You dont know how to argue at all. Go to forum post which is not about arguing a point. Or go on youtube and read a guide on how to argue a point.
If you get challenged or proved wrong you cant just tell people to get lost and that they are wrong without proving any detail or just play the victim card.
I might be dealing with a kid here so i dont wanna be too harsh but you should try better.
No, you really donât. Because all you can do is throw vitriol at people instead of having a conversation. Donât come into a thread and immediately start with toxic crap and maybe someone might take you seriously.
I, on the other hand, donât indulge such things. Goodbye.
I made a statement too then you kept on. Donât play the victim card with me too. If you wanted to move on you couldâve just stopped typing.
Again no proof, and playing the victim. You get challenged and you cant respond but your opinions cant be changed so you go to i am being bullied and try to cut off the conversation. Next time just dont reply if you cant handle a argument or counter points
No, you made up a false narrative and tried to argue with it.
Literally no one here is playing victim. Try not to jump on nonsensical bandwagons. 
I told you to move on. Because your problem is nonexistent and one you made up in your head.
âMove on because your point is non existentâ - even though i provided no counter point or argument for it being nonexistent.
Lets just remember you are defending Cash shops in games which also cause the game design to be more centered around cash shops like i dont know⌠Expensive legendaries? Carries? etc.
No, itâs literally your narrative which is why plenty of people in this very thread are criticizing it. Youâre talking about âclickbaitâ titles when they donât even match what youâre arguing against. Youâre misinformed and incorrect.
Pay to win means you pay to have a benefit.
But be realistic, Joe Blow over here paying for extra gear or achievements, has ZERO effect on your gameplay. YOU are not inconvenienced by them getting into a better position or guild. The only content where there can be an argument for there being any kind of detriment or player effect is in pvp arena carries. To a lesser extent high keys because a bad player with good gear in a key will brick it pretty fast. But thats why you either work and form your own key push group or actually look at logs before you invite someone - again, painfully obvious when someone has bought their io.
AOTC is literally nothing. AOTC alone wont get you into a good guild, and if you have AOTC and get into a pug, but suck, youâl get kicked. It literally means nothing. If you have grey parses on normal, im not bringing you into my mythic group, end of story. So if you want to get more skill and practice, you work your way up through the ranks, learn to play your class. Thats what will secure you a spot in a heroic or mythic group.
I have no narrative. You jumped into a conversation that you clearly didnât read before tossing out nonsense and then kept on.
No Iâm not. There is no clickbait title here. Once again making things up.
Ok, so ill show you my experience.
I came back in BFA and i brought a carry with some gold for eternal palace. Using that achievement i was able to join any flex group (plus mplus carries for gear) i wanted with pretty average gear because at the time you needed to link achievements to get a invite. Using that one time carry i joined multiple flex groups and even cleared it multiple times on heroic. Without getting that carry i would of just been stuck doing mythic plus for ages.
So me buying gold and buying a carry gave me the benefit of being able to join more raids because of my gear i brought (ilvl) and the carry i brought (ahead of the curve). which made me better as without it i would not of been able to join those raids and i would of been stuck in mplus.
I understand that AOTC is nothing but this is my experience, like i am telling you i brought like a couple of wow tokens and all the mplus carries and heroic runs literally gave me a huge advantage in progression, gearing and being able to actually raid than if i didnt buy it. I Went from zero gear fresh boosted toon to raiding heroic in a week. Without any help other than buying wow gold. I took somebodies elses spot that worked way harder than me in all of those raids because i payed money.
I am not a bad player, i just knew it would take me months to get good gear and find a guild that i could slowly progress through the raid which i didnt have the time for and i wanted to get geared and a good guild before next patch, so buying the carries let me.
I just dont know how you can argue against that being pay to win.
Also if you think wow p2w is fine for the game, think about it for a second. If wow tokens make blizz a ton of money do you think they will release more content around gold\carries. Like i am talking more legendary or expensive items that get people to buy wow tokens or other systems\game design built around the shop? I just think its negative for the game overall even though it did help me back in bfa.
Are you dense? The clickbait content creator titles youâre referencing⌠you are saying they mirror OPâs argument. That is not the case.
Iâm not referencing a title. I referenced a video. But now I understand how you twist things and make stuff up.
Also: I was talking about threads on this forum IN GENERAL, not this specific one. Your reading comprehension needs some serious work.
I donât know what your issue is or why you decided to even make these nonsensical replies, but you seriously need to reread this thread and stop making crap up, because you have no clue what youâre talking about and made some ridiculous argument where none existed in the first place.
Letâs look back, shall we?
