threat per damage than others. For example Priest Mind Blast is 200% threat for the damage it does.
So your comment of TPS vs DPS would suggest that while you may be getting away with it, your knowledge of tanking mechanics in classic is lacking and you have an overly simplistic view of it.
Make a macro that /Cast Sunder Armor /tm 8.
Every time you sunder it marks the mob with a skull.
I prefer /tm 8 on a separate key. As the fight progresses and healer agro builds, I usually need to add a sunder to the non-skull target. I wouldn’t want my skull bouncing mobs so much. But that may just be something specific to my tanking style.