What would cause you to consider teldrassil repayed?

[Photius-dalaran]

This thread is pretty high on the fanwank scale.

However I’d love to see the Night Elves retake Hyjal and make that their homeland again like they had in WC3 prior to Archimond.

[Drahliana-earthen-ring (Drahliana)]

I would consider it “repayed” if we just did a bit of Bronze Dragonflight shenanigans to undo it. That’s the only thing that would square it for me.

The Bronze will let you visit an echo of the past, but they’ve got this thing about preserving timelines which won’t let them go any further… not that they have the power to do so any longer.

Age of Mortals, remembber?

[Finalchaotic-hyjal (Finalchaotic)]

The thing about it is, as the person you are replying to, feels that any “redeeming” qualities- is an Alliance only trait. This is why it’s easy to dismiss certain parts of lore that have said redeeming qualities and assert guilt by association. As someone who knows almost everything there is to know about Highborne/High elves (Us) lore, that’s not hard to see from his intent.

Nothing that i said is factually incorrect, i also expanded more about this on my own tread, you guys did summon a bunch of demons it was part of the course with experimenting with cosmic power, and like the suramaritans you realized they were bad news at the final stages of the war, in the meanwhile you keep indulging on your highborn tirades, after the war Dath’remar and the highborne that rebelled at the last moment were offered to stay with the rest of the elves, then he called Malfurion a coward for not wanting to use demon attracting magic, he made a storm to press his point and was exiled for his troubles, if something is not factually correct point it, also if you feel that way you are free to post about your own redeeming qualities so everybody knows.

Now, leaving the argument aside.
In character, as a night elf…
Im sick and tired of being called an arrogant elf BY THE HORDE and it wouldnt bother me too much because we arent… but what bothers me is that its YOU guys that are the arrogant elves, you and those high lipped nighborne, you guys were in the faction that had all the debauchery, inbreeding, magic and drug abuse in the time of the WoTA but i get called arrogant elf? Why?dont your allies know more about the origin of your faction and your ancestors? and we always get pinned with the “YOU GUYS CAUSED THE SUNDERING” but we didnt, EVERYONE that had hand in that mutated from night elf to any other type of…thing, being naga, a different elf, a half spider, undead spirit etc… you cant blame me for having certain animosity when i get accused of that when your faction started this demon summoning fiasco.

Nothing that i said is factually incorrect

Yes it was. And just so you know- Factually and Correct, mean the same thing. So you can’t use “Factually Incorrect” in a sentence. It’s an oxymoron.

were offered to stay with the rest of the elves

No they weren’t.

he called Malfurion a coward

No he didn’t.

for not wanting to use demon attracting magic

The same magic that the Kaldorei allowed BACK into their society through the Shen’dralar? That demon attracting magic? Oh.

also if you feel that way you are free to post about your own redeeming qualities so everybody knows.

What are you even talking about?

[Kollux-ragnaros]

Yes it was. And just so you know- Factually and Correct, mean the same thing. So you can’t use “Factually Incorrect” in a sentence. It’s an oxymoron.

Good to know.

No they weren’t.

No he didn’t.

Exile of the high elves, wow chronicles vol 1 page 117, they tried to assimilate on the rest of the kal’dorei culture but couldnt let the arcane magic, they were strictly forbidden on using such magic, dath remar called everyone that didnt accepted this a coward and was exiled, the druids woke up to stop this thing from happening.

The same magic that the Kaldorei allowed BACK into their society through the Shen’dralar? That demon attracting magic? Oh.

Thats a very recent event on cataclysm, the gig was already up everyone was practicing magic already at this time, the demons knew where azeroth was as demonstrated by the wc3 invasion, because the rest of azeroth was practicing magic anyways and the demons already knew where we are, they could use the power boost that meant having the shen’dalar back, i dont know why you are bringing them up dath’remar exile was 7300 years before the dark portal happened, thats also exactly why they setup the magic barrier so they could practice magic in peace.

What are you even talking about?

The thing about it is, as the person you are replying to, feels that any “redeeming” qualities- is an Alliance only trait.

