If people are complaining that it’s too hard before they’ve even reached the levels where you need better than open world gear, it’s not a rewards issue.
Yes, some people cleared the max on day 1, still without being super geared. And those stories were overwhelmed by complaints about difficulty.
Point still stands, if solo players want challenging content with better rewards, they gotta make more noise than the ones who want everything faceroll easy to have a chance a Blizz listening.
wrong, the nerfs came when floor 6 was open (week 4) and it was one shooting people, it wasnt a smal part of the community, it was a lot people complaning not only from difficulty but because some classes were completly undertuned.
your logic makes no sense, raids someetiems get nerf at week 1, does that mean everyone is bad or the raid was badly tune? your argument makes no sense.
see you dont even remember the events you are talking about, day 1 only 3 floors were open and there wasnt a lot complains, the complains came around week 3/4 after floor 6 became available and thats when they actually nerf because it was in a bad shape.
no it doesnt, you dont get to say “do hard content happily with no actual rewad before you are allow to gain reward” this isnt even a argument is just an asinine take that makes 0 sense
Isn’t this how every MMO progression works?
For example when we’re tackling heroic/mythic raids for the first time we put in ALOT of work with no reward.
Sometimes it takes 20-30-40 wipes before we get a clean kill and eventually reap rewards.
I’m confused because…everyone else has to do hard content before being rewarded, why should ya’ll be different?
No.
wrong, you only have no reward if you dont actually accomplish your goal.
if it takes 40 wipes for your to kill the 1st heroic boss the problem is your group.
are you joking? Torghast has 0 gear progression, no matter how many times you clear or how perfect it is there is no chance for a gear to actually drop.
its completly different from having to wipe a billion times however once you actually manage to kill the thing it will drop gear no matter what, everyone has at least a chance and a very clear gear progression infront of them.
see the difference? look what you said.
“everyone else has to do hard content before being rewarded” which means that once you do the hard content you have at least a chance to be reward right?
does Torghast have that? no.
if torghast had an actual gear progression then the argument against people asking for nerfs would make a bit of sense, but even them sometimes raids as nerfed too because stuff was busted so you have to go in a case by case
You using torghast as your only example is terrible because the system behind torghast doesn’t award gear to begin with.
You are literally arguing about something that does not exist.
you shouldn’t have reply to me then because I was already talking about Torghast replying to the poster that said solo players should be happy with torghast pre nerf before asking for gear.
if you dont wanna talk about that feel free to not reply anymore.
You’re failing to realize who the majority of the player base is and how old we are now…. Pointless to explain…. Do your homework and you might realize who you want to keep around….
The majority of the player base aren’t solo players.
You can check achievements and see ALOT of players actually clear ATLEAST the normal version of the raid.
I have been a solo player snce like pandaria and I always clear heroic raid, thats not really a good measurement, however tbh I have no idea how you would check what the majority of players actually are
I assumed it was people who refused to partake in group content.
a lot of the “solo player” threads are just people raging that they are forced into group content for gear when the gear should be available to them in the open world.
you assumed wrong? m+ players do raid too even tho its not their favorite content and the inverse is true for raiders, they do M+ even tho its not really what they want but its what blizzard forced into them.
if I want to do the solo content we actually have, like mage tower or torghast Im more or less forced to do group content, it is what it is
My apologies, since the other 2 threads regarding solo players are LITERALLY about them complaining about needing to group.
lol. Didn’t mean to hurt your hidden account’s feelings gangsta carry on.
Especially when there are alternatives.
People forget this isn’t 2008 - 2016 where WoW was basically the only name in MMORPGs. There are several alternatives that offer robust solo activities, social environments, and challenging group content. Why would people stay in a game where leveling is basically the only thing they have the way in progress, when you can play FFXIV and can literally get the 2nd highest current ilvl via completely solo activity as long as you are caught up with the story.
Have you tried Guild Wars 2 or ESO? Maybe Swtor?
I don’t think solo only players should get mythic raid equivalent gear.
I do think there should be a progression system in the max level zone(s) for each xpac that allows them to progress up to at most normal raid levels, and then potentially a mage tower/torgast/horrific visions type of content that allows them to get heroic raid level gear so long as it’s a suitable challenge. The best gear in the game should only be available to the people doing the hardest group content.
Fun fact, even Ever Quest, way back when it started had a class you could solo with. Solo play has always been part of MMOs. What most developers have realized, and blizzard hasn’t, is that to some extent everyone who plays an MMO is a solo player. Whether you’re playing on your own by choice or none of the people you play with are available, at some point you’re going to be playing solo. This means the solo experience needs to be robust and expansive.
This means, solo content is 100% needed in an MMO. Group Content by this realization is optional.
That doesn’t mean group content shouldn’t be there, shouldn’t be challenging, or have the best rewards. It totally should, but it’s optional content versus the needed solo content.
A lot of “solo player” threads are made by people strawmanning “solo players”
What a lot of solo players want isn’t the best gear in the game, but a sense of progression over time. And honestly taking the korthia gearing system and applying it to max lvl zones to allow solo players over time gear up to normal raid equivalents, I think should just be standard.
I fully agree with this concept. I believe there should be a system this way where EVENTUALLY yes, the solo player catches up.
I can get behind that.
I’ve done 20s and had no real issue with them. They’re not hard but finding the time to do them is. And I have no real interest in mythic raiding when the difficulty is waiting for other people to learn mechanics. It’s tedious compared to keys.
Thank you for being the living example of my point. We as players aren’t paid to deal with illiterate loaves of bread such as yourself in game. I enjoy the gameplay. I don’t enjoy people like you, hence I prefer bots.
so by definition they do group content? you not very bright are you? I literally even said thats what happen with raiders, they were forced to do m+ because thats hands down the best way to get gear, doesnt mean they wanna do it but they do it anyway
Really agree with this. Torghast was a MASSIVE missed opportunity by blizz. I personally really liked visions from BFA, worked my way through getting the faceless one and felt great. It seemed like they wanted to make torghast an optional solo progression system, but what made it to live just made me so disappointed.
Sure. No interest in getting good is more like it. Maybe people are toxic to you because you walk around crying and complaining and anything you don’t do is easy as heck but the players are why you don’t do it. Nothing about the diff. Of said content. Cop out excuse buddy.
are you implying that everyone that wants solo content/progression is unable to do group content? because thats a kinda crazy lol
i’m not implying anything. read. he clearly said he will not do group content at all because of the people. and the finding people is the hardest thing about this game. come on, get out of here with that nonsense.