Thatâs it. Thatâs all that was said. There was no âproblemâ that needed a âsolution.â There was no one upset or bent out of shape. There was nothing but a statement in reply to someone else.
Thatâs it, thatâs all. Case closed. Goodbye.
Why do you care what people do with their money? Not everyone has time to farm gold. On the other end, you have people whoâd rather farm gold than pay real money for their sub. The gold comes from those players, itâs not generated out of thin air. You clearly donât understand how the tokens work.
Oh, and one last note in here for all of this insanity that happenedâŚ
Absolutely none of this happened.
Telling you not to start conversations with this toxic crap is not at all âplaying victimâ or âbeing bullied.â
Not how you being a conversation. 
You want to be treated like an adult at the adult table with the rest of us? Act like one.
That is me questioning your sanity or your copium level. Anybody defending mobile like MTX currency trading in video games either doesnt understand it, or wants the game to be milked out and die.
You replied multiple times with zero counter points with zero argument all because i called you out on a super hot take which gave me a headace reading that i couldnt believe somebody wrote. You still dont know how to argue and you are still arguing basically nothing in a conversation about whether wow is P2W and if its good for the game. Basically derailing the thread to be all about you.
as you would say, multiple times without reading, understanding or arguing a point.
I am right, Goodbye.
Look, I get it, for the -right- people, buying a carry can give you a boost, but really, if you couldnât play your role/class/spec, you would not have lasted in those groups.
Ive run heroic in lfr gear and parsed before, if you know how to play its not hard. Ive also geared fresh toons to heroic in a week or two without buying boosts. Again, its actually not hard, just requires effort and time.
Buying gear or runs has literally been in the game tho since the game launched. Removing tokens wont change that in the slightest. And Iâm not arguing that its not a form of pay to win, I am arguing that its not actually that much of a win. It might give you a foot in the door, but it literally wonât do more than that. But again, someone getting a boost, is not going to effect your gameplay. Boosts fund peoples game time, they fund raiding progression, guild repairs and activities etc. Without the token it just moves back to the old model where people buy gold from websites to buy a boost and the gold price for things will drop once the stockpile has been drained and it will just establish a new baseline. All the token does is make more gold available so the prices get inflated. less gold in the system means the price for boosts will lower but gold will be more valuable.
Legendary base prices for example are only as high as they are 1) because the way blizz designed the system they are a complete nightmare to even get the recipes and bloated material wise, so there are much fewer people who can even craft the base items than you would normally see in a expansion. and 2) because there is so much more gold in the system. So people know they can sell a base item for 500k the first few weeks of a new tier and people will buy it because they think that item level boost is going to make the difference. Truth is, unless your a top 1% CE raider pushing for world first, a handful of item levels will make zero difference to your performance.
What if I told you that videos have titles⌠mindblowing concept.
I think thatâs pretty hilarious. Youâre acting like you arenât trying push a narrative and when you are called out on something you do say (after youâve retorted to the argument) you fall back on this idea that âthis is crazyâ and âyou did nothing wrongâ. Linking your initial comment only proves the point⌠no one is disputing that comment. Itâs the subsequent comments after that in which people are referring to.
If you remove tokens, people will just buy from the gold farmers. If you play the game âcorrectlyâ and youâre decent enough at it, you can do all the content that the game has to offer. Donât worry about the idiot spending money to get gear every tier.
I needed to get carried so i could quickly get gear, mplus weekly caches and heroic gear\achievement., Without those things i would not of been able to raid or find mplus groups/raid groups quickly. This was purely months of progression skip.
It has been in the game since launch, however it was bannable so it was not legit.
My problem with pay to win. Is that blizzard will benefit from more systems that can be skipped if you buy gold. Just like the legendary system and other systems. I think just wait and see, i think Blizz will have more gold based things next patch with more progression\boring skippable chores for gold which will not be good for the game. Systems will be designed around people buying tokens and getting carried i have seen it before on other games. If wow tokens got removed from the game blizzard has no reason to put systems/chores that can be skippable if you buy gold.
This is my point. Legendaries are designed so you either have to do some boring chores or play all the time, or you just buy a wow token and skip all those weeks of hard work instantly. This is a perfect example of a new system that didnt exist before even though we had legendaries in Legion that was developed most likely in parallel with the wow token. Expect more of it.
This right here, is just it. Buying gold gave me a huge competitive advantage over people that deserved those raid spots more than me. I out progressed them because i have money and can pay to win as much as i want. I was able to learn PVE\Learn the new raid because i payed. I was able to arena and do competitive pvp because i brought Mplus\Heroic\Mythic gear. Which i wouldnt of been able to do without Months of grinding.
Which introduces all of the old issues we had before the token was a thing. No one wants that.