If you are feeling that way you can expand on your own redeeming qualities as a blood elf i dont mind.

[Amadis-draka (Amadis)]

Factually and Correct, mean the same thing. So you can’t use “Factually Incorrect” in a sentence. It’s an oxymoron.

An oxymoron is using terms contradict one another. Factually incorrect is not an oxymoron, as “factually” is simply an adverb describing “incorrect” in relation to facts. It is, at most, redundant.

[Finalchaotic-hyjal (Finalchaotic)]

Factually and Correct, mean the same thing. So you can’t use “Factually Incorrect” in a sentence. It’s an oxymoron.

An oxymoron is using terms contradict one another. Factually incorrect is not an oxymoron, as “factually” is simply an adverb describing “incorrect” in relation to facts. It is, at most, redundant.

I guess it does depend from what stance/position that you use it.

If you are admitting that you are, in fact, incorrect- then Yes. You would be correct.
If you use a piece of knowledge that is incorrect, knowingly, while claiming it is factual- it is an Oxymoron.

[Feldaran-emerald-dream (Feldaran)]

Colorado Springs is on Mars, so anyone in Colorado Springs is also on Mars.

^^^ A factually incorrect claim.

Colorado Springs is in Colorado, so anyone in Colorado is also in Colorado Springs.

^^^A logically incorrect claim.

Undead should be purged from existence purely on the basis of their condition.

^^^A morally incorrect disgusting claim.

[Finalchaotic-hyjal (Finalchaotic)]

Colorado Springs is on Mars, so anyone in Colorado Springs is also on Mars.

^^^ A factually incorrect claim.

Colorado Springs is in Colorado, so anyone in Colorado is also in Colorado Springs.

^^^A logically incorrect claim.

I guess it does depend from what stance/position that you use it.

Your welcome.

[Roghter-ghostlands (Roghter)]

It’s already been repaid. You just need time to accept that in this game a destroyed Alliance Capital and a destroyed Horde Capital have the same objective value, and that a mass of nameless soldiers have no objective value.

[Amadis-draka (Amadis)]

@Roghter-ghostlands

It’s already been repaid.

Apparently not, story wise, any way.

Saurfang: I did not expect the Alliance to be here.
Shaw: Not the first time we've had to move against a corrupt warchief.
Saurfang: Or a sovereign king. Slain in his own home.
Shaw: A home that still stands. Can you say the same for Teldrassil?


Jaina: There must be vengeance for Teldrassil. But if Azshara is not stopped, she will unleash her master upon the world.

Baine War Campaign and Player Choice in Patch 8.2 - Broadcast Text (Spoilers)

[Roghter-ghostlands (Roghter)]

Apparently not, story wise, any way.

You have cleverly established that, story wise, Jaina has an opinion.

Edit:

And to be fair, that at least someone on the Blizzard writing staff believes the concept of vengeance for Teldrassil is a valid story hook, otherwise they wouldn’t have put the words in the mouth of a main character. As much as I want to dismiss what Jaina said as being just Jaina… that’s too simple.

However, since the topic is now about story, I have to explain that Blizzard doesn’t seem ‘story’ as a chain of reciprocal measures or even an attempt at ‘fairness.’ If they want to encourage, and more specifically, make use of “Vengeance for Teldrassil” as a plot point. It will be as a tool to build enthusiasm for future content, not as a salve for wounded players. I expect the Blizzard narrative staff will believe that Teldrassil has been ‘repaid’ once they see no further benefit from fanning that flame. Probably once Sylvanas is out of the picture, either this expansion or next.

[Drahliana-earthen-ring (Drahliana)]

There is no nation of people, in fiction or reality, that would not strip rights from a single individual to save their entire people. To pretend otherwise is absurd.

Actually scapegoating a particular minority is pretty much standard practice for a strongman’s rise to power. That minority will be portrayed as a cultural and economic threat.

It’s a song that gets played on Fascist banjos all the time.

[Amadis-draka (Amadis)]

I expect the Blizzard narrative staff will believe that Teldrassil has been ‘repaid’ once they see no further benefit from fanning that flame. Probably once Sylvanas is out of the picture, either this expansion or next.

I also see this as probably their mindset, yes.

[Lanastrin-proudmoore]

The end of Sylvanas Windrunner and GIVING darkshore back to the kaldorei. We had no right to take it in the first place.

[Lanastrin-proudmoore]

oops necro. Im not a death knight. Forgive me!

[Raelän-wyrmrest-accord]

We had no right to take it in the first place.

Might makes right.

[Raizen-zuljin]

We had no right to take it in the first place.

As you post this in a country that only exists through the domination and forced relocation amongst other things of the previous occupants.

[Droité-tanaris (Droité)]

I would consider it “repayed” if we just did a bit of Bronze Dragonflight shenanigans to undo it. That’s the only thing that would square it for me.

The Bronze will let you visit an echo of the past, but they’ve got this thing about preserving timelines which won’t let them go any further… not that they have the power to do so any longer.

Age of Mortals, remembber?

Well, there is an argument to be made that the Bronze are unlikely to intervene in such a way; but they also COULD intervene in A way. They seemed to wave away the evacuation of the AU Mag’har as something that was GOING to happen, so they simply facilitated it happening (and I remind you that includes the bringing back absurdly invasive species like the Botani onto Kalimdor). It is to this extent they may facilitate something happening for the NEs as well.

The Bronze seem to be of the mind that the Age of Mortals was bound to come eventually; and they ascribe to this themselves. The Dragons own inability to naturally reproduce is likely merely ANOTHER nail in the coffin of them either having to find a way to move on their species as Mortals (Wrathion’s story will likely tie into this in some way) … or go extinct as a shadow of their immortal selves. What way that wind blows, only the Bronze dragonflight would know.

EDIT: For example (and know this is an uncomfortable topic) they do have TWO vials of the original WoE still in their possession. Aviana ALSO has been hard at work repairing the Mother Tree (so I would hope something would come from that story thread as well). Who knows, maybe the Bronze and Aviana will be the key to creating not just a genuine SIBLING tree of Nordrassil; but one supported by the Magic of a TWO Vial WoE (something we have yet to see created)?

[Larrskies-dathremar]

Honestly yes, because the Tauren are a relatively peaceful people; but lets be honest their storyline ark as a people has been weak for a while. This would also spin the ball to get things rolling a bit too.

If this were to happen, and the Tauren actually humbled the Night Elves and helped them regardless; then atleast something between those two people could be established. As for the rest of the various races; I guess that’s something that’s going to have to be developed.

No, stop, please! Anything but Org!

leaves back door open

I agree when people say Org is cursed with the ugly.

Honestly, if Thunderbluff got somehow decimated from its current form, the Tauren becoming exposed to their enemies on all sides; and Orgrimmar got decimated / refurbished afterwards (I’m talking bout serious damage) with all jungley (The Gorgrond kind) stuff - get some green in there (Now for you Orcs, just to clarify I wasn’t talking about Fel-Demon blood) I honestly wouldn’t mind. Or even if there was an elemental cataclysm there; and there was fire, earth, wind, waters and spirits flowing all in conjunction around the place.

Even then if the Alliance were still angry: fair enough.
I wouldn’t expect them to say “Oh, it’s okay.” after homes & families are lost because there’s always going to be the distrust and that’d be present in both sides: But at the very least the scales would feel a bit more ‘Morally Grey’. lol

But if Pheandra comes along on this thread; even that wouldn’t appeal her. She wants to wipe out most of the Horde’s races and have every single one of their cities nuked - and have the Alliance’s boot on their throat; humiliating them completely & utterly - Then force them to say “I. Am. Evil.” - refusal is death. Because any good or slightly intriguing storyline for the Horde is ‘Too sympathetic’ or kind for them. She considers that demented ideal ‘Balanced & even’.

[Pheandra-emerald-dream]

have the Alliance’s boot on their throat

I just want that.
The rest could be or could not be there.

Ultimately I want the Horde on its knees just as we were on our knees. Eye for an eye.
But apparently this is sacrilegious.